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Thread: Terror attempt on US-bound airline

  1. #31
    Staff Emeritus Julie's Avatar
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    He was issued a multiple-entry U.S. visa issued in London on June 16, 2008 and due to expire in June 2010, BUT was refused a visa to enter Britain in May 2009 when he tried to apply for a course at a bogus college, Britain's Sunday Times newspaper said.(why the refusal?)

    He purchased his Lagos-Amsterdam Detroit return ticket at the KLM office in Accra, Ghana, on December 16 with a January 8, 2010 return date BUT he did not check in any baggage but was spotted with a shoulder bag. (that would tip me off).

    He passed through aviation security comprising a walk-through metal detector and baggage X-ray screening machine. He proceeded to the boarding gate where he went through secondary screening. 3 types of security screenings didnít detect a six-inch (15-cm) packet of powder and a syringe containing a liquid, which were sewn into the suspect's underwear. (amazing)

  2. #32
    Regular Countezero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tankie View Post
    Its already in place around the world , passport and automatic photo recognition , all known vermin are listed , once again LAX security
    I just flew international a few weeks ago, so bear with me.

    To check in, all I did was scan my passport to print my vouchers. Then, I walked to the security gate and went through the normal procedure. If I was not on a no-flight list, I fail to see where the system would have tripped me up. In other words, how did the officers at the security checkpoint know me from anyone else in the line? The answer is they didn't. I was just another passenger.

    If this guy was on a list that we think demands he gets extra scrutiny at the security checkpoint, then something is going to have to be put in place that notifies them the moment he swipes his passport. Right now, I don't think they have anything like that, but I could be mistaken.

    Quote Originally Posted by Julie View Post
    He passed through aviation security comprising a walk-through metal detector and baggage X-ray screening machine. He proceeded to the boarding gate where he went through secondary screening. 3 types of security screenings didn’t detect a six-inch (15-cm) packet of powder and a syringe containing a liquid, which were sewn into the suspect's underwear. (amazing)
    So what's the solution? Pat everyone down? Make everyone take their pants off?

  3. #33
    Banned tankie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Countezero View Post
    I just flew international a few weeks ago, so bear with me.

    To check in, all I did was scan my passport to print my vouchers. Then, I walked to the security gate and went through the normal procedure. If I was not on a no-flight list, I fail to see where the system would have tripped me up. In other words, how did the officers at the security checkpoint know me from anyone else in the line? The answer is they didn't. I was just another passenger.

    If this guy was on a list that we think demands he gets extra scrutiny at the security checkpoint, then something is going to have to be put in place that notifies them the moment he swipes his passport. Right now, I don't think they have anything like that, but I could be mistaken.

    So what's the solution? Pat everyone down? Make everyone take their pants off?
    There in lay the problem , he was on a list as a suspect , but was allowed to fly the answer then must be , ANY SUSPECTS , dont fly , or strip search , small price to pay IMO

  4. #34
    Regular Countezero's Avatar
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    Yes, but suspects on that list are allowed to fly -- or they would be on the no-fly list. I'm not disagreeing with what you're saying, what I am pointing out is that apparently, right now, there is no way to subject the people on this list to extra screening -- or to even alert the screeners that they need said screening.

  5. #35
    Banned tankie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Countezero View Post
    Yes, but suspects on that list are allowed to fly -- or they would be on the no-fly list. I'm not disagreeing with what you're saying, what I am pointing out is that apparently, right now, there is no way to subject the people on this list to extra screening -- or to even alert the screeners that they need said screening.
    I hope this throws more light on to the incident


    Reuters Vicki Allen



    There is no initial evidence that the Nigerian man charged with trying to blow up a U.S. passenger jet was involved in a larger plot, a senior U.S. official said on Sunday.

    But al Qaeda involvement is a "subject of investigation" in Friday's incident, U.S. homeland security chief Janet Napolitano said after U.S. authorities on Saturday charged Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, 23, with attempting to blow up the plane by setting alight an explosive device attached to his body.

    The suspect, who was being treated for burns at a Michigan hospital, was overpowered by passengers and crew on the Northwest Airlines plane from Amsterdam on Christmas Day with almost 300 people on board.

    "Well, right now we have no indication that it is part of anything larger. But obviously the investigation continues. And we have instituted more screening and what we call mitigation measures at airports," U.S. Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano told CNN's "State of the Union" program.

    Asked whether al Qaeda was involved in the incident, Napolitano told ABC's "This Week" program, "That is now the subject of investigation, and it would be inappropriate for me to say and inappropriate to speculate. So we will let the FBI and the criminal justice system now do their work."

    A senior U.S. official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said on Saturday authorities were looking at the possibility that Abdulmutallab had ties to al Qaeda in Yemen.

    Abdulmutallab is due to make his first court appearance at 2 p.m. EST (7 p.m. British time) on Monday in federal court in Detroit on a motion from prosecutors to take a sample of his DNA.

    Napolitano said U.S. authorities were reviewing current rules on who goes on official watch lists used to identify people who might pose security threats and was reviewing screening policies and technologies.

    The U.S. government created a record of Abdulmutallab last month in the intelligence community's central repository of information on known and suspected international terrorists, a U.S. official said on Saturday. But there was not enough negative data to put him on a "no-fly" list, the official said.

  6. #36
    Field mechanik Senior Contributor omon's Avatar
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    How to Save the Airlines
    Dump the male flight attendants. No one wanted them in the first place. Replace all the female flight attendants with good-looking strippers! What the hell -- They don't even serve food anymore, so what's the loss? The strippers would at least triple the alcohol sales and get a 'party atmosphere' going in the cabin. And, of course, every businessman in this country would start flying again, hoping to see naked women. Because of the tips, female flight attendants wouldn't need a salary, thus saving even more money. I suspect tips would be so good that we could charge the women for working the plane and have them kick back 20% of the tips, including lap dances and 'special services.' Muslims would be afraid to get on the planes for fear of seeing naked women. Hijackings would come to a screeching halt, and the airline industry would see record revenues. This is definitely a win-win situation if we handle it right -- a golden opportunity to turn a liability into an asset. Why didn't Bush think of this? Why do I still have to do everything myself? - Sincerely, Bill Clinton -
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" B. Franklin

  7. #37
    Banned tankie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by omon View Post
    How to Save the Airlines
    Dump the male flight attendants. No one wanted them in the first place. Replace all the female flight attendants with good-looking strippers! What the hell -- They don't even serve food anymore, so what's the loss? The strippers would at least triple the alcohol sales and get a 'party atmosphere' going in the cabin. And, of course, every businessman in this country would start flying again, hoping to see naked women. Because of the tips, female flight attendants wouldn't need a salary, thus saving even more money. I suspect tips would be so good that we could charge the women for working the plane and have them kick back 20% of the tips, including lap dances and 'special services.' Muslims would be afraid to get on the planes for fear of seeing naked women. Hijackings would come to a screeching halt, and the airline industry would see record revenues. This is definitely a win-win situation if we handle it right -- a golden opportunity to turn a liability into an asset. Why didn't Bush think of this? Why do I still have to do everything myself? - Sincerely, Bill Clinton -

  8. #38
    Banned Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
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    I hereby nominate omon's post above as the best post ever on the WAB for any reason, for all time.

    The Lord High Hulabalooster has spoken.

    -dale

  9. #39
    Banned Defense Professional Bluesman's Avatar
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    Anybody hear about THIS one?

    Police Arrest 'Disruptive' Passenger Aboard Plane at Detroit Airport
    Sunday , December 27, 2009



    ADVERTISEMENTPolice have arrested a Nigerian airline passenger following a disruption on the same Detroit-bound flight that was attacked Christmas Day by another Nigerian man who attempted to blow up the aircraft while in flight.

    Several police vehicles and a police command unit have surrounded a Northwest Airlines plane at Detroit's Metro Airport Sunday after the pilot on the flight requested emergency help. The man reportedly became verbally disruptive and barricaded himself in the bathroom for an hour.

    Two sources tell Fox News that the suspect boarded a plan in Lagos, Nigeria, with no baggage, and said the FBI has already sent an e-mail alert to other federal agencies notifying them of the incident.

    A source told Fox News tjay the man taken into custody at the Detroit airport was a Nigerian national in his 30s. Federal officials know who the suspect is, but won't provide any more details.

    There are some reports suggesting that the man, who reportedly barricaded himself in the plane's bathroom for an huor, may just have been a sick passenger.

    Detroit's Metro Airport spokesman John Wintner said there was a report of suspicious activity on the Delta/Northwest Airlines Flight 253 from Amsterdam Sunday. That is the same flight that Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, a 23-year-old Nigerian man, was suspected of attempting to blow up over Detroit on Christmas Day.

    Federal officials are trying to determine whether there is any connection between the disturbance Sunday and the attempted bombing Friday, when Abdulmutallab was subdued by passengers and arrested on the ground in Detroit.

    White House spokesman Bill Burton said President Obama was notified of the disturbance Sunday as federal officials began reviewing airline security measures.

    "The President was notified shortly after 9:00 a.m. Hawaiian time of the incident regarding an unruly passenger on the flight arriving in Detroit by NSS chief of staff Denis McDonough," Burton said. "The President stressed the importance of maintaining heightened security measures for all air travel and gave instructions to set up another secure teleconference briefing as soon as possible."

    All 257 passengers and 12 crew have deplaned safely, said Delta spokeswoman Susan Elliott. The flight landed in Detroit at 12:34 p.m. Sunday.

    The plane has been moved to a remote location at the airport so authorities can conduct additional screening, Reuters reported.
    It could've happened AGAIN, just this morning. Same flight. And what if the first guy had done this: barricaded himself in the lav, THEN hit the trigger?

    Might have actually succeeded, THAT'S what.

    And you simply will not believe the Napolitano take on this, so you'll have to watch this yourself to believe it:

    RealClearPolitics - Video - Napolitano On Failed Terror Attempt: "The System Worked"

  10. #40
    Banned Defense Professional Bluesman's Avatar
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    Fire Napolitano [Jonah Goldberg]


    Understandbly, the White House is trying very hard to get out in front of the would-be Christmas bomber story. The head of the Department of Homeland Security isn't helping. I watched her on three shows and each time she was more annoying, maddening and absurd than the pevious appearance. It is her basic position that the "system worked" because the bureaucrats responded properly after the attack. That the attack was "foiled" by a bad detonator and some civilian passengers is proof, she claims, that her agency is doing everything right. That is just about the dumbest thing she could say, on the merits and politically. I would wager that not one percent of Americans think the system is "working" when terrorists successfully get bombs onto planes (and succeed in activating them). Probably even fewer think it's fair that they have to take off their shoes, endure delays and madness while a known Islamic radical ó turned in by his own father ó can waltz onto a plane (and into the country). DHS had no role whatsoever in assuring that this bomb didn't go off. By her logic if the bomb had gone off, the system would have "worked" since it has done everything right.

    Napolitano has a habit of arguing that DHS is a first responder outfit. Its mission is to deal with "man-caused-disasters" afer they occur. It appears she really believes it. If the White House wants to assure people that it takes the war on terror seriously (a term Robert Gibbs used this morning by the way), they could start by firing this patenly unqualified hack.
    Some of us have known all along that she was an unqualified affirmative action hire (a lot like her boss). It wouldn't matter quite so much, except that her position is vital to the first duty of any legitimate government. (For those of the liberal persuasion, that means NATIONAL SECURITY, and NOT condom distribution in grade schools.) If they were determined to have lesbian in the Cabinet, maybe she should've been given the Secretary of Tearing Down Old, Oppressive Values and Out-Dated, Narrow-Minded Societal Norms position.

    I hate this mal-Adminstration. They're going to get us killed.

  11. #41
    Dirty Kiwi Senior Contributor
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    So the system is to leave it up to random chance that someone capable of protecting their fellow passengers might be on board. Good to know.
    In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility

    Gottfried Leibniz

  12. #42
    Banned Defense Professional Bluesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parihaka View Post
    So the system is to leave it up to random chance that someone capable of protecting their fellow passengers might be on board. Good to know.
    Suppose NO bomb had been involved. A suicidally-committed jihadi would've walked off the plane and into Detroit, and would've been protected and aided by his brothers HERE, in this country.

    The system worked.

    God Almighty.

  13. #43
    Dirty Kiwi Senior Contributor
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesman View Post
    Suppose NO bomb had been involved. A suicidally-committed jihadi would've walked off the plane and into Detroit, and would've been protected and aided by his brothers HERE, in this country.

    The system worked.

    God Almighty.
    Pretty much. You would have thought the double whammy of his father saying he was dangerous plus the UK government refusing him entry to Britain might have been a trigger for the visa people, but no.
    Last edited by Parihaka; 27 Dec 09, at 22:25.
    In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility

    Gottfried Leibniz

  14. #44
    Banned Defense Professional Bluesman's Avatar
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    We seem to have learned nothing. I see evidence all around that the same stupidity and self-defeating methods that everybody seemed so aghast at in the days following 9/11 are not just still in-place, they're being added to, not being eliminated.

    Some of the hammer-'n'-tongs arguments we've had here on this Board tell me that even seemingly-intelligent people that actually pay attention to these issues simply are not focused on the job we've got in front of us.

    We are going to be killed in small numbers, until we're killed in LARGE numbers, and then MAYBE, IF IF IF the damned liberals will even allow it even then, MAYBE we'll serious up and do this thing like our enemies do: with a focus toward actually WINNING.

  15. #45
    Staff Emeritus Julie's Avatar
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    Detroit explosive common, easily detectible

    The Associated Press
    Sunday, December 27, 2009; 4:34 PM

    WASHINGTON -- The explosive device used by the would-be Detroit bomber contained a widely available - and easily detected - chemical explosive that has a long history of terrorist use, according to government officials and explosive experts.

    The chemical - PETN - is small, powerful and appealing to terrorists. The Saudi government said it was used in an assassination attempt on the country's counterterrorism operations chief in August.

    It was also a component of the explosive that Richard Reid, the convicted "shoe bomber," used in his 2001 attempt to down an airliner.

    PETN was widely used in the plastic explosives terrorists used to blow up airplanes in the 1970s and 1980s.

    Investigators say Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab hid an explosive device on his body when he traveled from Amsterdam to Detroit. They say PETN was hidden in a condom or condom-like bag just below his torso.

    Abdulmutallab also had a syringe filled with liquid. One law enforcement official said the second part of the explosive concoction used in the Christmas Day incident is still being tested but appears to be a glycol-based liquid explosive.

    PETN is the primary ingredient in detonating cords used for industrial explosions and can be collected by scraping the insides of the wire, said James Crippin, a Colorado explosives expert. It's also used in military devices and found in blasting caps. It's the high explosive of choice because it is stable and safe to handle, but it requires a primary explosive to detonate it, he said.

    Crippin and law enforcement officials said modern airport screening machines could have detected the chemical. Airport "puffer" machines - the devices that blow air onto a passenger to collect and analyze residues - would probably have detected the powder, as would bomb-sniffing dogs or a hands-on search using a swab.

    However, most passengers in airports only go through magnetometers, which detect metal rather than explosives.

    Hidden in Abdulmutallab's clothing, the explosive might have also been detected by the full-body imaging scanners now making their way into airports.

    But Abdulmutallab did not go through full-body imaging machines in Nigeria or Amsterdam, said Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y. King has been briefed on the investigation.

    Both airports have body scanners. The Amsterdam airport has had a long reputation for good security, King said, while Nigeria's airports have been more of a concern.

    The U.S. provided full-body scanners to all four international airports in Nigeria, according to the State Department. The scanners were installed in March, May and June of 2008.

    Abdulmutallab was on a broad U.S. terrorist watch list but he was not designated for special screening measures or placed on a no-fly list because of a dearth of specific information about his activities, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said Sunday. She said he was properly screened before getting on the aircraft in Amsterdam.

    The Saudi Arabia assassination attempt was carried out by a Saudi who was on the country's list of 85 most wanted terrorists. The bomber was believed to have traveled to Yemen to connect with the al-Qaida franchise there. The bomber died in the explosion.

    Detroit explosive common, easily detectible - washingtonpost.com

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