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  • One point I never understood: why does such a small, light ship need TWO medium helicopters?! That's overkill! And expensive as hell...

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    • Originally posted by gunnut View Post
      They're like a mini, stealthy, super fast LPD-18.
      Expensive, overweight...

      They look more like someone tried to cram an LPD, cruiser, and FAC in a light frigate hull...

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      • Their only point is shuttling around those helos, with only one they'd be kinda useless other than for patrol...

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        • Originally posted by jlvfr View Post
          One point I never understood: why does such a small, light ship need TWO medium helicopters?! That's overkill! And expensive as hell...
          Think of them as high speed transports. That large cargo hold and flight deck is very useful useful for deploying drones and special ops. They're like a mini, stealthy, super fast LPD-18.
          "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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          • Originally posted by Stitch View Post
            Well, whatever happens, this does make the Austal design look better and, IMO, it IS a better design. However, just like everything else, I'm betting the Navy goes with the "inferior" design, and decides to build the next 6 hulls of the semi-planing monohull type (though I hope not!).
            I'd put money on the Navy going with the safer, more conventional design. Is there a lot of data on an Austal-design over a ship's 30 year life span, with the type of use/abuse that a navy hull will endure?

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            • My primary concern is when a design is actually picked, that the DOD is taking the winning design to bid out to various yards to actually build (for best price). How many yards will know what they are doing with an Independence Class? The Freedom Class is a conventional design that almost any yard should be able to make. So I think the DOD may be stacking the deck against LCS-2 class. That is unless the early LCS-1 deployment shows that it is less than desirable?

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              • Originally posted by surfgun View Post
                My primary concern is when a design is actually picked, that the DOD is taking the winning design to bid out to various yards to actually build (for best price). How many yards will know what they are doing with an Independence Class? The Freedom Class is a conventional design that almost any yard should be able to make. So I think the DOD may be stacking the deck against LCS-2 class. That is unless the early LCS-1 deployment shows that it is less than desirable?
                True enough, but there are suprisingly more than enough decent sized yards that specialize in Aluminum hull construction (Gladding Hearn, VT Halter) who could concieveably be called on to supply modular compartments for final assembly at the major yards. Gladding Hearn (Somerset MA) could send hull forms by barge to Bath, and the same could be done for VT Halter from their Pascagoula facility to Austal's Mobile yard and GD Pascagoula.
                You know JJ, Him could do it....

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                • Originally posted by Rumrunner View Post
                  True enough, but there are suprisingly more than enough decent sized yards that specialize in Aluminum hull construction (Gladding Hearn, VT Halter) who could concieveably be called on to supply modular compartments for final assembly at the major yards. Gladding Hearn (Somerset MA) could send hull forms by barge to Bath, and the same could be done for VT Halter from their Pascagoula facility to Austal's Mobile yard and GD Pascagoula.
                  Plus, IF aluminum-hull construction is where the future lies (and I think it does), then this is the perfect time for the other yards to get on-board with aluminum-hull construction.
                  "There is never enough time to do or say all the things that we would wish. The thing is to try to do as much as you can in the time that you have. Remember Scrooge, time is short, and suddenly, you're not there any more." -Ghost of Christmas Present, Scrooge

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                  • Originally posted by jlvfr View Post
                    One point I never understood: why does such a small, light ship need TWO medium helicopters?! That's overkill! And expensive as hell...
                    The helicopters are the ship's weapons systems. The only weapons the ship has are the 57mm gun and the SeaRAM.
                    F/A-18E/F Super Hornet: The Honda Accord of fighters.

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                    • Originally posted by BenRoethig View Post
                      The helicopters are the ship's weapons systems. The only weapons the ship has are the 57mm gun and the SeaRAM.
                      I know, but...

                      I keep thinking of the Israeli Saar 5
                      Saar 5

                      Look at what's crammed into little more than 1200 tons, one heli included...

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                      • Originally posted by BenRoethig View Post
                        The helicopters are the ship's weapons systems. The only weapons the ship has are the 57mm gun and the SeaRAM.
                        . . . . . and a couple of BMG's on the corners of the heli deck.
                        "There is never enough time to do or say all the things that we would wish. The thing is to try to do as much as you can in the time that you have. Remember Scrooge, time is short, and suddenly, you're not there any more." -Ghost of Christmas Present, Scrooge

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                        • Originally posted by jlvfr View Post
                          I know, but...

                          I keep thinking of the Israeli Saar 5
                          Saar 5

                          Look at what's crammed into little more than 1200 tons, one heli included...
                          Let's see that thing negotiate the north Atlantic in winter for a month at a time.
                          "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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                          • Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                            Let's see that thing negotiate the north Atlantic in winter for a month at a time.
                            2 points:
                            - the Saar is built as a Litoral ship; isn't that what the LCS is all about?...
                            - the LCS has twice the tonnage, plenty of room for what the Saar has, a 2nd heli and a stronger hull...

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                            • Originally posted by jlvfr View Post
                              2 points:
                              - the Saar is built as a Litoral ship; isn't that what the LCS is all about?...
                              - the LCS has twice the tonnage, plenty of room for what the Saar has, a 2nd heli and a stronger hull...
                              LCS might be for littoral combat, but the USN deploys all over the world. LCS needs to be able to handle months of deployment time, and half way across the world.

                              Saar 5 probably will never be out of the calm waters of Mediterranean.
                              "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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                              • Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                                LCS might be for littoral combat, but the USN deploys all over the world. LCS needs to be able to handle months of deployment time, and half way across the world.

                                Saar 5 probably will never be out of the calm waters of Mediterranean.
                                You can't have everything... you need "months of deployment time"? And I bet the LCS won't be alone? Put a support ship in the area, or a bigger ship that can stay there.

                                The LCS is trying to be a "jack of all trades" AND "a master of all" AND "have long range". No wonder it's so over priced and riddled with problems.

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