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How the U.S. Lost Out on iPhone Work

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  • #16
    dok,



    for a slightly more detailed view:

    http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/OUTMS

    this at a time when manufacturing has lost ~2 mil jobs in the past 3 years.

    this argues that those lost workers have been replaced by technology + increasing productivity among the remaining workers.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    • #17
      asty,

      I specifically asked you if it is is in value or in metric tons. Since we speak in values, this means US sell expensive things with high added value like robots, cure for cancer, software...

      The article is about the iPhone and why Apple moved the production there. They produce nuts, bolts and assemble them, managing to do it faster then US, Japan or Europe and that's why the production of everyday products is there (for now). Part of why they are cheaper is in the factories making the parts being so close and connected, the other part is they are still very versatile and ready to answer unusual requests fast.

      The question from Obama to Jobs was how to get these jobs back home and the answer is no way.

      You never recreated the jobs lost to Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Malaysia, but you still lead them in innovations.

      When China will employ all her inhabitants (- naturally unemployable) it will be India, or Africa.

      The better question is does US want these jobs back or would like to continue to produce robots, next gen medicaments, SW, and can you keep the pace with this educational system you have at the moment.
      No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

      To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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      • #18
        note my response to JAD-- i don't disagree.
        There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by astralis View Post
          note my response to JAD-- i don't disagree.
          Then we will agree that you should be worried if your President wants those jobs back instead of focusing on creating new value added jobs :whome:
          No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

          To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

          Comment


          • #20
            dok,

            Then we will agree that you should be worried if your President wants those jobs back
            he asked a good question to someone whom had a pretty good idea about trends.

            the bigger face-palm is the republican mantra that if only we had lower taxes and lower regulations all these jobs would come rushing back.
            There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by astralis View Post
              dok,



              [Obama] ...asked a good question to someone whom had a pretty good idea about trends.

              the bigger face-palm is the republican mantra that if only we had lower taxes and lower regulations all these jobs would come rushing back.
              lol...one could question which is worse: A president who ought to know why Apple makes the i-Phone in China and still asks the CEO of Apple when he's going to start making them here, or politicians who have some ideas that might get some manufacturers to bring jobs back home and dare to propose them.
              To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

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              • #22
                This might sound a little cruel, but I propose this:

                Remove Government wellfare for anyone without a serious physical disability

                Create a new wellfare system that grants jobless/homeless Americans jobs at factories(relocation) in exchange for some minimal pay (say $2.00/hour), hot meals, and a factory provided roof over their heads, as well as a trades program for learning skills for future employment.

                Oh and stomp on any Unions that might be opposed.

                All 3 must be implemented for this to work.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by cr9527 View Post
                  This might sound a little cruel, but I propose this:

                  Remove Government wellfare for anyone without a serious physical disability

                  Create a new wellfare system that grants jobless/homeless Americans jobs at factories(relocation) in exchange for some minimal pay (say $2.00/hour), hot meals, and a factory provided roof over their heads, as well as a trades program for learning skills for future employment.

                  Oh and stomp on any Unions that might be opposed.

                  All 3 must be implemented for this to work.
                  Always wondered why people hold up Dickensian England as some sort of model for a prosperous society. Probably the same reason people belive government shouldn't intervene - except to crush unions.

                  Just curious, why would employers pay anybody a living wage when they can get slave labour for $2 per hour? Just sack the bulk of the workforce & bring in the slaves. Same shit, different day. YAWN!
                  sigpic

                  Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Bigfella View Post
                    Always wondered why people hold up Dickensian England as some sort of model for a prosperous society. Probably the same reason people belive government shouldn't intervene - except to crush unions.

                    Just curious, why would employers pay anybody a living wage when they can get slave labour for $2 per hour? Just sack the bulk of the workforce & bring in the slaves. Same shit, different day. YAWN!
                    No no, I don't mean companies start this. What I mean is, let this be a replacement for the welfare system.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by cr9527 View Post
                      No no, I don't mean companies start this. What I mean is, let this be a replacement for the welfare system.
                      So you want huge government run factories full of slave labout competing with private companies? Gotcha!
                      sigpic

                      Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Bigfella View Post
                        So you want huge government run factories full of slave labout competing with private companies? Gotcha!
                        Better than a huge government dishing out money with almost no guarantee that it will be put out to good use.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by cr9527 View Post
                          Better than a huge government dishing out money with almost no guarantee that it will be put out to good use.
                          The vast bulk of that money is spent on basics like accommodation, utilities & food. Sounds like a 'good use' to me. You want to yank that & replace it with government run workhouses that will undercut private industry & draconian laws to keep the people in & the unions out. Brilliant!
                          sigpic

                          Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Bigfella View Post
                            The vast bulk of that money is spent on basics like accommodation, utilities & food. Sounds like a 'good use' to me. You want to yank that & replace it with government run workhouses that will undercut private industry & draconian laws to keep the people in & the unions out. Brilliant!
                            Last week I overheard a conversation between the boss and a worker. The worker was bought in - He was on the dole. Yet he still managed to save up frequently enough for the $300.00 house call from ladies of the night. Later on in the evening he asked me what I thought. Essentially I said, the government pays him to **** because he has no self esteem to go get a job. The Dole is a horrible way to live, the money given is just enough to spend on the essentials - and maybe scrimp and save... there are ALWAYS a few that manage to circumvent the system.

                            As for unions. IMO, people seem to have a sense of entitlement about what is 'owed' to them. Being in the contract business, and being in an employee in the second job - I have always had the distinct feeling that employees have virtually no risk, and little stress to worry about other than 'conditions'. The Owner - has none of that and huge amounts of risk. The problem with the unions is - they don't actually realise, it's the government that actually keep them going with their demands - if left to their own devices - I'd sub all the way.
                            Ego Numquam

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                            • #29
                              Listened to this on NPR last night.

                              Shoe Company Practices Insourcing For The Sole : NPR


                              The most interesting note: Low labor cast prevents innovation.


                              James Curleigh, CEO of the Portland, Ore.-based footwear company Keen, knows exactly what Obama is talking about. In 2010, Curleigh opened a workboot factory in Portland; today it employs 30 people. Keen still produces most of its shoes in Asia, but Curleigh says starting to manufacture in the U.S. was a big step.
                              “the misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all” -- Joan Robinson

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                              • #30
                                xinhui,

                                Low laboring cost depends on perspective. IIRC the minimum wage in Greece (even now) is 750 euros, all the Greek company needs to do is move the shop 50 km accross the border to Bulgaria (EU member), Albania or Macedonia and for 500 euros will get the best skilled workers.

                                Innovation depends on company's organization and if management is willing to encourage it, not on wages alone.
                                No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

                                To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

                                Comment

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