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  • #31
    "Jeremie Le Febvre, the 30-year-old founder of private equity marketing-services firm TBG Capital Advisors, plans to move to Singapore from Paris this year."

    France Entrepreneurs Flee From Hollande Wealth Rejection - Bloomberg

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    • #32
      Good riddance. TBG Capital Advisors, founded a grand total of 6 months ago, is headquartered in Singapore already anyway. Le Febvre himself used to be with UBS and jumped ship during the Subprime Crisis, right before the SEC's investigation of UBS for tax fraud. He then joined Triago and later founded TBG after getting kicked out of Triago last year. Just the kind of people we do not need in our economy.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by kato View Post
        Good riddance. TBG Capital Advisors, founded a grand total of 6 months ago, is headquartered in Singapore already anyway. Le Febvre himself used to be with UBS and jumped ship during the Subprime Crisis, right before the SEC's investigation of UBS for tax fraud. He then joined Triago and later founded TBG after getting kicked out of Triago last year. Just the kind of people we do not need in our economy.
        Expect a regular trickle of such stories in sections of the anglophone media. Hollande is the new Danton and, even worse, he is an infidel (did I mention he eats babies?). The man doesn't believe in the morality of suffering & the importance of punishing the immoral by stalling their economies and pushing them back into recession. He must therefore be opposed at every step. Expect every misstep or failure (real or percieved) to be heavily covered - especialy in the next 18 months. Expect any succeses to be buried near the bottom of any story with heavy qualification.
        sigpic

        Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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        • #34
          Personally, i find the overseas votes pretty interesting btw, because those are a lot more unbalanced compared to the mainland.

          Votes in DOM, overall:
          Hollande - 665.300 (63.69%)
          Sarkozy - 379.327 (36.31%)

          Sarkozy barely managed to hold onto New Caledonia, where the local version of the UMP was essentially the law till the late 90s until steadily dropping to only 20% in the last election there. And, due to the islands essentially being a conservative tax haven, also St. Barthelemy et St. Martin.

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          • #35
            Suppose you were a top bracket wage earner in France, would you sit still and get 25c out of every euro you earn or move yourself and money elsewhere to where perhaps you get 65c for every euro?

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            • #36
              I don't think you understand how progressive taxation brackets work, especially in the French Household Unit context. And it's not like this will really affect anyone. There are perhaps 100 people in France who earn more than 1 million Euro per year. Most will simply shift these earnings above one million towards capital gains, since that's taxed separately at lower rates.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by snapper View Post
                Suppose you were a top bracket wage earner in France, would you sit still and get 25c out of every euro you earn or move yourself and money elsewhere to where perhaps you get 65c for every euro?
                This is sad even by your recent standards Snapper. Google 'progressive tax system'. Each one is different & has all manner of complexities, but the principle isn't hard to grasp. Assuming this gets passed in the precise form promised (don't hold your breath) those people in Freance who are covered by this will pay that top percentage on some of what they earn, not all of it. Perhaps some of them will decide to leave, perhaps not. Either way, it is a minor issue. Take a chill pill, this is getting really silly.
                sigpic

                Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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                • #38
                  Why would they flee in UK, when Monaco is so close?
                  No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

                  To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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                  • #39
                    All French non-resident citizens pay taxes on their income from French sources. Similar to the USA btw. Basically, they can only move their taxation if they move the company too - works for a lightweight like Le Febvre or perhaps - as a heavyweight - for e.g. Pierre Bellon of Sodexo, would not work for e.g. Serge Dassault or Bernard Arnault.

                    It should also be noted in this regard that most of the rich upper crust in France are more or less directly connected to the UMP. E.g. Serge Dassault sits in the senate for them, Bernard Arnault is a personal friend of Sarkozy, Francois Pinault a friend of Chirac, Liliane Bettencourt's bribery scandals should be well-known.

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                    • #40
                      Dear kato,
                      Thank you for your thoughtful comments.
                      Interesting summary of my professional experience indeed, now I must say that the fiction you describe seems very exciting and I almost wish it were true !
                      I assume the "Senior Contributor" title was granted to you on the basis of your in-depth investigating and reflection work (the reader will recognize French irony).
                      Perhaps you could elaborate on your reference to "our economy". Without a doubt, I can't be part of an "economy" where "Senior Contributors" nurture the illusion that they create value with such comments. With such value creation (or lack of rather), at least you are not bothered with taxes !
                      Keep up the good work !
                      Jeremie Le Febvre

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Jeremie LF View Post
                        Dear kato,
                        Thank you for your thoughtful comments.
                        Interesting summary of my professional experience indeed, now I must say that the fiction you describe seems very exciting and I almost wish it were true !
                        I assume the "Senior Contributor" title was granted to you on the basis of your in-depth investigating and reflection work (the reader will recognize French irony).
                        Perhaps you could elaborate on your reference to "our economy". Without a doubt, I can't be part of an "economy" where "Senior Contributors" nurture the illusion that they create value with such comments. With such value creation (or lack of rather), at least you are not bothered with taxes !
                        Keep up the good work !
                        Jeremie Le Febvre
                        You are new here. If you want your post count to get into double figures here's a few tips:

                        1) Go to the introduction section & introduce yourself. This is not optional.

                        2) Read the 'unofficial survival guide'. This is highly advisable.

                        3) If you want to take on someone who has been posting for 6 years & has an established record you'll need to do more than just make smart arsed comments about the person who posted. If Kato is wrong tell us where & why. If yuo can't manage that you are probably on the wrong forum.
                        sigpic

                        Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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                        • #42
                          The French themselves estimate that there are 300+ people in France who earn more than 1 million Euro per year, not 100. You seem to suggest though that this tax will effectively raise no greater income for the French treasury as anyone facing this problem will "shift these earnings above one million towards capital gains". If thos correct then how will pay for his 60,000 teachers? Perhaps you also missed the part of M.Hollandes programme where he speaks of additional "wealth taxes" on property assets? The French property bubble, already close to bursting a la Spain, will certainly burst with extra taxation in this sector and the banks will be left with bad debt.

                          M. Hollande also proposes a 45% rate for people making over €150,000. In UK 45% is the top rate of tax for anyone earning £150,000 above full stop. The decision to lower this rate from 50% recently, although unpopular here, was made precisely because Treasury models suggested that it would raise the tax yield. Presumably we shall find out if the treasury prediction is correct next year but the officials in the French Treasury will almost certainly have similar models to the British ones.

                          James Pace, head of Knight Frank's Chelsea and South Kensington offices, said one French financier told him Hollande's arrival would mark "the third biggest exodus from France – the first being the Revolution and the second when Mitterrand [the last socialist president] got into power". High earners say au revoir to France - Telegraph (He missed the Huguenots).

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by snapper View Post
                            M. Hollande also proposes a 45% rate for people making over €150,000.
                            That's a rather moderate hike, currently it's 41%. Germany's social-democrats have a similar requirement to bring it back up to 45% from currently 42%. Nothing extraordinary there.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by snappers telegraph article
                              But not all the concern is about a punishing tax regime, according to those French already here in London. Stéphane Rambosson, managing partner at consultants Veni Partners, argues Hollande's arrival bodes ill for business.

                              "You have to have a very specific reason to have a business in France instead of the UK, for example access to skilled workers or the need to be very close to clients," he said. "Sarkozy had implemented reduction in social changes to increase competitiveness in France. Such changes will disappear and labour costs, which are huge, are likely to rise.

                              "If you pay an employee say £100,000 in London the equivalent in France is already over £170,000, simply due to costs. Administration and the regulatory framework is also very complicated."
                              This is the sort of nonsense that should not happen in France.

                              What did the UK do to increase value ? nothiing

                              All they did was have less barriers and the difference is ~60%.

                              We are talking about two countries that are about as advanced and within a short distance of each other.

                              Why should it be so much more expensive in France.

                              While he does not anticipate big business pulling out of France, he confirmed top earners are definitely considering relocating – especially those in finance who can work from a trading floor in any country. "Such moves will be carried out very discreetly," he said. "What Hollande described as its enemies, financiers, will find themselves exiled in the UK and taking, for different reasons, the steps of the Huguenots who helped create the Bank of England."
                              The implication here seems to be that this difference only applies in the case of financiers.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by snapper View Post
                                The French themselves estimate that there are 300+ people in France who earn more than 1 million Euro per year, not 100. You seem to suggest though that this tax will effectively raise no greater income for the French treasury as anyone facing this problem will "shift these earnings above one million towards capital gains". If thos correct then how will pay for his 60,000 teachers? Perhaps you also missed the part of M.Hollandes programme where he speaks of additional "wealth taxes" on property assets? The French property bubble, already close to bursting a la Spain, will certainly burst with extra taxation in this sector and the banks will be left with bad debt.
                                How much does the French govt expect to get by raising taxes to 75pc on those 300+ people ?

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