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Zimmerman found not guilty

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  • #46
    Justice Department To Review George Zimmerman, Trayvon Martin Case

    This was too soon. More distraction from real problems or a real concern?
    No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

    To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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    • #47
      Witch hunt much?
      In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

      Leibniz

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      • #48
        I am still waiting to hear the value of said law.

        Because I am not sold on it.
        “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
        Mark Twain

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
          Hitesh,

          Did the prosecution screwed up?
          Looking back, I would say that they should have introduced the charge of assault which can be a felony. Because if they could convince the jury that George zimmerman assaulted travis Martin, then the self defence argument is mootless and the defense would not be able to present an alternate theory to the 2nd degree murder or manslaughter.

          But that is strategy. The big problem was that there were no evidence that seems to directly contradict George Zimmerman's assertions of self defense. No witnesses. The only thing that could contradict GZ's self defense claims was that his head was not bleeding that much or showing much damage because if his head was being slammed into the pavement, there would be more blood and GZ would be much more dazed. But again, the defense all had to was introduce reasonable doubt and that's what happened here.

          That is why jury selection is so important. I think the prosecution lost out on the jury selection.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Parihaka View Post
            Where in the court case or Zimmerman's statements did he say wearing a hoodie made Martin suspicious?
            the calls he made to the police.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Blademaster View Post
              the calls he made to the police.
              To which i posted the links with the calls .

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Blademaster View Post

                That is why jury selection is so important. I think the prosecution lost out on the jury selection.
                So do you think the verdict is wrong then B/M ?

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by zraver View Post
                  Actually he was, its called assault.




                  He had already returned home, gone back outside and confronted the neighborhood watch captain whose job it was to observe and report. Getting out of his car to get an address to relay to police was not a provocative act.



                  wrong, TM did not know that Zimmerman was armed since the gun was in the small of Zimmermans back.

                  [qute[George Zimmerman created the situation where TM was in fear for his life or liberty. TM had every right to use self-defense or Stand your Ground.
                  TM attacked Zimmerman who not engaged in either threatening or unusual behavior. TM was the one who was cutting between houses (trespassing and perhaps practicing burglary skills/ casing targets), who engaged in pre-meditated assault upon another after making a racial a slur (assault, possibly racially motivated/hate crime). Hrmmm... all behavbior that fits the TM- who liked to fight, was a known burglar, who posted picks of him using drugs and in possession of an illegal a pistol



                  The right person died



                  Zimmerman was not chasing, he got out of his car for an address, TM was doing more than merely wearing a hoody- he was lingering in hard to see places in the rain and cutting between houses. Behaviors that should elicit a response from the leader of the neighborhood watch.



                  The facts are what they are, TM was a thug who went looking for trouble and got shot.



                  The jury, presented with most of the facts (but not the ones most exculpatory to Zimmerman), mislead by a prosecution on a witch hunt who violated Zimmerman's rights and instructed by a biased judge who will be lucky if she isn't impeached for her behavior during the trial still found the case for murder or even manslaughter lacking and acquitted.[/QUOTE]

                  What real evidence do you have to prove that TM was a thug and liked to fight all the time. What you are doing is the same sort of despicable behavior that people would engaged to justify that a girl was not "raped" because she was a whore. You are bringing up the past acts and extrapolating into this image where you can justify the actions of GZ

                  I totally find your arguments to be fallacious and despicable and unworthy of further debate since you have already made your mind that TM was a thug and therefore any actions made by GZ was excusable. Well no, GZ was a neighborhood watchman but not a cop. He had no right or authority to detain or question TM against his will. TM was taking a shortcut because he didn't want to take the long way around and it was raining that day. He was talking to a friend of his on the phone while walking back to his father's home. Hardly the actions of a man who was looking for trouble. You are conjecting on TM;s part. What about GZ? He wanted to be a cop but he was too stupid to be a cop. He was overzealous and overly aggressive. He was a wannabe mall cop who thought the law was on his side when he was strutting around like he was the big man on campus with a gun in his back. He thought he could take down a "bad guy" himself and make himself the hero. He was a vigilante.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by tankie View Post
                    So do you think the verdict is wrong then B/M ?
                    Yes, it should have been manslaughter. I was not expecting a 2nd degree murder conviction because the state did not have enough proof to override the reasonable doubt standard but introduced the charge as a way of forcing the defense to spend all their time defending against 2nd degree murder and little against manslaughter and also to answer the public's criticism that the state was not doing enough.

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                    • #55
                      One more thing. there will be a civil lawsuit if for no other reason, to force GZ to testify. In a civil case, you can be compelled to testify against yourself. There will be a long and lengthy depo for him. There will be two trials. One initiated by the father and one initiated by the mother. GZ will attempt to make it one trial and avoid going through two depos.

                      Once he testifies, it will be very easy to take him apart and his self defense arguments.

                      Also it is not over for GZ yet. The Feds still has the opportunity to charge him with a civil rights violation. But the problem I see with it is the parcity of evidence that the Feds have. Feds rarely try a case they know it has a likelyhood of losing. So unless they can get more evidence, this will be a very hard call for the US attorney to make and most likely the call will come from the top, mostly for political reasons.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Blademaster View Post

                        What real evidence do you have to prove that TM was a thug and liked to fight all the time.
                        statements of his friends, his own text messages and his juvenile criminal record.

                        [quoteWhat you are doing is the same sort of despicable behavior that people would engaged to justify that a girl was not "raped" because she was a whore. You are bringing up the past acts and extrapolating into this image where you can justify the actions of GZ[/quote]

                        The jury given a lopsided cases still found GZ not guilty of either murder 2 or manslaughter and all other lesser included.

                        I totally find your arguments to be fallacious and despicable and unworthy of further debate since you have already made your mind that TM was a thug and therefore any actions made by GZ was excusable. Well no, GZ was a neighborhood watchman but not a cop. He had no right or authority to detain or question TM against his will. TM was taking a shortcut because he didn't want to take the long way around and it was raining that day. He was talking to a friend of his on the phone while walking back to his father's home. Hardly the actions of a man who was looking for trouble. You are conjecting on TM;s part. What about GZ? He wanted to be a cop but he was too stupid to be a cop. He was overzealous and overly aggressive. He was a wannabe mall cop who thought the law was on his side when he was strutting around like he was the big man on campus with a gun in his back. He thought he could take down a "bad guy" himself and make himself the hero. He was a vigilante.
                        TM made it to his fathers house, took out his gold caps and went back looking for GZ... something RJ testified to, in her understanding of her friend he was looking for a fight. His own text messages show him being in an aggressive fight prone mood.

                        Per the jury, Zimmerman's acts, while stupid, did not reach the level of criminal act.

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                        • #57
                          What makes me go puke in this case is the media.

                          They had their court session and the guilty verdict, only the sentence was not out (or I missed it).

                          HufPo changed FB profile picture with one of TM when he was like 11 y/o. There goes unbiased journalism.
                          No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

                          To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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                          • #58
                            lots of pissed off peeps huh .:whome:

                            Petitions Demanding Civil Rights Case Against George Zimmerman Draw 250,000 Signatures

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                            • #59
                              Teenagers getting into fights and smoking pot are no evidence of being a hardened criminal. Nor is it relevant to the legal case presented. Interestingly enough, Florida law states that the first attacker [edit: or instigator] can reclaim the right to use deadly force under limited circumstances, and that seemed to be the case that they argued at court.
                              Last edited by Triple C; 15 Jul 13,, 18:11.
                              All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
                              -Talmud Kohelet Rabbah, 7:16.

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by zraver View Post
                                Per the jury, Zimmerman's acts, while stupid, did not reach the level of criminal act.
                                That I can agree with. Lots of stupid for the parties involved.
                                All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
                                -Talmud Kohelet Rabbah, 7:16.

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