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Protesters besiege Hong Kong plaza as crisis over ‘national education’ mounts

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  • #76
    Originally posted by Skywatcher View Post
    Haven't seen those.

    The photos I've seen published by the LA Times, HP UK and other Internet outlets show a bunch of ordinary looking people, somewhat older than the students, arguing and pushing. They look like the typical small business owner you would find in a night market or on the back alleys of Hong Kong, Singapore, Shanghai, Guangdong, Taipei, Bangokok, Penang, etc.
    The masked dudes in black are a different group. They're more violent, younger and organized than average counter-protesters. Masked Men Face Off in Hong Kong - NBC News PHOTOS: Violence in Causeway Bay when masked gang appears at Occupy Hong Kong protest | Coconuts Hong Kong
    All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
    -Talmud Kohelet Rabbah, 7:16.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by Triple C View Post
      The masked dudes in black are a different group. They're more violent, younger and organized than average counter-protesters. Masked Men Face Off in Hong Kong - NBC News PHOTOS: Violence in Causeway Bay when masked gang appears at Occupy Hong Kong protest | Coconuts Hong Kong
      Ah thank you.

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      • #78
        Tuesday, Oct 7.

        Still very quiet, the same 100 or so folks camping out. I'm puzzled why the police haven't removed barricades along Queensway, between Pacific Place and Admiralty United Centre. There are no protesters there, but the street remains blocked.

        Had to walk to work again today, then to a meeting near Hopewell Centre (a mile away) and back to the office, and then to the Foreign Correspondents' Club to catch up with the journos.

        Sell any shares you may own in Hong Kong fitness clubs. We're walking here (and, thank God for cooler weather) !

        One Swiss journalist, a good friend, saw an ABC (US) camera crew reporting from the streets. The talking head said something about "more people streaming in to join the protests." After they were done reporting, he confronted the guy, and asked him why he didn't just report the truth: people all around them were walking AWAY from the protests, giving up and going home.

        Sad commentary on what used to be an honorable profession.
        Trust me?
        I'm an economist!

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        • #79
          DOR,

          how's transportation/traffic like in HK now? may be coming out your way in a month.
          There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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          • #80
            I didn't expect popular support to drain away this quickly.

            Now on another Internet board, I recommended that the protesters pack up after this weekend and use political momentum to start organizing for the long haul, but looks like I was wrong on that. The only I would have done differently, in their shoes, would be to stay out of Mong Kok and focus on government buildings.

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            • #81
              Originally posted by astralis View Post
              DOR,

              how's transportation/traffic like in HK now? may be coming out your way in a month.
              astralis,

              This week, the places to avoid are Causeway Bay and Mong Kok. The Admiralty (Pacific Place and the major hotels there) can be accessed by MTR, but taxi / bus / car transport is still restricted. Getting into and out of the airport is very simple (I did it during the worst of the protests without a hitch), so if you have a choice, book a hotel near an MTR station. Also, anything on the Kowloon side of the Star Ferry / TST is wide open.

              Send me a PM and maybe we'll have a chance to meet!
              Trust me?
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              • #82
                Thursday, Oct 9th.

                There are so few protesters around Admiralty that I'm really wondering why the police don't dismantle the barricades and open up the roads. I suppose it would encourage more people to come out, but since they didn't do it mid-week, they probably won't do it on the weekend.
                Trust me?
                I'm an economist!

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                • #83
                  So out of curiosity, if the residents of Mong Kok vote that the protesters leave their streets, do the protesters believe enough in democracy to respect the will of the people?

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                  • #84
                    I imagine the protesters can salvage something if they hold a few big rallies and quickly disperse to do the hard task of building long term political organizations to shape the 2017 races (with Leung's sudden Australian problems, Beijing may decide that he gets the boot in a few months).

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                    • #85
                      Monday morning, Oct 13.

                      It looks like the stakes are being raised. There are scores of new tents set up between the Bank of America Building and Admiralty, and a line of 20 or so police vehicles between HSBC and Cheung Kong Centre, in the heart of Central.

                      After the students called for people to come out and show their strength, just prior to a planned meeting with the Government, and the Government then called off the talks, there appears to be even less likelihood of a negotiated settlement.

                      Add a news leak, reportedly from Beijing to an Australian newspaper, that Chief Executive CY Leung received A$4 million (about HK$50 mn) as payment for not competing with the buyers of a company he sold prior to becoming CE. The timing is highly suspicious, even if the transaction can be describe in terms of "normal business practice."
                      Trust me?
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                      • #86
                        Tuesday Occupy 14th

                        The police tried to remove barricades yesterday morning, but ran into resistance and backed down. Then, taxi drivers, truck drivers and others who don't appreciate the inconvenience tried to remove the barricades around Admiralty and were confronted by the protesters. The (very) thin blue line managed to keep the two groups apart, but there were some tense moments.


                        10:15am: the police have begun clearing the streets between Pacific Place and United Centre (Admiralty).
                        Last edited by DOR; 14 Oct 14,, 03:12.
                        Trust me?
                        I'm an economist!

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                        • #87
                          Originally posted by Skywatcher View Post
                          I didn't expect popular support to drain away this quickly.

                          Now on another Internet board, I recommended that the protesters pack up after this weekend and use political momentum to start organizing for the long haul, but looks like I was wrong on that. The only I would have done differently, in their shoes, would be to stay out of Mong Kok and focus on government buildings.
                          I don't understand why they picked the commercial heart of HK rather than state ministries as the site of protest, considering how closely the HK activists patterned their tactics after the Sun Flower movement. There are a lot of cross-pollination and many activists are traveling between HK and Taiwan. Which begs the question.

                          DOC, are the government buildings closely guarded with a large security zone in HK?
                          Last edited by Triple C; 14 Oct 14,, 06:10.
                          All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
                          -Talmud Kohelet Rabbah, 7:16.

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                          • #88
                            Wednesday, Occupy 15th.
                            Today was the first day this month that I didn't have to walk to work. My office in Admiralty is between the legislative / executive office buildings and the Pacific Place shopping mall. As I look out the window toward the Convention Centre (east), Queensway Road on my right (south) is finally open to traffic. However, Connaught Road (north) between my office and the government has a scores of tents and no traffic.

                            Following 9-11, and SARS, the impenetrable wisdom of whoever designed the government complex ensured that anything that affected one branch (e.g., executive), would also affect at least one other (legislative). This structure is one building away (300 m) from the heart of the judicial branch, too. Oh, and it "occupies" prime waterfront real estate. The Bind Moggles.
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                            • #89
                              Just my personal opinion:

                              I thought CCP handled the situation beautifully. I told my dad 2 weeks ago that if I were CCP, I would sit this one out and let the local police handle it. If the locals could handle it, then great. If not, then Hong Kong would be disrupted economically and enough working people would be pissed off at the "students" and cease their support.

                              Notice all these protests are usually carried out by people who don't have families to feed.

                              The last thing CCP should do is to send in police from China as reinforcements.

                              "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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                              • #90
                                Oct 20.
                                Late last week it all seemed to be cooling down. Roads were open and the crowds were smaller. Then, there was That Video of the police politely explaining to someone’s face why one does not pour a bottle of piss on the heads of peace officers doing their duty. The lesson was delivered with large boots, liberally applied.

                                So, things got ugly over the weekend, but only in Mong Kok. The police started pushing back and some people on both sides got injured. Compared to Korea, Thailand or any of a dozen other places where popular crowds demand democracy this is kindergarten stuff.

                                But, it certainly did reinforce my belief that only the desperate, or stupid, make short term forecasts.
                                Trust me?
                                I'm an economist!

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