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US set to bag $5 bn defence deals from India

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  • #16
    Originally posted by lemontree View Post
    Please elaborate. The C-130Js increase our strategic airlift capability....What can't you understand about it's use in war?
    My guess would be he means those planes will be very hard to be used against US interests wrt PRC or Pakistan.
    No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

    To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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    • #17
      Tata has come up with a seemingly beautiful gun last year. The design seems good. Here's a picture - Tatas display Indian Bofors
      sigpicAnd on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Doktor View Post
        My guess would be he means those planes will be very hard to be used against US interests wrt PRC or Pakistan.
        That is a baseless assumption.

        Cheers!...on the rocks!!

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Doktor View Post
          My guess would be he means those planes will be very hard to be used against US interests wrt PRC or Pakistan.
          Nobody has attempted to enforce conditional use of their platforms since the mid 70's.

          In fact the last time someone tried that with Australia we changed our preferred vendor for purchasing fighter aircraft once that platforms utility expired.... :)
          Linkeden:
          http://au.linkedin.com/pub/gary-fairlie/1/28a/2a2
          http://cofda.wordpress.com/

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          • #20
            I was only guessing there, not saying it would be the case. But that's the only way I can read it.
            No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

            To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Doktor View Post
              I was only guessing there, not saying it would be the case. But that's the only way I can read it.
              I gathered that :)

              The americans and the indians have been talking about increased usage of US gear since 2006, so I would think that after all the negotiations they've had on C17's and P8's, submarine recovery tech, ballistic detection systems etc.... that the last thing that they would be saying to India is "here, have some flying trucks which are less sophisticated than what we've partnered up with you on C17's and P8's - and by the way, you can only use the hercs on HADR missions and not use them for combat support.....

              IOW its a completely illogical premise :)
              Linkeden:
              http://au.linkedin.com/pub/gary-fairlie/1/28a/2a2
              http://cofda.wordpress.com/

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              • #22
                LT,

                Seeing as how chanakya puri ran all over yelahanka for the last 2 years citing wartime embargo, I highly doubt it.

                Some guys in the ministry have exempted transport vehicles but I bet even this went against and in the face of professional advice to the contrary from ak antony simply to placate the guests.

                It doesn't make sense. That is why I said it was an appeasement purchase.

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                • #23
                  Anil,

                  If that's how you see things, thank God it wasn't Obama who paid a visit.
                  No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

                  To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Deltacamelately View Post
                    Tata has come up with a seemingly beautiful gun last year. The design seems good. Here's a picture - Tatas display Indian Bofors
                    Bad buy.

                    What Western militaries have learned is that truck mounted howitzers are a very bad idea. It's a compromise between tracked SPH and towed with none of the advantages of either. Tires are no replacement for track and the weight of the gun makes wheels just sink in the mud.

                    Tows are much lighter and you have the advantage of bigger ammunition storage with the truck which can be used for other purposes such as resupply. A good gun crew ... and you really new good crews anyway, can be just as fast to set up a tow as well as the truck mount.

                    The USMC and the RCHA abandoned the SPH for those very reasons.

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                    • #25
                      Those C-130J's are special forces equipment and not ordinary transports.

                      The Gaurds Special Operations Group is a completely new wing of the Indian Air Force, it adds a capability which never existed ever before.

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                      • #26
                        That report about the TATA gun tells us all that is wrong with the Indian procurement system:
                        The fear of scams has inhibited A.K. Antony's Ministry of Defence from signing a deal with a foreign supplier. Three successive artillery tenders have been cancelled over the last decade, severely compromising India's firepower capability. The erstwhile Bofors — now owned by British Aerospace — was the front-runner in all the scrapped tenders. Four other key gun makers have been blacklisted in the process: South African Denel, Singapore's ST Kinetics, Israeli Soltam and European Rheinmetall.
                        Bofors (now BAE) and those four are the top five gun makers in the world. Perhaps the only ones producing top quality modern artillery.

                        BTW, what that report doesn't mention is that the gun itself in the TATA system is not designed by TATA. I forget which foreign company it comes from. But I'm not complaining. The IA needs whatever guns they can get. Even the old 80's version of the FH-77 will do.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Defcon5 View Post
                          C-130J's are special forces equipment

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by anil View Post
                            LT,

                            Seeing as how chanakya puri ran all over yelahanka for the last 2 years citing wartime embargo, I highly doubt it.

                            Some guys in the ministry have exempted transport vehicles but I bet even this went against and in the face of professional advice to the contrary from ak antony simply to placate the guests.

                            It doesn't make sense. That is why I said it was an appeasement purchase.
                            He was probably referring to 1965 and 1971 wars and the post 1998 nuke testing embargos. The embargos were exactly the reason we had gone for a lot of French/ European and Russian equipment. But now the scenario has changed, we happen to be a big arms market, second to China and the US cannot afford to loose this market by any kind of embargo.

                            This is not an appeasement purchase, but i'm guessing that it must have been part of the nuclear deal.

                            Coming to the point of the C-130J - I cannot explain to you the improvement it is over the An series of transport aircraft that we use for strategic airlift. You have to fly in the An series to understand the benefits of the C-130Js.

                            Cheers!...on the rocks!!

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Defcon5 View Post
                              Those C-130J's are special forces equipment and not ordinary transports.
                              Rubbish, it is just a flying truck.

                              The Gaurds Special Operations Group is a completely new wing of the Indian Air Force, it adds a capability which never existed ever before.
                              The Garuds are for combat and rescue of downed pilots and as an emergency response team for any attacks on airforce installations. They do not need C-130Js.

                              Cheers!...on the rocks!!

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by lemontree View Post
                                You have to fly in the An series to understand the benefits of the C-130Js.
                                I don't know, Captain. In one, you're shaking too much to notice that you're freezing. The other, you're freezing too much to notice that you're being shaken apart.

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