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  • #31
    Originally posted by gimini View Post
    Have you look inside the vessel, how you know about the Ship condition
    Ever read Naval reports on the subject? I didnt think so. Now go play.

    Only two are on the naval register and 1 of them is going nowhere especially in a hurry.

    Kirov class battlecruiser

    Career
    Ordered:
    Laid down: June 1973
    Launched: 26 December 1977
    Commissioned: 30 December 1980
    Decommissioned: N/A
    Fate: Active in service as of 2005

    The Project 1144 Orlan (meaning Sea eagle) class nuclear powered missile cruisers, are some of the largest and most powerful surface warships of the Russian Navy, though they were originally built for the Soviet Navy. In the western countries they are usually known by their NATO designation Kirov, after the lead ship of the class, the battlecruiser Kirov. They are among the biggest warships in the world, second only to aircraft carriers, and are similar in size to a World War I battleship.

    Although some call the Kirov a battlecruiser or battleship because of this, the Kirov lacks the characteristic heavy armour. Soviet and Russian naval analysts always referred to it as a "large missile cruiser." It is more appropriate to consider the Kirov a super-sized guided missile cruiser, analogous to the Alaska-class cruiser which had the displacement and armament of a battlecruiser but otherwise was more similar to a heavy cruiser in mission and construction. The appearance of the Kirov class was a significant factor in the U.S. Navy recommissioning the Iowa class.


    Armament
    This ship has an impressive armament of missiles and guns as well as electronics. Its largest radar antenna is mounted on its foremast, and called "Top Pair" by NATO. The Kirov class's main weapons are 20 × SS-N-19 Shipwreck missiles mounted on deck, designed to engage large surface targets, and air defense is provided for with 12 × S-300F launchers with 96 missiles, 2 × Osa-MA with 40 missiles, 4 × 9K331 Tor and the Kashstan air-defence missile/gun system.

    Other weapons are the automatic 130 mm AK-130 gun system, 30 mm AK-630, 10 × torpedo/missile tubes, Udav-1 with 40 anti-submarine rockets and the 2 × RBU-1000 six-tube launchers.

    Deployment
    The lead ship, Kirov (renamed Admiral Ushakov in 1992 for political reasons) was laid down in June of 1973 at Leningrad's Baltiysky Naval Shipyard, launched on December 26, 1977 and commissioned on December 30, 1980. When she appeared for the first time in 1981, NATO observers called her BALCOM I (Baltic Combatant I).

    Kirov suffered a reactor accident in 1990 while serving in the Mediterranean Sea. Repairs were never carried out, due to lack of funds and the changing political situation in the Soviet Union. She may have been cannibalized as a spare parts cache for the other ships in her class.

    In 1984 the second ship in the Kirov class, Frunze, was completed. She was assigned to the Pacific Fleet. In 1991, she was renamed Admiral Lazarev. The ship became inactive in 1994 and was decommissioned four years later.

    Kalinin was the third Kirov-class ship to enter service, in 1988. She was also assigned to the Northern Fleet. Renamed to Admiral Nakhimov, the ship was mothballed in 1999 and reactivated in 2005.

    Construction of the fourth ship, Yuri Andropov encountered many delays; her construction started in 1986 but wasn't completed until ten years later, in 1996, whereforth she was christened Pyotr Velikiy (Peter the Great). The ship has been declared the flagship of the Russian Northern Fleet.

    On March 23, 2004, the Russian Northern Fleet Chief Commander, Admiral Vladimir Kuroedov said that Pyotr Velikiy's reactor was in an extremely bad condition and could explode "at any moment." This statement was later withdrawn and may have been the result of internal politics within the Russian Navy, as Admiral Igor Kasatonov (the uncle of Pyotr Velikiy commander Vladimir Kasatanov) was testifying in the court hearings on the loss of the K-159 and the Kursk disaster.

    The ship was sent to port for a month, and the crew lost one-third of their pay. Examinations found no problems with the ship's reactor.

    The fifth ship, to be known as Dzerzhinsky, also ran into delays. Her name was changed to October Revolution, and then Kuznetsov, and later scrapped while incomplete.

    Hull numbers have remained the same but the vessels names have changed with Russian politics.
    Last edited by Dreadnought; 02 Oct 08,, 15:04.
    Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by gimini View Post
      What US cruiser that can be
      A choice few of the latest. Do your own homework.;)
      Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by chakos View Post
        Yet the Russians seem to be going for it big time.. oh and also, whens the last time a Harpoon was used in anger, or a Standard for that matter. Unless you know a lot that i dont then we are all going on spec sheets here. You cant compare Russian monkey model tanks manned by monkey model soldiers and extrapulate that out to mean that all Russian hardware underperforms.
        Operation Praying Mantis in 1988
        Gulf of Sidra Incident in 1986

        Which begs the question, when was the last time the Shipwreck was used in combat? For the matter, when was the last time the Shipwreck was used in a live fire test?

        Large missiles can also sink small ships, i just believe when there are countries like China and Russia pumping large amounts of money into their militaries you shouldnt be so preocupied with the whole WOT and making everything networkcentric and spend some time money and research introducing more traditional warfighting tools.
        A harpoon hit on the Kirov's many many missile batteries will result in catastrophic damage.

        What makes you think the US is not spending time and money on traditional war fighting methods? Network centric warfare is used ton inhanced the US military's traditional war fighting methods.

        The Russia of 1988 could wipe the floor of the Russia of 2008 in terms of capability, war fighting, and power projection.
        Last edited by IDonT; 02 Oct 08,, 16:31.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by IDonT View Post
          Operation Praying Mantis in 1988
          Gulf of Sidra Incident in 1986

          Which begs the question, when was the last time the Shipwreck was used in combat? For the matter, when was the last time the Shipwreck was used in a live fire test?



          A harpoon hit on the Kirov's many many missile batteries will result in catastrophic damage.

          What makes you think the US is not spending time and money on traditional war fighting methods? Network centric warfare is used ton inhanced the US military's traditional war fighting methods.

          The Russia of 1988 could wipe the floor of the Russia of 2008 in terms of capability, war fighting, and power projection.
          *The club missle was another to add to the list of junk. It failed many tests by both the Russians and the Indian navies until recalled for corrective actions.

          "The Russia of 1988 could wipe the floor of the Russia of 2008 in terms of capability, war fighting, and power projection."

          Most agreed they are nowhere near that capability today.
          Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

          Comment


          • #35
            In contrast to Peter the Great, the newest Aegis model will be fitted on USS Bunker Hill with the SM-6 missile

            Aegis Open Architecture Delivers Again on the Range : Naval Forces : Defense News Air Force Army Navy News

            The Aegis system has conducted over 3,500 live fire test and actual combat firings. How many S-300 missiles have been fired since its inception?

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            • #36
              Admiral Nakhimov

              Latest news :

              Nuclear-powered cruiser ready for new fuel
              BarentsObserver.com, 2008-10-01

              The Sevmash yard in Severodvinsk, Arkhangelsk Oblast, has started the discharging of spent nuclear fuel from the cruiser “Admiral Nakhimov”. The vessel has been moored by the yard since 1999 awaiting the operation.
              According to the Sevmash press service, the operation is conducted by local specialists together with representatives of the Nizhny Novgorod-based company OKBM Afrikantov and the crew of a support vessel from the Belomorye navy base.

              Lack of funding has forced the Navy to let heavy cruiser lie moored in Severodvinsk for the last nine years. The 24,500 ton vessel still remains in good shape thanks to regular maintenance from Sevmash.

              The Admiral Nakhimov is 251 meter long. It has two reactors. The main military hardware is “Granit” cruiser missile, the “Fort” anti-aircraft missile, as well as the “Osa-MA” and “Vodopad” missiles. The ship also has three Ka-27 helicopters, Sevmash informs.

              Link
              NUCLEAR FUEL DISCHARGE
              Sevmash Press Release
              2008-09-29 14:10:00

              Waste nuclear fuel is being discharged from “Admiral Nakhimov” board.

              Discharge is going on in standard mode. Together with PO “Sevmash” specialists and cruiser crew, representatives Design named after Afrikantov, crew of specialized ship of Belomorskaya Naval Base take part in these operations.

              Heavy nuclear missile cruiser “Admiral Nakhimov” came at Sevmash in 1999. But due to poor financing scheduled repair was delayed. All this time crew and enterprise maintained the ship in good condition. In 2008 repairing schedule was updated and it became possible to speed up works.

              Heavy cruiser “Admiral Nakhimov” (until 1992 “Kalinin”) was built at Baltic plant in Leningrad, it was taken within Naval Fleet in 1988. It is meant for destructing surface targets, anti-air craft and anti-missile defence.

              Displacement – 24500 tons, length – 251 m, power plant– 2 nuclear reactors of total capacity 600 MW, cruise missiles of “Granit” complex, anti-aircraft missile complex “Fort”, anti-air craft system “OSA-MA”, anti-submarine complex “Vodopad”, artillery unit АК-130, 3 helicopters Ка-27 (reference book “Combat ships of the world”, Moscow, 2003).

              Mikhail STAROZHILOV,
              Head of OAO “PO “Sevmash” press cutting service
              Photo by Maxim VORKUNKOV

              Link

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              • #37
                Originally posted by NUS View Post
                What's the range of Harpoons and Kirov's missiles?
                Also, i've heard what SAMs are not the only way to defend a ship. What about anti-missile cannons? (Dont know their names, sorry.)
                Harpoon is around 100nm, P-700 Granit (aka the SS-N-19 "Shipwreck") has a range of around 300nm.

                Close-In Weapons Systems (the cannons) are last-ditch weapons and not effective at long range.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Peter the Great

                  Latest news :

                  Russian Navy Ships to Visit Tripoli, Other Mediterranean Ports en Route to Venezuela
                  MOSCOW October 1, 2008 (AP)
                  The Associated Press

                  Russia's navy says its warships will visit Libya and other Mediterranean countries en route to Venezuela. A nuclear-powered missile cruiser and several accompanying ships will sail through the Strait of Gibraltar into the Mediterranean on Sunday.

                  Navy spokesman Capt. Igor Dygalo said in a statement Wednesday the Russian ships will call at the Libyan port of Tripoli and also visit several other unspecified Mediterranean ports before heading to Venezuela.

                  Link

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                  • #39
                    Displacement – 24500 tons, length – 251 m, power plant– 2 nuclear reactors of total capacity 600 MW, cruise missiles of “Granit” complex, anti-aircraft missile complex “Fort”, anti-air craft system “OSA-MA”, anti-submarine complex “Vodopad”, artillery unit АК-130, 3 helicopters Ка-27 (reference book “Combat ships of the world”, Moscow, 2003).


                    Just in asking Shipwreck, How come no mention of her back up steam boilers?
                    Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Silent Hunter View Post
                      Harpoon is around 100nm, P-700 Granit (aka the SS-N-19 "Shipwreck") has a range of around 300nm.

                      Close-In Weapons Systems (the cannons) are last-ditch weapons and not effective at long range.

                      But the S-300MF Fort-M unlike other S-300PMU type missiles can be used in a surface role.

                      Those Kirovs are paper thin and if something offensive makes contact with the hull its all over but damn they pack a wollop.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by chakos View Post
                        The Kirovs, the Slavas, the Sovromenny's the Oscars. All carry large supersonic anti shipping missiles

                        But only the Kirovs are large ships. The "Point" that you were arguing (US has no large AShM) SO once again, why would the US waste money on developing a missile to kill a class of ships that only have 2 ships?

                        Of which only 1 works.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Gun Grape View Post
                          But only the Kirovs are large ships. The "Point" that you were arguing (US has no large AShM) SO once again, why would the US waste money on developing a missile to kill a class of ships that only have 2 ships?

                          Of which only 1 works.
                          The Slava is also a class of cruisers and the Sovromenny is a cruiser in all but name. They are all large ships.
                          The best part of repentance is the sin

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by chakos View Post
                            The Slava is also a class of cruisers and the Sovromenny is a cruiser in all but name. They are all large ships.
                            Slava and Sovromenny are not on par with the Kirov class.
                            And certainly nothing that would constitute the US to dedicate a missle program to kill or mission kill it can be done with whats on the shelf.;)
                            Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by chakos View Post
                              The Slava is also a class of cruisers and the Sovromenny is a cruiser in all but name. They are all large ships.
                              Judging by tonnage:

                              Slava: 11,500 tons
                              Sovremmeny: 7,900 tons (smaller than US destroyers)
                              Udaloy: 7,900 tons (smaller than US destroyers)

                              Compared this to USN
                              Burke:
                              8,315 tons full load (Flight I)
                              8,400 tons full load (Flight II)
                              9,200 tons full load (Flight IIA)

                              Ticonderoga: 9,600 tons

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by IDonT View Post
                                Judging by tonnage:

                                Slava: 11,500 tons
                                Sovremmeny: 7,900 tons (smaller than US destroyers)
                                Udaloy: 7,900 tons (smaller than US destroyers)

                                Compared this to USN

                                Ticonderoga: 9,600 tons
                                And remember that the Ticos were DDGs before the big "Cruiser Gap" had them redesignated.

                                A Slava has about the Displacement as our "Real Cruisers" The California and Va. classes.

                                They are not large ships. Maybe a little larger than our cruisers but not enough to develop a big honking missile for.

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