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Gezi (s)Park ignites the brightest fire in Turkey ever

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Parihaka View Post
    I think I've made it plain I consider Erdogan an idiot but surely the rest of the Turkish establishment doesn't have to follow his example and escalate this? Let the protestors have a win, back down over the park and it all goes away....
    bcs they know that just a little spark was needed to blow it all.

    now PM's offices both in Ankara & Istanbul are surrounded by crowd.
    Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none; be able for thine enemy rather in power than use; and keep thy friend under thine own life's key; be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech.

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    • #32
      exactly...
      Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none; be able for thine enemy rather in power than use; and keep thy friend under thine own life's key; be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech.

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      • #33
        Live feed here still up: VGTV

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        • #34
          By the reports coming here from Turkey, more people are arrested in Izmir then Istanbul.

          Some of the images are horror...



          And a 90 seconds video:
          Attached Files
          Last edited by Doktor; 01 Jun 13,, 22:53. Reason: typo
          No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

          To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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          • #35
            I did not know Anti-Erdogan feelings have gotten to such a point in Turkey. Anybody care to give a quick rundown of how exactly things have gotten to this point?

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            • #36
              Posts #7 and #13, sum it up nicely. First hand narrative.
              No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

              To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Parihaka View Post
                I think I've made it plain I consider Erdogan an idiot but surely the rest of the Turkish establishment doesn't have to follow his example and escalate this? Let the protestors have a win, back down over the park and it all goes away....
                Erdogan will do just that. Two main reasons behind the protests are Akps step by step islamization policy and erdogans increasingly authorative attitude. However different protesting groups has no real shared goals and many are even polar oppozites. Both kurdish and turkish nationalists are out there as well as secularists and anarchists. However those are the groups already opposed to akp. The conservative middle classes of anatolian cities and slums of ankara or istanbul will stay behind erdogan as long as he keeps subsiding them. Although god willing erdogans apparent ability to unite such diverse groups against himself may still be his undoing.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Doktor View Post
                  Posts #7 and #13, sum it up nicely. First hand narrative.
                  No I mean the long story of how Erdogan has generated so much animosity. You don't have this many people showing up without much deeper issues than park renovation.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by citanon View Post
                    I did not know Anti-Erdogan feelings have gotten to such a point in Turkey. Anybody care to give a quick rundown of how exactly things have gotten to this point?
                    Erdogan came to power using post crisis economic frustration, personal charisma and an islamist-conservative base. He also claimed liberal votes by attacking to turkeys established elitist and corrupt parties. However he grew (as many predicted) increasingly dictatorial using courts and appointed judges to silence his critics. Many journalist and old commanders are in jail waiting for sham trials that takes years to even compile the made up accusations. AKPs majority in parliament enabled him to pass laws as he see fit without slightest regard to opposition or spirit of constitution. He filled public jobs with his sympathizers and used states power to pressure people into a more islamist and conservative lifestyle. In his last move He banned alcohol from retailers and is in reality paving the way to its complete ban.

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                    • #40
                      and it is not just a "renovation".

                      they will try to re-build an Ottoman-era building which has significant importance for Islamists...

                      one of Ottoman-era Islamist uprising center (an old Ottoman Army Arty School.) which is stopped by an army led by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk...
                      Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none; be able for thine enemy rather in power than use; and keep thy friend under thine own life's key; be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by TTL View Post
                        Erdogan came to power using post crisis economic frustration, personal charisma and an islamist-conservative base. He also claimed liberal votes by attacking to turkeys established elitist and corrupt parties. However he grew (as many predicted) increasingly dictatorial using courts and appointed judges to silence his critics. Many journalist and old commanders are in jail waiting for sham trials that takes years to even compile the made up accusations. AKPs majority in parliament enabled him to pass laws as he see fit without slightest regard to opposition or spirit of constitution. He filled public jobs with his sympathizers and used states power to pressure people into a more islamist and conservative lifestyle. In his last move He banned alcohol from retailers and is in reality paving the way to its complete ban.
                        Except for the Islamist element, this reminds me of the late Hugo Chavez.
                        sigpic

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                        • #42
                          Attached Files
                          Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none; be able for thine enemy rather in power than use; and keep thy friend under thine own life's key; be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Attached Files
                            Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none; be able for thine enemy rather in power than use; and keep thy friend under thine own life's key; be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech.

                            Comment


                            • #44


                              after the protests cleaning the streets...
                              Attached Files
                              Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none; be able for thine enemy rather in power than use; and keep thy friend under thine own life's key; be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Big K & TTL. I'm curious about the potential consequences of all of this, though it is too early to be sure.

                                It seems unlikely Erdogan will be forced from office. He has an electoral mandate & he has force as a backup. I also fear that if he goes that way it might open the door for something scarier. I'm more curious about the potential impact of this on politics afterward.

                                Is there something here the opposition can use to help it re-establish itself as a viable contender for power, or is this all too unfocussed?

                                Is there a danger that if this continues too long or becomes too destructive that it might actually rebound on the opposition & protesters - eroding support or actually giving Erdogan an excuse to become even more repressive?
                                sigpic

                                Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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