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  • Bull Halsey

    I was reading up on the Battle of Midway on Wikipedia (One of my favorite websites, after WAB, of course). I remember that Bull Halsey wasn't at the Battle of Midway because he was in hospital due to a stress related skin disease. The problem is that the Wikipedia page for the Battle of Midway says he had shingles, the page for Halsey himself doesn't specify a disease, and there are countless pages online that state that he had psoriasis. Now, I can't find basis for either case, shingles or psoriasis, I can't seem to find any resources that nail it down to one or the other.

    So which one was it?
    Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.

    Abusing Yellow is meant to be a labor of love, not something you sell to the highest bidder.

  • #2
    Originally posted by bigross86 View Post
    I was reading up on the Battle of Midway on Wikipedia (One of my favorite websites, after WAB, of course). I remember that Bull Halsey wasn't at the Battle of Midway because he was in hospital due to a stress related skin disease. The problem is that the Wikipedia page for the Battle of Midway says he had shingles, the page for Halsey himself doesn't specify a disease, and there are countless pages online that state that he had psoriasis. Now, I can't find basis for either case, shingles or psoriasis, I can't seem to find any resources that nail it down to one or the other.

    So which one was it?
    I have read shingles in several reputable older (closer to the events) print sources, it was contagious so it was probably not psoriasis
    Last edited by USSWisconsin; 12 Mar 11,, 02:58.
    sigpic"If your plan is for one year, plant rice. If your plan is for ten years, plant trees.
    If your plan is for one hundred years, educate children."

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    • #3
      Originally posted by USSWisconsin View Post
      I have read shingles in several reputable older (closer to the events) print sources, it was contagious so it was probably not psoriasis
      Its confusing becuase both can be made worse with a stress compromized immune system.

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      • #4
        What has any of this to do with modern naval warfare?

        This is a history issue and it's going there.
        Last edited by S2; 12 Mar 11,, 15:22.
        "This aggression will not stand, man!" Jeff Lebowski
        "The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what you share with someone else when you're uncool." Lester Bangs

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        • #5
          Originally posted by bigross86 View Post
          I was reading up on the Battle of Midway on Wikipedia (One of my favorite websites, after WAB, of course). I remember that Bull Halsey wasn't at the Battle of Midway because he was in hospital due to a stress related skin disease. The problem is that the Wikipedia page for the Battle of Midway says he had shingles, the page for Halsey himself doesn't specify a disease, and there are countless pages online that state that he had psoriasis. Now, I can't find basis for either case, shingles or psoriasis, I can't seem to find any resources that nail it down to one or the other.

          So which one was it?
          Halsey was a known scotch whiskey drinker but his hospital report noted that Halsey blamed fine coral dust from nearby construction sites that worsened his conditions the Doctors called "generalized allergic dermatitus". They also mention that stress was a large contributing factor to his conditions. On the same note, they also say that Yamamoto suffered simuliar skin irratations along with chest pains after the Midway operation. Halsey would have been stressed no doubt at this time period as it was his carriers (Hornet and Enterprise) that both supported and launched the Doolittle Raid. Halsey's wifes health would also be a contibuting factor as well as as the great responsibility Nimitz had placed upon him for this daring raid.

          These reasonings come from the book "Sea of Thunder" chapter 3 "Long John Silver and Confucius" where they compare both Halsey and Yamamoto, their backgrounds and careers.
          Last edited by Dreadnought; 12 Mar 11,, 19:12.
          Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
            Halsey was a known scotch whiskey drinker but his hospital report noted that Halsey blamed fine coral dust from nearby construction sites that worsened his conditions the Doctors called "generalized allergic dermatitus". They also mention that stress was a large contributing factor to his conditions. On the same note, they also say that Yamamoto suffered simuliar skin irratations along with chest pains after the Midway operation. Halsey would have been stressed no doubt at this time period as it was his carriers (Hornet and Enterprise) that both supported and launched the Doolittle Raid. Halsey's wifes health would also be a contibuting factor as well as as the great responsibility Nimitz had placed upon him for this daring raid.

            These reasonings come from the book "Sea of Thunder" chapter 3 "Long John Silver and Confucius" where they compare both Halsey and Yamamoto, their backgrounds and careers.
            *Just wanted to mention that the above chapter deals more with Halsey and Kurita and their opinions and optimism. Yamamoto is mentioned in brief in this chapter as far as his health after the Midway Operation and just prior too.

            Yamamoto and some of his beliefs and opinion are better stated in chapter 1 "Doubting Superman".
            Last edited by Dreadnought; 14 Mar 11,, 02:30.
            Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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            • #7
              A fortunate outcome of this was Raymond Spruance was allowed to command the fleet at Midway and produced another outstanding fleet commander for Nimitz to emply...and showed that a surface warfare officer could adapt and lead with the new doctrine of carrier warfare.
              “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
              Mark Twain

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                A fortunate outcome of this was Raymond Spruance was allowed to command the fleet at Midway and produced another outstanding fleet commander for Nimitz to emply...and showed that a surface warfare officer could adapt and lead with the new doctrine of carrier warfare.
                That command change put the Japanese at a big disadvantage, since they believed Halsey was commanding and anticipated his moves according to their experience and study of him - but Spruance didn't make Halsey's moves. That, some good/bad luck and many brave men turned the Pacific war around in that one epic battle.
                sigpic"If your plan is for one year, plant rice. If your plan is for ten years, plant trees.
                If your plan is for one hundred years, educate children."

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                • #9
                  Having just finished Shattered Sword last night...

                  Would Halsey have pushed his luck the night following the day's battle?

                  ZF-

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Zad Fnark View Post

                    Would Halsey have pushed his luck the night following the day's battle?

                    ZF-
                    I'm not sure. The conventional wisdom has it that Halsey might have charged into Yamamoto's battleships. Halsey wasn't known for caution, but he wasn't stupid, either. The Leyte Gulf controversy came after the Marianas, where Spruance was criticized for not pursuing.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                      A fortunate outcome of this was Raymond Spruance was allowed to command the fleet at Midway and produced another outstanding fleet commander for Nimitz to emply...and showed that a surface warfare officer could adapt and lead with the new doctrine of carrier warfare.
                      IMO,Yes and no. Rear Admiral Fletcher had an awful lot to do with Midways operations and success as he was technically in charge aboard the Yorktown and later the Astoria when Yorktown was lost if not mistaken after the first three IJN carriers were destroyed. Fletcher turned over command to Spruance who still had carriers Hornet and Enterprise to launch planes from and recieve them as well. It was the logical thing to do but still Fletchers actions and command should not go unrecognized. With no carriers to direct, why wouldnt you turn charge over to the Command that still has two carriers (Hornet and Enterprise) to complete the operations at hand and chase down the Hiryu?
                      Last edited by Dreadnought; 16 Mar 11,, 07:30.
                      Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
                        Halsey was a known scotch whiskey drinker but his hospital report noted that Halsey blamed fine coral dust from nearby construction sites that worsened his conditions the Doctors called "generalized allergic dermatitus". They also mention that stress was a large contributing factor to his conditions.
                        Edwin Hoyt in the enjoyable How They Won the War in the Pacific: Nimitz and His Admirals also says it was 'nervous dermatitis", Dreadnought.

                        Skin conditions and misjudgments about typhoons aside, the achievements of this warrior include being told by Ernie King back in 1934 that he could command the Saratoga if he completed an aerial observer's course, so he decided to go one better and qualified as a pilot - at the age of 51.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                          A fortunate outcome of this was Raymond Spruance was allowed to command the fleet at Midway and produced another outstanding fleet commander for Nimitz to emply...and showed that a surface warfare officer could adapt and lead with the new doctrine of carrier warfare.
                          Frank Jack Fletcher was senior to Raymond A. Spruance. RADM Fletcher had command. When Yorktown was disabled, Fletcher had the sense of selfless courage to yield tactical command to Spruance with the famous "I will conform to your movements" message.

                          I met Admiral Fletcher when I came home from my first tour in Viet Nam. He was a gentleman but very inquisitive. Even then, years after his retirement and well into old age, the conversation clearly showed that he was firmly in command of all aspects of naval aviation. I suspect he was a great leader and a man with whom I would have confidently sailed into harm's way.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by wabpilot1 View Post
                            Frank Jack Fletcher was senior to Raymond A. Spruance. RADM Fletcher had command. When Yorktown was disabled, Fletcher had the sense of selfless courage to yield tactical command to Spruance with the famous "I will conform to your movements" message.

                            I met Admiral Fletcher when I came home from my first tour in Viet Nam. He was a gentleman but very inquisitive. Even then, years after his retirement and well into old age, the conversation clearly showed that he was firmly in command of all aspects of naval aviation. I suspect he was a great leader and a man with whom I would have confidently sailed into harm's way.

                            You are absolutely correct and I overlooked Fletcher's great role in the battle. I meant more to highlight how Spruance was able to come to prominence and become a great leader as a result of Midway.

                            Meant no disrespect or slight on a great sailor.
                            “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                            Mark Twain

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by clackers View Post
                              Edwin Hoyt in the enjoyable How They Won the War in the Pacific: Nimitz and His Admirals also says it was 'nervous dermatitis", Dreadnought.

                              Skin conditions and misjudgments about typhoons aside, the achievements of this warrior include being told by Ernie King back in 1934 that he could command the Saratoga if he completed an aerial observer's course, so he decided to go one better and qualified as a pilot - at the age of 51.
                              Correct, Halsey did achieve his wings at the age of 51. Being an Annapolis grad and following with Annapolis aviator tradition, Halsey refused to give up the "flying jackass" awarded to him for earning his wings at such a late age. Halsey also spent almost two deckades aboard Destroyers long before he was given the command of a carrier.

                              Halsey's commands:

                              Upon graduation in February 1904, he was assigned to USS Missouri and later transferred to USS Don Juan de Austria in which he was commissioned an Ensign after having completed the two years at sea -- then required by law. In 1907, he joined USS Kansas and made the famous World Cruise of the Fleet in that battle ship.


                              For the next almost 25 years practically all his sea duty with the Fleet was in destroyers, starting in 1909 with command of USS DuPont (TB-7 commissioned in 1897), USS Lamson, USS Flusser and USS Jarvis. In 1915 he went ashore for two years of duty in the Executive Department at the Naval Academy.


                              During WWI he served in the Queenstown Destroyer Force in command of USS Benham and USS Shaw. From 1918 to 1921 he continued his destroyer service in command of USS Yarnell, USS Chauncey, USS John Francis Burnes and Destroyer Division Thirty-two. In October of 1920 he assumed command of USS Wickes and of Destroyer Division Fifteen. At that time a destroyer division commander also commanded the division flagship. Another shore cruise sent him to duty in the Office of Naval Intelligence, in Washington, -- which was his only duty assignment in that city. In October 1922, he was ordered as Naval Attache at the American Embassy in Berlin, Germany. One year later, he was given additional duty as Naval Attache at the American Embassies in Christiana, Norway; Copenhagen, Denmark; and Stockholm, Sweden.


                              On completion of that cruise he returned to sea duty, again in the destroyers in European waters, in command of USS Dale and USS Osborne. Upon his return to the U.S. in 1927, he served one year as Executive Officer of the battleship USS Wyoming -- and then for three years in command of USS Reina Mercedes, station ship at the Naval Academy. He continued his destroyer duty on his next two-years at cruise starting in 1930 as Commander Destroyer Division Three of the Scouting Force. In 1932 he went as a student to the Naval War College.


                              Then in 1934, he embarked on his aviation career when he reported to the Naval Air Station, Pensacola for flight training. He was designated a Naval Aviator on 15 May 1935, and went in command of the carrier USS Saratoga for two years, followed by one year in command of the Naval Air Station, Pensacola. In 1938, when he reached flag rank, he held successive commands of Carrier Division Two in USS Yorktown and Carrier Division One in Saratoga. In 1940, he became Commander Aircraft Battle Force with the rank of Vice Admiral. He was in USS Enterprise in that command when World War II broke out. In April 1942 he was designated Commander Task Force Sixteen, in Enterprise to escort the carrier USS Hornet to within 800 miles of Tokyo to launch the Army planes for the initial bombing of Japan.


                              In October l942 he was made Commander South Pacific Forces and South Pacific Area. With the rank of Admiral, and for the next 18 months he was in command of that area during the offensive operations of the U. S. Forces. In June 1944 he assumed command of the Third Fleet, and was designated Commander Western Pacific Task Forces. As such, he operated successfully against the Japanese in the Palaies, Philippines, Formosa, Okinawa and South China Sea. Subsequent to the Okinawa campaign in July 1945, his forces struck at Tokyo and the Japanese mainland. The last attack of his forces was on 13 August 1945. Admiral Halsey's flag was flying on USS Missouri on 2 September in Tokyo Bay when the formal Japanese surrender was signed onboard.


                              Immediately thereafter, 54 ships of the Third Fleet, with his four-star flag in USS South Dakota, returned to the United States for annual Navy Day Celebrations in San Francisco on 27 October 1945. He hauled down his flag in November of that year and was assigned special duty in the office of the Secretary of the Navy. On December 11, 1945, he took the oath as Fleet Admiral becoming the fourth and last officer to hold the rank.


                              Later, Fleet Admiral Halsey made a goodwill flying trip through Central and South America covering nearly 28,000 miles, and 11 nations. He was relieved of active duty in December 1946, and upon his own request transferred to the retired list on 1 March 1947. Upon retirement, he joined the board of two subsidiaries of the International Telephone and Telegraph Company and served until 1957. He was active in an unsuccessful effort to preserve the USS Enterprise as a national shrine, and was an elected Honorary Vice President of the Naval Historical Foundation.


                              He died on 16 August 1959 at Fishers Island Country Club.
                              Last edited by Dreadnought; 11 May 11,, 15:25.
                              Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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