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  • #46
    Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
    Sorry to confuse the issue I meant in 1971 when the agreement was signed betweeen Pakistani Prime Minister, Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, and the then Indian Prime Minister, Mrs Indira Gandhi.
    The terrorists did not exist back then. They are a product of the 80's. The ISI was neck deep in arming and training Afghan mujahideen and they tried to do the same thing in Kashmir. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

    An obvious answer to that is look at what is and has happened to the Pakistani people from the extremeists and their governments failure to eradicate them.

    You have India, the US and others fighting them within their country to eradicate them. Then they turn around and car bomb, bomb and murder the Pakistanis on a daily basis.

    And yet there are no doubt still ties while all of this goes on.

    Its just amazing that country has not gone into full blown civil war.
    Ah, but there are "good" and "bad" terrorists. The good ones attack India and are to be supported. The bad ones attack pakistan. You have heard this in another context.
    Last edited by Firestorm; 11 Oct 13,, 22:23.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Tronic View Post
      Atleast drop that...

      You have yet to show me these "low quality rifles"...
      Posted on Page 1-

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      • #48
        Would be Good If the accusation Are done by Foriegn ministry or anyone from the govt And not armed forces.But may be in India the armed forces officials are occasional govt officials aswell

        Concerned over LoC violations, Kayani proposes impartial UN investigations – The Express Tribune



        RAWALPINDI: Chief of Army Staff General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani said on Friday that the accusations made by the Indian military against Pakistan Army were unfortunate, unfounded and provocative, and that Pakistan’s restraint should not be exploited for levelling baseless allegations that harm prospects of peace.


        According to a press release issued by Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR), the comments of the Indian Army Chief alleging that Pakistan Army and Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) supported a recent militant insurgency in Keran sector of Indian administered Kashmir, were described by Kayani as unfortunate, unfounded and provocative.

        The army chief said that he was concerned about the continued violations along the Line of Control from across the border. He proposed that India should reciprocate Pakistan’s suggestion of holding either a joint or an impartial investigation, preferably by the United Nations, into the LoC incidents.


        “Pakistan Army was exercising restraint but the same should in no way be used as a pretext for leveling such baseless allegations that vitiate prospects of regional peace.”

        Addressing a group of officers at General Headquarters, the COAS reiterated that the Pakistan Army was fully supportive of the peace process initiated by the government.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by antimony View Post
          Let me get one thing clear. Are you saying no infiltration has occurred (mujahideen or otherwise) from the Pakistani side into the LOC side?
          I am saying that there is no evidence that the Pakistani Army is involved in orchestrating these infiltration attempts - the Indian Express article however goes further and raises questions/doubts about the entire IA narrative of the alleged incident.
          Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic state to be ruled by priests with a divine mission - Jinnah
          https://twitter.com/AgnosticMuslim

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
            Its just amazing that country has not gone into full blown civil war.
            A civil war generally requires two or more major factions (with serious ethnic, sectarian, ideological differences) in a country to engage in conflict - the TTP/AQ/Baloch terrorism in Pakistan is violence by small to medium loosely affiliated criminal enterprises. None of them, individually, are representative of any broad section of the population. In addition, as Farhan pointed out, and I argued with 1980s, the majority of Pakistanis have a strong 'Pakistani' identity.
            Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic state to be ruled by priests with a divine mission - Jinnah
            https://twitter.com/AgnosticMuslim

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            • #51
              Originally posted by farhan_9909 View Post
              Posted on Page 1-
              Assertions proved to be utter crap... You're the only one here who can claim to identify the make of those rifles from those pics.. It's absurd.
              Cow is the only animal that not only inhales oxygen, but also exhales it.
              -Rekha Arya, Former Minister of Animal Husbandry

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View Post
                I am saying that there is no evidence that the Pakistani Army is involved in orchestrating these infiltration attempts - the Indian Express article however goes further and raises questions/doubts about the entire IA narrative of the alleged incident.
                Stop twisting my question around. I did not ask about the PA. I asked a simple question. Do you think these infiltrators have come from the Pakistani side or not?
                "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" ~ Epicurus

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by antimony View Post
                  Do you think these infiltrators have come from the Pakistani side or not?
                  I don't know - all we have are the IA's claims regarding the alleged infiltration attempts so far.
                  Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic state to be ruled by priests with a divine mission - Jinnah
                  https://twitter.com/AgnosticMuslim

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by antimony View Post
                    Stop twisting my question around. I did not ask about the PA. I asked a simple question. Do you think these infiltrators have come from the Pakistani side or not?
                    Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View Post
                    I don't know - all we have are the IA's claims regarding the alleged infiltration attempts so far.
                    Even a small kid will know the Answer who is the Infiltrators ..Where does they get Bullet Proof Jackets , where did they get these much of Ammo's

                    I can say these are all Pakistani Forces try to inflitrate and kill Top Indian Military leaders such as last time they kill a key Colonel in our side but this time their mission failed and stamped as a Terrorists Jumped from the Sky ..
                    sajeevpearlj.blogspot.com

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View Post
                      I don't know - all we have are the IA's claims regarding the alleged infiltration attempts so far.
                      So basically nothing is happening at the LOC. The ceasefire is intact. Is that it?
                      "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" ~ Epicurus

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Tronic View Post
                        Assertions proved to be utter crap... You're the only one here who can claim to identify the make of those rifles from those pics.. It's absurd.
                        Becuase your media has shown pics of Ak-74U which are striking similar with the darra made.

                        Possibly may be they had put the older pics or even wrong pics for a possible blame game

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                        • #57
                          This is a pic of the AKS-74u

                          http://world.guns.ru/userfiles/_thum...s03/aks74u.jpg

                          Made by Kalashnikov, a well known and respectable arms manufacturer. It's not a firearm I would use pass 50 yards but I would have no hesitations to rely on it.

                          So, advise me. Why is the AKS-74u are poor and unreliable design?

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                            This is a pic of the AKS-74u

                            http://world.guns.ru/userfiles/_thum...s03/aks74u.jpg

                            Made by Kalashnikov, a well known and respectable arms manufacturer. It's not a firearm I would use pass 50 yards but I would have no hesitations to rely on it.

                            So, advise me. Why is the AKS-74u are poor and unreliable design?
                            Made by the Original manufacturer or by any Other Big firm will have different quality than the other made in Darra adam khel markets

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                            • #59
                              So,by pics alone, you can tell that these were made in Pakistani village markets?

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                                So,by pics alone, you can tell that these were made in Pakistani village markets?
                                very much.as in the pics i posted in the first page.

                                Though the IA to the media has only officially Shown Ak 47..they are confused about ak-47 and ak74u.

                                Pakistan might even handover them Indian made INSAS but if Pak officially was involved in this.

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