Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

China Navy update.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • China Navy update.

    Three years ago, the China Navy (The Navy formally known as the PLAN) created a new naval district in Fujiang, named Xiamen Naval District (unit number 92674). it's AOE is the entire coastline of Fujian province, including the disrupted areas. it is to act as the backup for the Chinese Coast Guard whom is to serve as the first line of patrol in the East China Sea.

    Given the fact that Naval District by its very definition meant for "near sea" operations, it's three squadron is filled with second line units (Jianghus, Hainans and Shanghais). They are not meant for fire fights.

    3rd FFG Sqd (unit number 92054, 5xJiangHus)
    83rd Subchaser sqd (unit number 91927, 1x056, 5xHainans)
    29th Patrol squadron (unit number 92119, 12xShanghais)


    Those five Jianghus are hand-me-downs from the 2nd DDG flotilla and the 9th DDG flotilla. The transfer took place in Nov 2011.

    Picture of Xiamen Naval District's HQ
    Attached Files
    “the misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all” -- Joan Robinson

  • #2
    29th Patrol squadron's Shanghai's
    Attached Files
    “the misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all” -- Joan Robinson

    Comment


    • #3
      3rd FFG Sqd

      3rd FFG Sqd's Jianghus, pictures taken from a Navy news report (navy.81.cn) published on Dec 7th.
      Attached Files
      “the misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all” -- Joan Robinson

      Comment


      • #4
        Andy,

        Do you know if FFG sqdrns operate independently with their own command structure or is it a more ad hoc system tied in with the naval district. My guess is that they're division deputy grade units, perhaps regiment grade, but I don't know that much about frigate squadrons. It seems like the front line squadrons under flotillas have increasingly just been integrated into the flotillas.

        Comment


        • #5
          All PLAN sqd has their own small logistic support elements such as tug boats, small tankers, small troops trans etc (sub flotillas have their own torpedo retrievers)

          2nd line units operates under the command of the Naval District (ND), front line units from their flotilla command. That being said, in time of exercise or deployment, it is the Naval HQ that runs the show. The ND and to some extend the fleet is for admin purpose, not for war fighting. Much has changed since the 1990s.

          2nd line FFG SQD (Jianghu and Jiangwei) are deputy regiment grade
          Line FFG SQD (Jianghkai and Luda) are full regiment grade.

          Naval Districts are division grade
          “the misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all” -- Joan Robinson

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by xinhui View Post
            All PLAN sqd has their own small logistic support elements such as tug boats, small tankers, small troops trans etc (sub flotillas have their own torpedo retrievers)

            2nd line units operates under the command of the Naval District (ND), front line units from their flotilla command. That being said, in time of exercise or deployment, it is the Naval HQ that runs the show. The ND and to some extend the fleet is for admin purpose, not for war fighting. Much has changed since the 1990s.

            2nd line FFG SQD (Jianghu and Jiangwei) are deputy regiment grade
            Line FFG SQD (Jianghkai and Luda) are full regiment grade.

            Naval Districts are division grade
            Flotillas don't report to Fleet HQ operationally for war fighting purposes? I can't imagine all front line division and higher grade units reporting directly to PLAN HQ and vice-versa for C&C.

            So line FFG sqdrns with Jiangkai FFGs are still independent units but subordinate to their respective flotilla? How does that work? You have a sqdrn CDR reporting to the flotilla CDR/DCDR?

            I've long suspected Ludas were downgraded, but have they actually been subordinated to FFG sqdrns? As I recall, the 1st and 10th DD flotillas are still comprised of Ludas as their main surface combatant. 6th getting theirs replaced by Luyang IIs but I think they still have one or two. My guess was that the older Ludas were downgraded and are slowly being decommissioned/reassigned to MLE/Coast Guard.

            Re Naval Districts, any idea why there's still indications that Shanghai, despite having been downgraded to a naval district (i.e. division grade), still appears to be a corps deputy billet as recently as this year?
            Last edited by ace16807; 24 Dec 13,, 00:47.

            Comment


            • #7
              ace16807,

              I don't run the China Navy therefore I can not tell you their decision making process. What I can tell you is what they are doing in terms of orbat reform or what to do with their old Ludas. As for operational control of their boats, if you review their ocean-going training and exercise during the previous few years, you have your answer on the composition of their task force. (it is all open source) ONI's Augest 2009's "A modern Navy with Chinese Characteristics" also has the command and control information you seek.

              As for the 1st DDG Flotilla (Unit number 92132) Qingdao-Jiaonan, it has the following orbat:
              2xType 052 (DDG 112, DDG 113) 2xType 051C (DDG 115 and DDG116), 4xType 054A (FFG538, FFG546, FFG547, FFG550), and 1xType 053H2 (FFG537). There is no Luda there, not sure which report you are referring to.

              6th DDG Flotilla (Unit number 91991) has two Ludas (133 and 134) that is correct.
              “the misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all” -- Joan Robinson

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by xinhui View Post
                ace16807,

                I don't run the China Navy therefore I can not tell you their decision making process. What I can tell you is what they are doing in terms of orbat reform or what to do with their old Ludas. As for operational control of their boats, if you review their ocean-going training and exercise during the previous few years, you have your answer on the composition of their task force. (it is all open source) ONI's Augest 2009's "A modern Navy with Chinese Characteristics" also has the command and control information you seek.

                As for the 1st DDG Flotilla (Unit number 92132) Qingdao-Jiaonan, it has the following orbat:
                2xType 052 (DDG 112, DDG 113) 2xType 051C (DDG 115 and DDG116), 4xType 054A (FFG538, FFG546, FFG547, FFG550), and 1xType 053H2 (FFG537). There is no Luda there, not sure which report you are referring to.

                6th DDG Flotilla (Unit number 91991) has two Ludas (133 and 134) that is correct.
                Sorry, I meant NSF 10th, ESF 6th and SSF 2nd still having Ludas. So are the Ludas that are being replaced going into FFG sqdrns or retired out of the navy? I was under the impression that 1st line FFG sqdrns either essentially operated as part of a flotilla and the sqdrn element was purely administrative and are entirely comprised of Jiangkais. (are sqdrns "daduis"? Using the Chinese terminology would clarify greatly).

                Re operational control, in the event of war, I don't know to what extent task forces will be used as opposed to pre-existing 1st level zhiduis. My understanding is that these zhiduis report directly to fleet HQ operationally. Daduis in turn report to their respective zhiduis or in the case of 2nd level ones, to their respective naval district who in turn reports to fleet HQ.

                Comment

                Working...
                X