China angers neighbours with sea claims on new passports

[hanswu25]

It is not that a serious accusation. China also retaliated. It is reported in late 90s and early 00s. I don't know if I can baidu or google them. I will try to find it on the old Hong Kong newspaper which might be considered more neutral sources or international newspaper.

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�*菲黄岩岛对峙 - 维基百科，自由的百科全书

This one is a more independent source.
U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

You see only separate incidents but fail to see the context when in late 90s it marked the height of tension between China and Philippines which almost sparked a naval fight. It was not because of PLAN was weak or those countries had a policy to do so. The song "China was bullied even by small countries when it was weak" is purely propaganda. Of course those countries has been trying to push swam of Chinese fishermen out of their EEZ but so far it is nothing to compare with what China does from arresting for ransom (without any court or law to legalize it), seizing ships and equipments to beating captives, ramming, shooting at ships.

[hanswu25]

Will have to defer to those members more knowledgeable about the region but i don't believe there is a potential here to turn deadly, not yet anyway. Simply because its too early in the game. The last thing China wants to do is act prematurely and remove any doubts that may be present. Today, China needs to keep on growing and not waste resources in ruinous arms races. Same applies for everybody else in the region.

I agree about it is not turning deadly soon but disagree about the arm race. Please look at China and SEA countries' spending. Even Philippines is throwing billions on arm purchasing. Most of the opinions downplay this trend and said it is normal to go with the growth of economy but the massive spending can not be unnoticed.

[cdude]

I agree about it is not turning deadly soon but disagree about the arm race. Please look at China and SEA countries' spending. Even Philippines is throwing billions on arm purchasing. Most of the opinions downplay this trend and said it is normal to go with the growth of economy but the massive spending can not be unnoticed.

If you think China don't welcome Vietnam and the Philippines throwing billions on arm purchasing, I have a bridge to sell you.

[hanswu25]

If you think China don't welcome Vietnam and the Philippines throwing billions on arm purchasing, I have a bridge to sell you.

You want to say China is fueling an arm race to the whole region?

[kyli]

You see only separate incidents but fail to see the context when in late 90s it marked the height of tension between China and Philippines which almost sparked a naval fight. It was not because of PLAN was weak or those countries had a policy to do so. The song "China was bullied even by small countries when it was weak" is purely propaganda. Of course those countries has been trying to push swam of Chinese fishermen out of their EEZ but so far it is nothing to compare with what China does from arresting for ransom (without any court or law to legalize it), seizing ships and equipments to beating captives, ramming, shooting at ships.

Of course it is propaganda. Everything you don't like it is a propaganda. China is an evil doer period. The big bad evil Chinese. Everything comes out of China is propaganda. Everyone defends the Chinese is propaganda.

Ransom, beating captives, ramming shooting, a simple google probably could find you a ton of cases that the Chinese fishermen are being "Ransom, beating captives, ramming shooting. You have already made up your mind that the Chinese is the evil doer, then why bother when no amount of facts would make any difference. Separate incidents, what a joke.

For others:
"It is the law, when it is convenient for you".

Don't you get it. We made the law.

[kyli]

Now we're getting warmer.

So China's moves are with the aim to gain leverage over the underlined bit.

China's way of pushing back.

For now it is, the problem is Vietnam and Philippines believe they can rely upon the US as a form of leverage to assert their claims but the Chinese aren't the same Chinese a few years back.

[hanswu25]

For now it is, the problem is Vietnam and Philippines believe they can rely upon the US as a form of leverage to assert their claims but the Chinese aren't the same Chinese a few years back.

No you are wrong. Not only USA but the whole international community who don't share the same value with the P***** Republic of China (or Chinese in your own words if you prefer). You should have been in one of those SCS conferences to understand the meaning of loneliness.

[Doktor]

Guys,

Why are you bringing this to a lower level then it should be?

If you disagree with some of the posters, provide credible sources instead of having a beef with them. It is their view vs your view, you both have the right to be wrong, but be civil.

That said, looking at the map I am still curious how this is not turned into Vietnam/Philippines/Taiwan issue. China seems so far away and cut out. To a foreigner of course.

[TopHatter]

If you disagree with some of the posters, provide credible sources instead of having a beef with them. It is their view vs your view, you both have the right to be wrong, but be civil.

Well said, let's keep it civil.

[kyli]

No you are wrong. Not only USA but the whole international community who don't share the same value with the P***** Republic of China (or Chinese in your own words if you prefer). You should have been in one of those SCS conferences to understand the meaning of loneliness.

Fine, China vs. the international community(If you insisted and you believed you could represent the international community.) Now, go kick the Chinese out of the South China Sea.

[kyli]

Guys,

Why are you bringing this to a lower level then it should be?

If you disagree with some of the posters, provide credible sources instead of having a beef with them. It is their view vs your view, you both have the right to be wrong, but be civil.

That said, looking at the map I am still curious how this is not turned into Vietnam/Philippines/Taiwan issue. China seems so far away and cut out. To a foreigner of course.

The 7 dash line was first drawn by the Republic of China(Taiwan). In ROC's constitution, it still claims both the mainland China and the 7 dash line.

The problem is not who is right and who is wrong. The problem is if members could claim moral high ground or represent the whole international community in the very beginning. Do you think this is a debate? The verdict is already declared before the trial. China is the evil doer, then why bother.

If you want a meaningful and civilized debate, then members should better do some research and gather facts in a balance matter. Then they could attack the Chinese position. A mere statement of bully, proximity, and international community are just a pure expression of dislike and one's own feeling.

[hanswu25]

That said, looking at the map I am still curious how this is not turned into Vietnam/Philippines/Taiwan issue. China seems so far away and cut out. To a foreigner of course.

It is an issue, not only among Vietnam, Philippines, Taiwan but also Brunei and Malaysia. They did protest against each other sometimes but the news did not make it big on media. Beside that those countries somehow accept the stalemate and defacto control of those islands and wait for a solution. Chance of spark only occur when a vessel or plane of one get to close to island under control of another.

[cdude]

You want to say China is fueling an arm race to the whole region?

China welcomes Vietnam and the Philippines to fuel the arm race. You two countries are flooded with USD, so why not spend some? Pump up the US economy, everybody wins!

[hanswu25]

China welcomes Vietnam and the Philippines to fuel the arm race. You two countries are flooded with USD, so why not spend some? Pump up the US economy, everybody wins!

No I don't believe you, Sir Chinese US taxpayer, because last thing i bumped in last few days was a Global Times article moaning about Japan increasing of armaments. I am also too lazy to dig up some old news that China outcried about US arming Philippines or Vietnam starting the arm race in SEA when those money should have been spend on economic development but I assume you have all heard about it.
Don't understand why you are still speaking like a disgruntled spoke person who tries to ruin every China foreign policy.