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Thread: Ask An Expert- Naval Forces

  1. #46
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Rusty, two ships on the West Coast are operational. Don't forget the Liberty Ship Jeremiah O'Brien which sails under her own power several times a year in San Francisco Bay. She also made the trip all the way back to Normandy to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the D-Day invasion in 1994. I have a shot of her sailing out under the Golden Gate Bridge in the fog from back then. Naturally in film somewhere in the files.

    Welcome to the S.S. JEREMIAH O'BRIEN

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbm3fan View Post
    Rusty, two ships on the West Coast are operational. Don't forget the Liberty Ship Jeremiah O'Brien which sails under her own power several times a year in San Francisco Bay. She also made the trip all the way back to Normandy to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the D-Day invasion in 1994. I have a shot of her sailing out under the Golden Gate Bridge in the fog from back then. Naturally in film somewhere in the files.

    Welcome to the S.S. JEREMIAH O'BRIEN

    The SS Jeremiah O'Brien was on Pier Echo for the shipyard disestablishment ceremony. I went up to the roof of building 303 and took a few pictures of the ship.

    ...well it was one of the Liberty ships and since the other one is on the East Coast....
    Last edited by Ytlas; 14 Jun 11, at 21:22.

  3. #48
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    Were there ever any Western naval surface-ship-launched ballistic missile projects other than the experimental Polaris mounts on an Italian cruiser in the 60s and the subsequent Italian Alfa project?

    Were there ever any comparable Eastern considerations, e.g. mounting R-13/15/21 on surface ships? (excepting post-Cold-War sea-based space launchers)

  4. #49
    In Memoriam/Battleship Enthusiast Defense Professional USSWisconsin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kato View Post
    Were there ever any Western naval surface-ship-launched ballistic missile projects other than the experimental Polaris mounts on an Italian cruiser in the 60s and the subsequent Italian Alfa project?

    Were there ever any comparable Eastern considerations, e.g. mounting R-13/15/21 on surface ships? (excepting post-Cold-War sea-based space launchers)
    At least one of the ideas for Iowa class upgrades proposed SLBM's amidships
    "If your plan is for one year, plant rice. If your plan is for ten years, plant trees.
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  5. #50
    Defense Professional RustyBattleship's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ytlas View Post
    The SS Jeremiah O'Brien was on Pier Echo for the shipyard disestablishment ceremony. I went up to the roof of building 303 and took a few pictures of the ship.

    ...well it was one of the Liberty ships and since the other one is on the East Coast....
    Ummm, I was at that ceremony also. As I recall, the ship was the Lane Victory. She's berthed only 5 miles away in Los Angeles Harbor.

    But I could be wrong. I didn't board her (not until a couple of years later in L.A.). I was more concerned about the final closure of my second home --- the Long Beach Naval Shipyard.
    Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBattleship View Post
    Ummm, I was at that ceremony also. As I recall, the ship was the Lane Victory. She's berthed only 5 miles away in Los Angeles Harbor.

    But I could be wrong. I didn't board her (not until a couple of years later in L.A.). I was more concerned about the final closure of my second home --- the Long Beach Naval Shipyard.
    You're right. Liberty ship, Victory ship, they all look alike to me. I was sure the ship came from San Pedro, but I couldn't find the name so I thought it was the other one because it was traveling extensively.

  7. #52
    Defense Professional RustyBattleship's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kato View Post
    Were there ever any Western naval surface-ship-launched ballistic missile projects other than the experimental Polaris mounts on an Italian cruiser in the 60s and the subsequent Italian Alfa project?

    Were there ever any comparable Eastern considerations, e.g. mounting R-13/15/21 on surface ships? (excepting post-Cold-War sea-based space launchers)
    The USS Chicago (CG-11), and her two sister ships were to have Polaris missile launchers installed but the project was cancelled to transfer the funding to Submarine launched Polaris, Poseidon and Trident missiles. I think the Norton Sound did one launch of a Polaris just as a test. That ship was a test ship for many projects including having the first VLS cell module installed.

    If memory serves (but sometimes the serving tray is spilled) I think I saw a photo of a V-2 rocket being fired from a ship. This was to be the first such test showing that IRBMs could be launced at sea.

    Presently we have a "Sea Launch" program going on now. The ships are berthed on the Mole of the former Long Beach Naval Shipyard. The rockets are loaded on the ship which then goes down to the equator for an Eastward launch using the greater rotation of the Earth at that latitude to help kick the bird on up and over.
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  8. #53
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    Supercavitation Torpedos

    After reading a few fiction books about supercavitation torpedos, and finding out that Iran has one, not to mention Russia and Germany which recently developed one, what ASW/anti-torpedo devices are capable of dealing with supercavitating torpedos?

  9. #54
    Defense Professional Dreadnought's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayfarer View Post
    After reading a few fiction books about supercavitation torpedos, and finding out that Iran has one, not to mention Russia and Germany which recently developed one, what ASW/anti-torpedo devices are capable of dealing with supercavitating torpedos?
    Using their own charateristics against themselves. There is a thread on this you just have to find it.
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  10. #55
    Defense Professional Dreadnought's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBattleship View Post
    The USS Chicago (CG-11), and her two sister ships were to have Polaris missile launchers installed but the project was cancelled to transfer the funding to Submarine launched Polaris, Poseidon and Trident missiles. I think the Norton Sound did one launch of a Polaris just as a test. That ship was a test ship for many projects including having the first VLS cell module installed.

    If memory serves (but sometimes the serving tray is spilled) I think I saw a photo of a V-2 rocket being fired from a ship. This was to be the first such test showing that IRBMs could be launced at sea.

    Presently we have a "Sea Launch" program going on now. The ships are berthed on the Mole of the former Long Beach Naval Shipyard. The rockets are loaded on the ship which then goes down to the equator for an Eastward launch using the greater rotation of the Earth at that latitude to help kick the bird on up and over.
    Rusty, that would be the Carrier Midway.

    On a cloudy September day, two years after the end of World War II, a captured German V-2 rocket was successfully test fired from the USS MIDWAY. This was a historic first in the annals of naval warfare.

    Naval records indicate the test took place several hundred miles off the East Coast of the United States with the country's top naval and civilian rocketry experts in attendance. The goal of the test? To determine if modern rockets could be fired from naval platforms and perform as intended. At that time, there was some question as to whether major modifications might be necessary for shipboard launches of missiles.

    The V-2 successfully lifted off the USS MIDWAY and was exploded about six miles away, just a few minutes after launch.

    Although the test took place on September 6, 1947, the results and photography were not released to the public until the next month, on October 13, 1947. Rear Admiral D.V. Gallery, Assistant Chief of Naval Operations for Guided Missiles, declared the test a success. The MIDWAY missile test is now considered to have been the dawn of naval missile warfare.

    USS Midway (CV 41)
    Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

  11. #56
    Military Professional dundonrl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kato View Post
    Were there ever any Western naval surface-ship-launched ballistic missile projects other than the experimental Polaris mounts on an Italian cruiser in the 60s and the subsequent Italian Alfa project?

    Were there ever any comparable Eastern considerations, e.g. mounting R-13/15/21 on surface ships? (excepting post-Cold-War sea-based space launchers)

    yes, the USS Observation Island test launched a Poseidon Fleet Ballstic Missile in 1969...



    The Secretary of the Navy takes pleasure in representing the MERITORIOUS UNIT COMMENDATION to USS OBSERVATION ISLAND (AG-154) for service as set forth in the following Citation: For meritorious service from 1 July to 16 December 1969 during at-sea operations in connection with the first successful at-sea firing of the POSEIDON Fleet Ballistic Missile. Throughout this period, the officers and men of USS OBSERVATION ISLAND carried out the required afloat tests and conducted complex and demanding operations in the essential support functions of POSEIDON flight testing, with exceptional competence and resourcefulness. The timely and highly successful conclusion of the at-sea test phase was a significant achievement expediting the availability to the United Sates of the most advanced and potent deterrent system. The teamwork and dedication to duty displayed by the officers and men of USS OBSERVATION ISLAND reflected credit upon themselves and were in keeping with the highest traditions of the United States Naval Service."

  12. #57
    Defense Professional Dreadnought's Avatar
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    The oldest Gunnery Target ship afloat used by all services for .50 cal on up the line. Located in Chesapeak Bay MD. The "Ex" USAS American Mariner. I think its pretty safe to say the US knew how to build solid ships.

    Her record.......
    Survey Ship Photo Index (AGM)

    What she looks like now.....
    Last edited by Dreadnought; 13 Sep 11, at 04:39.
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  13. #58
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    Sailor donates scrapbook of USS Wyoming history

    CASPER, Wyo. — A veteran of the battleship that bore Wyoming’s name came close to never talking about it.

    John A. Winters entered the U.S. Navy in 1943 and was initially assigned to a destroyer with submarine chasers based in Norfolk, Va., he said Tuesday.

    While waiting in an office, a full commander met him and told him the destroyer had been sunk by a German submarine about 50 miles east of Norfolk.

    “If I’d been on it, I would have been gone — boom,” Winters said while standing near a model of the USS Wyoming BB-32 at the Casper Events Center.

    After that, he served on the Wyoming, which was a training ship during the war, he said.

    He came to Casper from his home in Bowling Green, Ohio, via Dallas to donate his scrapbook of news stories, letters, photos and other memorabilia related to the ship to the city.

    Vice Mayor Kenyne Schlager formally accepted the collection.

    “This morning, the city is honored to accept this scrapbook,” Schlager said.

    The scrapbook illustrates what was the third ship to bear the Wyoming name.

    The Navy now has a Trident Class submarine of the same name, according to the documentary accompanying the model at the Events Center.

    William Cramp and Sons laid the keel of the Wyoming in February 1910. It was launched in May 1911 and joined the Atlantic Fleet in 1912, according to the Dictionary of American Fighting Ships.

    It was outfitted with 12 12-inch guns, 21 5-inch guns, two 3-inch guns and two 21-inch torpedo tubes.

    The Wyoming traveled to the newly opened Panama Canal, performed exercises at Guantanamo Bay Naval Base in Cuba and was sent to England to join the British Grand Fleet during World War I.

    World War II Navy veteran Stan Lowe said the Wyoming was stripped of most of its armaments to conform to the requirements of the 1930 London Treaty for armament reduction.

    It was converted to a training ship and did not see action during World War II.

    Its sister ship, the USS Arkansas, did participate in the war, including bombarding the French coast before D-Day.

    But the Wyoming served in the Chesapeake Bay as a training ship for 35,000 sailors who learned how to fire eight kinds of naval guns, said Winters, who held the rank of quartermaster.

    “We fired night and day,” he said. “As quartermaster, I was on the bridge all the time.”

    They were loud, too, he said. “You poked all the cotton in your ears you could get.”

    In January 1945, it went to New York to be fitted with armaments that would be used for training sailors to fight kamikaze planes, he said.

    The Wyoming — nicknamed the Chesapeake Raider — traveled a circuit from Delaware north on the Atlantic seaboard to New York, Maine, and Nova Scotia, Winters said.

    The ship was in Portland, Maine, when the Germans surrendered, and Winters said he remembers the sailors going to town to celebrate.

    The Wyoming was decommissioned in 1946 and sold for scrap in Philadelphia in 1947.

    Now 86, Winters has dedicated nearly 20 years to helping organize reunions of his shipmates, chronicling their history and keeping alive the history of what was the flagship of the Atlantic fleet.

    While it never saw action during World War II, he’s proud of its record, he said.

    “Our ship fired more ammunition than any ship in the world in training.”

    Read more: Sailor donates scrapbook of USS Wyoming history
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  14. #59
    In Memoriam/Battleship Enthusiast Defense Professional USSWisconsin's Avatar
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    Sailor donates scrapbook of USS Wyoming history
    It would be great if they would publish it - it could be scanned, compiled and possibly even generate some revenue for the City. I'd buy a copy - another option would be a website with the material. BB32 was a very interesting ship for sure - it was the Atlantic counterpart to the USS Utah, which was lost at Pearl Harbor.
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  15. #60
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    Does a modern day SSBN/ SSGN pose a threat to a Supercarrier? If yes, how much of a threat is it?
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