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Thread: Switzerland's "deportation initiative"

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    Switzerland's "deportation initiative"

    EU eyes Swiss deportation initiative. - swissinfo
    EU eyes Swiss deportation initiative

    Proposals to automatically expel foreign criminals from Switzerland are attracting the attention of European Union countries – Germany in particular.

    EU experts are especially interested in the potential outcome if either the People’s Party initiative or its counter-proposal is accepted.

    According to Jacques de Watteville, Switzerland's ambassador to Brussels, EU members are concerned that new Swiss legislation could challenge the free movement of people between the EU and Switzerland.

    The cabinet’s counter-proposal would respect the international agreement, de Watteville told journalists on Wednesday.

    The ambassador had been invited to speak to EU experts about Switzerland’s bilateral relationship with the EU. He told listeners not to forget that direct democracy is part of Switzerland’s political reality.

    On November 28, Swiss voters will decide whether foreign criminals should be deported automatically.
    The situation is by now actually quite a bit more serious than the above describes.

    Short explanation: Under the "deportation initiative" mentioned above, any Swiss resident without citizenship committing any crime would face deportation - after serving their term, if they get any - with a 15- to 20-year ban on reentry into Switzerland. Deportation would occur regardless of target country.

    A Swiss think tank ("Forum Auenpolitik") has now published a study on possible repercussions from this initiative. Several other law and political researchers have spoken out with very similar opinions to this study, often on behalf of political parties opposed to it.
    According to them:
    • the initiative violates the Swiss constitution.
    • the initiative violates - beyond that - the basics of Swiss legislation.
    • the initiative violates EU law.
    • the initiative violates International Law.
    • the EU would as a result of point 3 likely cancel the Schengen membership of Switzerland.
    • as a result of point 5, the "guillotine article" would cancel all bilateral treaties with the EU.
    • as a result of point 6, the entire Swiss economy would collapse overnight.
    • should point 5 not occur the EU would likely still enact harsh countermeasures based on previous experience


    The initiative comes from the Swiss People's Party (SVP), the same kind of racist neo-nazi party as the others favoured in all countries south of Germany for some reason (FP, Lega Nord etc). The same party already initiated the successful move to ban minarets in Switzerland last year.
    Current polls project the initiative being favoured by a 58% majority of Swiss citizens. Switzerland has a "direct democracy" system (violating a couple basic principles of democracy such as secret elections) that's highly susceptible to demagogic moves like this. The Swiss government has drafted a counter-initiative that's more in line with the Swiss constitution and EU law that according to polls would not have a chance of being accepted.
    Both the initiative and the counter-initiative will be voted on on November 28th.

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    how does deporting aliens who commit crimes break international or EU law?

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    And why would the Swiss economy collapse overnight?
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    Quote Originally Posted by kato View Post

    Short explanation: Under the "deportation initiative" mentioned above, any Swiss resident without citizenship committing any crime would face deportation - after serving their term, if they get any - with a 15- to 20-year ban on reentry into Switzerland.
    Actually according to the current version of the proposed law the entry ban would „only“ be 5-15 years. The 20 year ban is only for „repeat offenders“.

    Here is the text of the SVP version, based on the German version and translated by me...so please excuse any mistakes or odd formulations:



    (I)**The Federal Constitution from 18. April 1999 will be changed the following way:
    Art. 121 Section. 3-6 (new)
    3.They (Foreigners) lose, regardless of their legal status as foreigners their right of residence and all their legal claims to stay in Switzerland if they:
    a. commit a homicide, rape, serious sexual offense, violent offenses like robbery, human trafficking, drug dealing breaking and entering; and are legally sentenced; or
    b. illegally received benefits of the social insurance or wealthfare
    4.The legislative describes the offenses in Section 3 in more detail. He can add further offenses
    5.Foreigners who have lost their right of residence and legal claim to stay in Switzerland according to section 3 & 4 are to be deported from Switzerland by the responsible authorities and to be denied reentry for 5 – 15 years. In case of repeat offenders 20 years are to be applied.
    6.Who ignores the entry ban or enters Switzerland illegally by other means is committing a crime. The legislative remits the corresponding regulations.


    If anyone finds real translation feel free to replace my version.

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    Administrator Tarek Morgen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zraver View Post
    how does deporting aliens who commit crimes break international or EU law?
    Swiss as signed several bilateral treaties with the EU, among other things the treaty grants the right of free movement of EU citizens in Switzerland and the right of residence. While it is possible to revoke those rights under certain conditions the offenses mentioned in the LAW themselves are not enough (the person would have to be declared a danger to the general peace and order and to fulfil this it must be proven that said person is a continuing danger. Commting a simple crime is not enough). Also, to my understanding, this would have to be done on a case by case basis and not through an automated process as the proposed law demands.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parihaka View Post
    And why would the Swiss economy collapse overnight?
    If Switzerland breaks part of a treaty with the EU, the remaining ones would probably get nullified. This means that Switzerland loses acces to the common market of the EU. Due being surrounded by the EU (with the exception of Liechtenstein, whose economical impact I think we can ignore in this case) the vast majority of its trade is the EU. Without this trade the Swiss economy would indeed collapse. Of course this would not be great for the EU itself either, but Switzerland would suffer much more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zraver View Post
    how does deporting aliens who commit crimes break international or EU law?
    International Law: By deporting to countries where that person is threatened with death or other similar things.
    EU Law: EU jurisdiction has previously outlawed similar blanket deportation orders by its members. Multiple times. The mutual "open borders" treaty between Switzerland and the EU also only allows individual deportation based upon threats to security, public order or health, not blanket deportation orders like this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Parihaka View Post
    And why would the Swiss economy collapse overnight?
    Switzerland has a number of bilateral treaties with the EU giving it a special status regarding customs among other things. 60% of all Swiss exports (20% of Swiss GDP) go to EU countries, 80% of all Swiss imports come from EU countries.

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    uh Somehow I lost half of my Reply to Zraver. Here again the answer regarding Internatiol law:

    The Swiss constitution prohibts any law that would violate binding internatinal law (peremptory norm ). As the current version of the law allows people to be deported to countries even if they might face torture there it would violate internation law. As far as I know this is actually the difference between the SVP and the government version. The government version states that it would comply with international law, but without going into details.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen View Post
    If Switzerland breaks part of a treaty with the EU, the remaining ones would probably get nullified. This means that Switzerland loses acces to the common market of the EU. Due being surrounded by the EU (with the exception of Liechtenstein, whose economical impact I think we can ignore in this case) the vast majority of its trade is the EU. Without this trade the Swiss economy would indeed collapse. Of course this would not be great for the EU itself either, but Switzerland would suffer much more.
    So the EU has the legal right to impose a blockade on member nations under certain conditions? What about banking? There's an awful lot of private money tied up there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen View Post
    Of course this would not be great for the EU itself either, but Switzerland would suffer much more.
    Trade with Switzerland amounts to something like 1-2% of EU GDP - at most. Figures for Switzerland see my other post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Parihaka View Post
    So the EU has the legal right to impose a blockade on member nations under certain conditions? What about banking? There's an awful lot of private money tied up there.
    We (the EU) already forced Switzerland to enact some legislation regarding that. Switzerland is not a EU member.

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    'Foreigners' to the Swiss include those who've been there working and paying taxes for years, due to the country's incredibly strict (and subjective) citizenship laws. Also, the SVP is a party of racists, led by racists, for racists (cept for the more honourable but dwindling traditional agrarian wing which I'd imagine is embarrased by freaks like Christoph Blocher). I barely ever use the 'r' word, because just insulting people with it removes it's value. The SVP however, have fully earned it, and these initiatives are all about fermenting hate rather than solving genuine problems.
    Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative.
    - John Stuart Mill.

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    It would not be a blockade in the tradional sense (if I understand you right here, you mean a complete closed border). Instead Switzerland would be treated like any normal non EU country.

    Regarding the banks..I honestly have no clue how big the impact would be on the banking sector. Maybe Kato?

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    Quote Originally Posted by crooks View Post
    The SVP however, have fully earned it, and these initiatives are all about fermenting hate rather than solving genuine problems.
    The banner for this current initiative speaks for itself. They've been using this for a couple years.
    Attachment 22817

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    Trade with Switzerland amounts to something like 1-2% of EU GDP - at most. Figures for Switzerland see my other post.
    Of course the impact would be much smaller on the EU, but even only 1% of a 16 trillion GDP is quite a bit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen View Post
    Regarding the banks..I honestly have no clue how big the impact would be on the banking sector. Maybe Kato?
    Switzerland could become a banking haven again if the bilateral treaties are cut - those that allow EU countries to ask for info on people persecuted for evading taxation. Of course it would be an illegal banking haven from the EU perspective, and therefore result in... repercussions. Could be nasty.

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