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  • The S-300 Issue

    Can someone explain to me what precisely the S-300 SAM system has that makes it a game-changer?

  • #2
    The (untested in combat)capability to cause heavy losses to IAF.Keep in mind that any air attack will probably be carried with 80-100 airplanes at best(because of air refueling).Kill a couple dozens airplanes (and kill/capture their pilots) and the game is almost over for IAF.
    Those who know don't speak
    He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Mihais View Post
      The (untested in combat)capability to cause heavy losses to IAF.Keep in mind that any air attack will probably be carried with 80-100 airplanes at best(because of air refueling).Kill a couple dozens airplanes (and kill/capture their pilots) and the game is almost over for IAF.
      So, what specifically does the S-300/SA-10 have that can do that?

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      • #4
        S-300 PMU2 Favorit,


        IIRC,s-300 has a kill probability(theoretically) >0.8.Older SAM's,like the SAM-6 have a kill probability against modern aircraft of ~0.3 or lower.However AD is not my field,so I might be wrong a little.
        Those who know don't speak
        He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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        • #5
          A higher kill probability, I buy that. Is there any particular piece of tech that gives that, though. That's what I'm wondering.

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          • #6
            I found your Q interestin S/H so i got this courtesy of wiki , if it helps .



            Not to be confused with S-300VM.



            Type long-range strategic SAM system


            The S-300 is a series of Russian long range surface-to-air missile systems produced by the Almaz Scientific Industrial Corporation all based on the initial S-300P version. The S-300 system was developed to defend against aircraft and cruise missiles for the Soviet Air Defence Forces. Subsequent variations were developed to intercept ballistic missiles.

            The S-300 system was first deployed by the USSR in 1979, designed for the air defense of large industrial and administrative facilities, military bases, and control of airspace against enemy strike aircraft.

            The project-managing developer of the S-300 is Russian Almaz corporation (government owned, aka "KB-1") which is currently a part of "Almaz-Antei" Air Defense Concern. S-300 uses missiles developed by MKB "Fakel" design bureau (a separate government corporation, aka "OKB-2").

            The S-300 is also capable of destroying ballistic missile targets, and is regarded as one of the most potent anti-aircraft missile systems currently fielded.

            Its radars have the ability to simultaneously track up to 100 targets while engaging up to 12. S-300 deployment time is five minutes.

            The S-300 missiles are sealed rounds and require no maintenance over their lifetime. An evolved version of the S-300 system is the S-400 (NATO reporting name SA-21), entering service in 2004
            Last edited by tankie; 26 Sep 09,, 17:50.

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            • #7
              S300V SA-12 Giant. A Russian comparison between Patriot and S-300.And you also should look at this one YouTube - ALMAZ-ANTEY Russia antiair force ??????? ??? ?????-????? - promo video 2006 year
              Those who know don't speak
              He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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              • #8
                So, it's basically just very advanced?

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                • #9
                  In terms of anti-battlefield and anti-theater missile capability, the Russian S-300V is unrivaled
                  Yeah. Because the S-300V has shot down so many things in actual combat, and Patriot hasn't. Marketing :)

                  The original S-300 system was capable of simultaneously attacking 6 targets, IIRC; and currently the F-16E fields a jamming pod that is reputed to be capable of dealing with said system.

                  There is no question that the S-300 is a potentially very dangerous weapon - if you want to see how dangerous, look up Patriot's exploits.

                  Same thing.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by GGTharos View Post
                    Yeah. Because the S-300V has shot down so many things in actual combat, and Patriot hasn't. Marketing :)
                    The S300 article on that link reads like a tri-fold pamphlet a door to door salesman would hand you while trying to sell you a vacuum cleaner;):)).
                    "Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the people alone. The people themselves, therefore, are its only safe depositories." Thomas Jefferson

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                    • #11
                      Hey,Patriot managed to shoot down a Brit bird.Truth is neither is truly tested(against some advanced opponent),so all we have at this moment are presumtions about theoretical capabilities(S-300) and a couple of Scuds for Patriot(with the inept Iraqi launching single missiles instead of salvos).Hell,even old SAM's have a better track record-modernized SA-2 or 3 got one F-117.So leadership,training and tactics are the real game changer,not technology per se(and also sun rises everyday).
                      Those who know don't speak
                      He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Silent Hunter View Post
                        So, it's basically just very advanced?
                        What makes it advanced is the radar, the Big Bird is a large phased array radar with sidelobe prevention and frequency hopping capability that make it very hard to jam. It can detect 200 targets and engage 12, although 2 missiles for 6 targets is SOP. Apparently Israel played with the S-300 on Cyprus but that is an older model than the Big Bird radar so it wouldn't do much good if Iran gets it. The S-300PMU2 comes with 150km range missiles which combined with this radar make it a very potent weapon. If we were to compare it to an American system it would probably be in the SPY-1A class. Hit probabilities for aircraft range from .8 to .93 while cruise missiles are .8 to .98. Just to give it a straight .8 means you die considering they fire two at every track. The system has also been used to shoot down Scud-Cs so it has a limited ABM capability. Considering Israel has yet to recieve F-35, I would be quite worried if I was planning a strike.

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