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  • I thought they spent like $90M on her not that long ago?
    RIP Charles "Bob" Spence. 1936-2014.

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    • Yeah, $81 million today but ten years from now it could be $130 million.

      They can go to the Dept. of Defense and say there is a shared responsibility here? Really? Then there are three other CV museums that might feel the same not to mention BB museums. I think that idea is a pipe dream and a can of worms.

      Maybe if they had thought things through 25 years ago and not stuck her in mud. Now 26 feet deep in mud. That is unbelievable and scary at the same time. Oh well, many who run these museums turn out to be idiots over time who have no clue the time, work and money actually involved. Delayed care bites you in the ass every time. What they really need to do is get out of their office and walk the ship. I can't recall the last time anyone in my admin took a good close walk in the Island of the Hornet with open eyes. They would be surprised to see the bad steel I am now cutting out of the ship.

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      • What would the DoD do? These ships are far from being assets to them. I see this but on a smaller yet comparable scale at work. People will come in saying their deck is in bad shape and they can't believe the stain they put on there 10-12 years ago didn't hold up (really??). Then what do they do? Another coat of solid stain, something that might give them 4 years of coverage and they'll wait 10 more years and complain when they don't have the money to redo their deck. Idgits.

        You'd think they would just take a portion of the profits every year, no matter how small, and put it in a savings account for something that is 100% inevitable so when the time comes they'll have a good chunk of it. Instead I'm sure they just spend it on crap.

        As always my metaphorical hat is off to you tbm and anyone like you (Rusty, Slater Doc, qaz etc) that actually gives a damn and can help curb that as much as possible.
        RIP Charles "Bob" Spence. 1936-2014.

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        • For the price of properly patching up the Yorktown, they should have looked at acquiring one the conventional super carriers as a replacement.

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          • If they can't do the upkeep on a 40K ton Essex I don't think they could handle a ship double the size.
            RIP Charles "Bob" Spence. 1936-2014.

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            • When the Intrepid got stuck in the mud didn't the Navy assist them in moving her?

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              • "On 11 November 2006, the United States Navy announced that it would spend $3*million to dredge the mud and silt from under*Intrepid. The effort was led by the United States Navy Supervisor of Salvage and Diving with assistance from the United States Army Corps of Engineers, United States Coast Guard, and contractors. The teams operated for three weeks to clear the site of mud and silt."

                This is from wiki. I don't see the Navy doing that right now.
                RIP Charles "Bob" Spence. 1936-2014.

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                • Originally posted by 85 gt kid View Post
                  If they can't do the upkeep on a 40K ton Essex I don't think they could handle a ship double the size.
                  Exactly, just swap out a replacement ship every 40 years. Apparently, they considered and treated Yorktown as a disposable commodity.

                  Just transfer the aircraft off, from one deck to another.
                  Last edited by surfgun; 13 Sep 15,, 00:26.

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                  • I'm not very knowledgeable about how museum ships are run but from what I've read and the one measly day I helped on the Wisconsin makes me think that allot more can be done for these ships then is let on. I'm not saying they'll be able to fully fund each 20 year dry dock based on proceeds alone but they could do better. I can only imagine what needless stuff they get that could be chopped. Or stuff that wouldn't cost them much more initially and would save a TON in the long run isn't done (NC not being in the mud is one). Another is lack of volunteers that I think is partially their fault (Slater crew withstanding!). As I've seen with Tbm who is great at what he does and was treated badly that's not good for the ships or the people that try and run them. Sheesh sounds a lot like companies are...
                    RIP Charles "Bob" Spence. 1936-2014.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by 85 gt kid View Post
                      I'm not very knowledgeable about how museum ships are run but from what I've read and the one measly day I helped on the Wisconsin makes me think that allot more can be done for these ships then is let on. I'm not saying they'll be able to fully fund each 20 year dry dock based on proceeds alone but they could do better. I can only imagine what needless stuff they get that could be chopped. Or stuff that wouldn't cost them much more initially and would save a TON in the long run isn't done (NC not being in the mud is one). Another is lack of volunteers that I think is partially their fault (Slater crew withstanding!). As I've seen with Tbm who is great at what he does and was treated badly that's not good for the ships or the people that try and run them. Sheesh sounds a lot like companies are...
                      My problem has always been with the Docents except for the Wednesday guys who see me all the time for 16 years. They understand what I do and how to do their job. A Docent has two jobs in my book and that is as tour guide and security. So when the kid is playing with switches right in front of your nose you tell him to stop. You don't have me running up or down two decks, because I can hear it, and tell the kid to knock it off. Then the Docent asks what the problem was? Idiot.

                      They also need to protect the ship from the elements. I don't like having Nav Bridge and Flag Bridge windows open overnight or more so for five days. My Wednesday guys know to close them if they open them. That way I don't have to chase down a bird inside and kill it to get it out. Early this year I came down and saw 12 windows open on Monday holiday and probably started on Saturday. The Saturday docents are the worst with an attitude. Must have all been officers and now they have to listen to me. Ever see a 12 person capacity Pri-Fly jammed with 33 people? Stupidity.

                      So I get up to the flight deck and see a docent and mention that it might be nice to make sure they are closed. Of course I have said this for 16 years. He says that he doesn't open them ergo it is not his problem. Boom! I head up, get out my tools, and promptly jam all the latches on every single one of them. Now it is summer and during our heat waves it can get to be a toasty 85-90 inside the Bridge. Oh well, they were warned.

                      Two weeks ago we had a big clean up and admin, docent council and our head restoration guy got together to discuss it. The first two are talking about how the entire hanger deck can get power washed, cleaned, and painted in 8 days. ??????? Bob, goes excuse me but you will be lucky to get Hanger 1 done on 8 days. Of course, he was right as I was down there for two of them. Ironically, a now docent, who retired as COO three years ago and always wanted me off the ship because I was a PIA about taking care of the ship is being all friendly. While we are cleaning, and he is actually painting, comes over and says Mike have you ever seen all our raccoon tracks? I'm like ooook and aren't you the guy....

                      On the bright side our weather is mild and the Hornet sits floating in water with five clear feet under it and is in way better condition that Lexington, Yorktown, Intrepid and possibly Midway.

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                      • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                        My problem has always been with the Docents except for the Wednesday guys who see me all the time for 16 years. They understand what I do and how to do their job. A Docent has two jobs in my book and that is as tour guide and security. So when the kid is playing with switches right in front of your nose you tell him to stop. You don't have me running up or down two decks, because I can hear it, and tell the kid to knock it off. Then the Docent asks what the problem was? Idiot.

                        They also need to protect the ship from the elements. I don't like having Nav Bridge and Flag Bridge windows open overnight or more so for five days. My Wednesday guys know to close them if they open them. That way I don't have to chase down a bird inside and kill it to get it out. Early this year I came down and saw 12 windows open on Monday holiday and probably started on Saturday. The Saturday docents are the worst with an attitude. Must have all been officers and now they have to listen to me. Ever see a 12 person capacity Pri-Fly jammed with 33 people? Stupidity.

                        So I get up to the flight deck and see a docent and mention that it might be nice to make sure they are closed. Of course I have said this for 16 years. He says that he doesn't open them ergo it is not his problem. Boom! I head up, get out my tools, and promptly jam all the latches on every single one of them. Now it is summer and during our heat waves it can get to be a toasty 85-90 inside the Bridge. Oh well, they were warned.

                        Two weeks ago we had a big clean up and admin, docent council and our head restoration guy got together to discuss it. The first two are talking about how the entire hanger deck can get power washed, cleaned, and painted in 8 days. ??????? Bob, goes excuse me but you will be lucky to get Hanger 1 done on 8 days. Of course, he was right as I was down there for two of them. Ironically, a now docent, who retired as COO three years ago and always wanted me off the ship because I was a PIA about taking care of the ship is being all friendly. While we are cleaning, and he is actually painting, comes over and says Mike have you ever seen all our raccoon tracks? I'm like ooook and aren't you the guy....

                        On the bright side our weather is mild and the Hornet sits floating in water with five clear feet under it and is in way better condition that Lexington, Yorktown, Intrepid and possibly Midway.

                        Ah yes. The Docents. Fortunately on the Iowa we keep them pretty well informed. We stress safety at all times. I've given lectures on safety as well as where all of the armor is above main deck so the docents and tour guides can point it out to the visitors. Of course I know where all that "fragmentation protection" (as NAVSEA calls it) is because I personally designed it.

                        But, Murphy's laws will still nose their way in and there was one person who was told to leave the ship and never come back. The next day I went down to the ship solely to congratulate our two top officers that had to make that decision. I've had to do it myself and know how hard it can be and how much time it takes beforehand to have enough evidence and reports authenticated to require the dismisal.
                        Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

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                        • Good leadership would straighten and/or weed out the bad eggs. Of course this still goes to how pretty much every company is nowadays and don't care about employee attitudes (just go to Wal-Mart).
                          RIP Charles "Bob" Spence. 1936-2014.

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                          • Originally posted by RustyBattleship View Post
                            Ah yes. The Docents. Fortunately on the Iowa we keep them pretty well informed. We stress safety at all times. I've given lectures on safety as well as where all of the armor is above main deck so the docents and tour guides can point it out to the visitors. Of course I know where all that "fragmentation protection" (as NAVSEA calls it) is because I personally designed it.

                            But, Murphy's laws will still nose their way in and there was one person who was told to leave the ship and never come back. The next day I went down to the ship solely to congratulate our two top officers that had to make that decision. I've had to do it myself and know how hard it can be and how much time it takes beforehand to have enough evidence and reports authenticated to require the dismisal.
                            Over our 16 years we have probably had four dozen people told not to come back. From docents, to security, to ship's crew let go, to ship and plane restoration volunteers. Since they are not paid, and simply volunteers, they are called in and told we no longer need them on board and that's it quick and simple.

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                            • http://www.patriotledger.com/news/20...ips-owner-says

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                              • Shouldn't be hard to find this Spring if the story is correct?

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