Southern Border Developments

[Bill]

Its a job for law enforcement. Not vigilantes.

A militia is not a vigilante force.

It is a constitutionally recognized paramilitary force.

Pay attention.

[Bill]

Deploy BORTAC and the SRT teams, which are the Border Patrol's special ops guys. Untrained civilians are not going to stop the military: Here are the various units I think should be deployed:

HRT
BORTAC
Maybe half of the SRT's
FBI local SWAT teams
Various national guard units.
Various federal special ops teams
And aerial observation units.

You are so truly clueless it is almost beyond comprehension.

You'd need 100,000 men(at least) to secure the US southern border.

That is precisely the sort of mission congress had in mind when they included the militia language into the Connie to begin with.

Guess what, your 'untrained civilian' dumbasss is a member of the unorganized militia too.

You can be called upon by POTUS, your Guv, or your Sherrif to serve, and you are expected to show up bearing self-supplied arms and ammunition.

Bet you didn't even know that, did you?

[Bill]

rifles and handguns are no match for trained soldiers, machine guns, and military vehicles.

Telll that to the mujahadeen that drove the Soviets from Afghanistan.

In fact, tell that to the US minutemen that joined arms against the Brits and won us our freedom.

Narrow view= narrow mind.

[Bill]

It is the duty of the US military to secure our borders, it says so in our charters.

This is not a police issue, it is a military issue, and the unorganized militia is just another arm of the US military.

This is a perfectly well suited role for the militia groups- under Gov't controlled military supervision(as was intended).

[Bill]

Shoot them. If the Mexican gov't denies it's soldiers have crossed over the border and into the U.S. then it's not going to be able to hold us accountable for dead armed people on U.S. soil wearing mexican military uniforms is it? Eventually, one of these confrontations will lead to someone getting hurt or killed, and if it's a U.S. policeman or border patrol agent killed by mexican military on our soil I'd consider it an act of war.

I find it hard to believe this has happened so many times and it continues unabated. It's like your neighbor coming into your house, univited and armed, and walks off with your personal belongings on a regular basis and you can't do anything about it, and the authorities won't help.

We've already had US LE officers killed down there.

Horse is already out of the barn.

[Bill]

No, I just find it more likely they are not actually military, but I could very well be wrong. Either way, I think it would be justifiable to mow them down and find out afterwards.

You're wrong. We've captured entire armed mexican military patrols in the US before. We even got one on the outskirts of San Diego a few years back.

[ChrisF202]

I actually read something about how the drug lords were helping Al Qaeda cross the border. USBP agents have caught members of Hizbollah crossing the border. Besides, if Bush dident secure the border after 9/11/01 why would he secure it after the next terrorist attack?

THE FEDERAL GOVERMENT WILL NEVER SECURE THE BORDER. Not today, not tommorow, never. Its up to the militia groups and groups like the Minuteman Project, Ranch Rescue, American Patrol, etc.

[Bill]

I have problems giving guns to glorified toll booth collectors who would neither expect nor be continually trained to expect armed incidents.

Not me.

I believe all free law abiding men have the right to be armed.

That's a really elitist comment Sir, i'm very suprised to hear you making it...

[Bill]

Hi Guys,

The irony is that in all likelihood these armed drug gangs are probably helping to secure the border against terrorist infiltrators.

Or providing an armed escort for a nominal fee.

[Bill]

I actually read something about how the drug lords were helping Al Qaeda cross the border. USBP agents have caught members of Hizbollah crossing the border. Besides, if Bush dident secure the border after 9/11/01 why would he secure it after the next terrorist attack?

I read the same thing. It's a group of former Mexican Army commandos that have formed a gang, and have offered to escort ANYONE over the border for a fee.

Can't remember the groups name though.

[Officer of Engineers]

Not me.

I believe all free law abiding men have the right to be armed.

That's a really elitist comment Sir, i'm very suprised to hear you making it...

I have no problem with law abiding men having the right to be armed. However, I have a problem with arming government employees who are neither expected nor capable of doing anything more than toll booth collecting just to make them feel better.

As far as I understand things, actual law enforcement will still falls to the local RCMP detachment regardless of the border guards are armed or not.

[Bill]

I have no problem with law abiding men having the right to be armed. However, I have a problem with arming government employees who are neither expected nor capable of doing anything more than toll booth collecting just to make them feel better.

As far as I understand things, actual law enforcement will still falls to the local RCMP detachment regardless of the border guards are armed or not.

Let me ask you....would you rather put your faith in a well meaning, honest, law abiding armed Canadian border 'guard', or the good will of criminals and terrorists to not violate your/our border or kill/rape/rampage in your/our lands after crossing?

The answer to me is obvious.

I much more trust the law abiding border guard.

[Officer of Engineers]

I much more trust the law abiding border guard.

If that is the case, then I expect and demand that their roles be changed from glorified toll booth collecting to actual law enforcement which includes up to and including the same legal authorization to use lethal force as authorized to the police. If you want the authority to have a gun, you must have the responsibility to use the gun.

That currently is not the case nor is it to be the case even under the Conservatives Elect government.

It makes absolutely no sense to me that even if the border guards are armed, they must scream to the RCMP for help at the 1st sign of trouble.

[Bill]

If that is the case, then I expect and demand that their roles be changed from glorified toll booth collecting to actual law enforcement which includes up to and including the same legal authorization to use lethal force as authorized to the police. If you want the authority to have a gun, you must have the responsibility to use the gun.

That currently is not the case nor is it to be the case even under the Conservatives Elect government.

It makes absolutely no sense to me that even if the border guards are armed, they must scream to the RCMP for help at the 1st sign of trouble.

In the US we all have the right to use lethal force, one does not have to be a cop, just face "the threat of imminent death or grave bodily harm".

As far as training, again, i'd rather rely on an untrained but armed law abiding citizen on the scene than the goodwill of a criminal/terrorist/infiltrator to not shoot me because, despite his criminal actions, he's really a nice guy on the inside.

Like when the cops tell civvies to 'cooperate' with criminals.

Fucck that i says.

[Officer of Engineers]

In the US we all have the right to use lethal force, one does not have to be a cop, just face "the threat of imminent death or grave bodily harm".

ROFLMAO! Bill, this is Canada. The same Canada with Toronto crying foul when Lindros pounded Domy. The same Canada who worships Wayne Gretzky - you know the guy who cried when the game got too rough?

That's the same rule here but the attitude ...

As far as training, again, i'd rather rely on an untrained but armed law abiding citizen on the scene than the goodwill of a criminal/terrorist/infiltrator to not shoot me because, despite his criminal actions, he's really a nice guy on the inside.

These ain't just armed law abiding citizens. These are government employees being given tools of the police without the responsibility and the oversight of the police. In essence, it's giving the gov't more power without the oversight. That I have severe problems with.

If the Guards want police tools. I want them to have police powers, responsibilities, oversight. I ain't about to give them guns just to make them feel better without changing the way they do their jobs. You want the tools to face the danger. Fine you got them but don't you dare run away now.

Like when the cops tell civvies to 'cooperate' with criminals.

Fucck that i says.

I would too. Here's what's getting to me. The Border Guards still have the right to refuse to work if it becomes too dangerous even if they are armed. Yeah, they would be armed but they still have the right to run away from danger.