Originally posted by Mihais
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Iowa grants gun permits to the blind.
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A few things here. Take my son for instance. He has gotten safety training for years as he grows up so I know darn good and well where his level of safety is. Sure he could have learned everything in a couple of days but such safety needs to be ingrained and reinforced to the point where you do everything safely without thinking about it. Otherwise you get people cleaning loaded guns and whatnot.
I would say 95% of the guns bought in the U.S. are bought to be used. The other 5% are for collectors and as an investment. The owners of the 95% , nearly all will practice at first but then taper off as the newness wears off. There are others that will not only practice regularly but take additional training classes as well. Those are the minority. As we well know every potential defensive shooting scenario plays out differently. More training is always better but there are plenty of cases where a bare minimum of training was all that was needed. The psychological aspect is the wildcard. Some people filled with bravado drop their guns and run while some sweet little old ladies turn into Bonny Parker when defending themselves and their loved ones. You never know until you are forced to deal with such an event. The best you can hope for is the training you had takes over and you survive the encounter.Removing a single turd from the cesspool doesn't make any difference.
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I think the worry is that the "untrained" civilian will accidently hit an innocent bystander, and this fear is doubled when adding the person being "blind".
The fault lies in the attacker, not the defender. Taking a shot in a crowded environment is not a good situation, but if it means my life or my child's life, so be it.
Accidents happen, and it seems when these accidents occur by "well trained officers" it is taken as simply an accident, but when it is a civilian, it is caused by the lack of training."Bother", said Poo, chambering another round.
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Originally posted by tuna View PostI think the worry is that the "untrained" civilian will accidently hit an innocent bystander, and this fear is doubled when adding the person being "blind".
The fault lies in the attacker, not the defender. Taking a shot in a crowded environment is not a good situation, but if it means my life or my child's life, so be it.
Accidents happen, and it seems when these accidents occur by "well trained officers" it is taken as simply an accident, but when it is a civilian, it is caused by the lack of training.
The bias against civilians is connected to the crusade against guns.Anyone with half a brain and a modicum of training understands the imperatives of such moments.But it takes bad faith to criticize for the sake of criticising.Those who know don't speak
He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
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It would I think be unreasonable to expect a civilian purchaser of auto or semi automatic rifles in the US to be trained to the standards of military or police units that deploy such weapons tactically on a regular basis. (A good idea perhaps but still unrealistic.) And I agree 100% that there are no good options when it comes to dealing with violent armed confrontations in crowed public places having made the same point myself on a number of occasions.
I stand by the assertion however that anyone purchasing a firearm has a moral obligation to store and use it responsibly. Undertaking a basic level of training so that you can strip, clean, assemble, load, action and aim the weapon safely and with a basic level of competence is part of that responsibility.Last edited by Monash; 19 Oct 13,, 02:00.If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.
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Originally posted by Mihais View PostDude,a whole week? If there is one dumb enough to need a week,he won't survive it and the last thing I'd give him is a firearm,because I like myself quite a bit .If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.
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Originally posted by tuna View PostI think the worry is that the "untrained" civilian will accidently hit an innocent bystander, and this fear is doubled when adding the person being "blind".
The fault lies in the attacker, not the defender. Taking a shot in a crowded environment is not a good situation, but if it means my life or my child's life, so be it.
Accidents happen, and it seems when these accidents occur by "well trained officers" it is taken as simply an accident, but when it is a civilian, it is caused by the lack of training.Removing a single turd from the cesspool doesn't make any difference.
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Originally posted by Monash View PostI stand by the assertion however that anyone purchasing a firearm has a moral obligation to store and use it responsibly. Undertaking a basic level of training so that you can strip, clean, assemble, load, action and aim the weapon safely and with a basic level of competence is part of that responsibility."Bother", said Poo, chambering another round.
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Originally posted by tuna View PostI'll agree to that - that sounds like....oh yeah! Common sense. ;)Removing a single turd from the cesspool doesn't make any difference.
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Originally posted by bonehead View PostIf you shoot into a crowd (at an attacker) and hit a bystander, you can bet the farm you will have to explain your actions to a judge and jury. If not a criminal court then a civil. They will be placing the blame at your feet and not blame the criminal for YOUR actions.
As for me - I'm in Massachusetts, so yeah - you're right. But then again, my definition of a good shoot is, can I go to sleep at night knowing what I did? I'll go to prison to protect my kids - no problem. I'll feel sorry for missing my target but if it saves my kid then I'm ok with it. What comes into play is - are you willing to go to jail to protect someone else, or take the attitude that they should have armed themselves?"Bother", said Poo, chambering another round.
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Originally posted by Monash View PostAnd therein lies the problem, in all probability you wont be giving him or her a firearm they will be going out and buying it themselves! Regardless of how hopeless you might think they are!
In general,I'd take American extremes allowing more weapons to everybody elses extremes in restricting them.In the end,how many 100 percent blind people will buy an M60 and start shooting at a mall?Omar Abdul Rahman excepted,of course But having to go through Caudine Forks to be able to collect a gun or go to a range and shoot some paper.God forbid,saving lives with it.This sort of BS laws affects a much larger number of people.For the worse.Those who know don't speak
He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
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Originally posted by bonehead View PostThere are a lot of people driving around in 3000# death machines and they scarcely know how to put gas in it. They couldn't change a tire to save their lives and would be hard pressed to find the radiator if you opened the hood for them. Oddly they do just fine.If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.
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Originally posted by Monash View PostYe're but all but the most retarded can put gas in the tank and check the oil, water and tire pressure. And some of them shouldn't be allowed on the streets with anything more powerful than a bicycle but what can yo do?No such thing as a good tax - Churchill
To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.
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