MP7 vs. P90

[Terran empire]

Yup shot guns are better for room clearance. a Tankers personal weapon should be a Carbine with a folding but stock but i guess that is hard to do with m16's.
A DE is a Piece of artillery. It has more then nice power and range. the perfect choice for a A10 driver.

[Tinkertoys]

Yup shot guns are better for room clearance. a Tankers personal weapon should be a Carbine with a folding but stock but i guess that is hard to do with m16's.
A DE is a Piece of artillery. It has more then nice power and range. the perfect choice for a A10 driver.

A tanker's personal weapon should be his tank. Lol.

-Tink

[sniperdude411]

Except when it breaks down, burns (remember the stryker), etc. As long as you have plenty of training, you can shoot almost any gun. I can empty my 12-gauge's (remember, I'm 14) magazine(7 shell capacity) in 4 seconds. I can shoot 12-gauge slugs (from a single-barrel break) without any shoulder problems.

[Tinkertoys]

Except when it breaks down, burns (remember the stryker), etc. As long as you have plenty of training, you can shoot almost any gun. I can empty my 12-gauge's (remember, I'm 14) magazine(7 shell capacity) in 4 seconds. I can shoot 12-gauge slugs (from a single-barrel break) without any shoulder problems.

This defeats M21's argument that you are too old to own a gun. ;)

-Tink

[Bill]

He's well read for sure, but i think he's 16.

How old are you SniperDude?

[sniperdude411]

I'm 14, 5'5".
The reason I can fire my 12-gauge so quickly is not only experience, but the barrel is a 10-gauge barrel, so it helps alot with the recoil. I love Mossberg shotguns. They make pretty sounds when you work the action.
If you want to, I can post a piture of myself shooting when I get home. I'm still at school right now (CBA sucks).

[Skullstorm17]

To me, the two weapons are same as the other in all but a few minute details. The P90 has a higher magazine capacity than the MP7, but it has a higher rate of fire compared to the newer A1 model MP7. The MP7 has better AP capabilities but lacks the soft stopping power of the P90's larger round. The MP7 is more compact without the stock, but has a shorter barrel, giving it less range, accuracy, and muzzel velocity compared to the P90. The MP7 has an adjustable stock, but this is flimsy and less effective to use in hand-to-hand combat while bashing with the stock when compared to the P90's solid one.

[gunnut]

I love P90, but I see some problems. Changing the magazine in the middle of a firefight could be troublesome. Normal guns you just reach with thumb/finger and let the mag drop off or pull it off with your off hand. P90 is an entirely different exercise. I don't know exactly how it's done, but it involves more than pushing a button and let something drop. Inserting a mag is also very different on the P90.

A PDW should be small, handy, light, and easy to use IN COMBAT. We shouldn't need to train troops who need a PDW on how the thing operates. The weapon should be natural to anyone who has ever fired a pistol or modern rifle.

Final thing, I would like my PDW not to chamber an entirely new round that I have to supply to my military. That's just incredibly expensive and a headache for the quartermaster.

I prefer an MP5 derivative as a PDW. The 9mm Luger is everywhere, plentiful and cheap. Our pistols use it already so supply is no problem. Yeah it doesn't have the penetrating power of a P90 or MP7. So what? How many hostile forces in the world can afford body armor?

Terrorists don't wear body armor. A 9mm bullet does about as much damage to an unarmored target as a 5.7mm bullet. Let's not develop weapons needed to fight the last war against the Warsaw Pact. Let's put our money on things we need to fight terrorists.

[leib10]

I've got major beefs with the P90 design, detailed elsewhere on this forum. Most of them have to do with shooter comfort and aesthetics.

[gunnut]

I've got major beefs with the P90 design, detailed elsewhere on this forum. Most of them have to do with shooter comfort and aesthetics.

I love the look.

You have shot the P90. I haven't. Do you agree with my concern about changing the mag during a fire fight? For rear echelon troops no less?

Everything about that gun is unconventional. I don't want my support troops to rely on something so alien during unexpected situations.

I would love to try a P90 one of these days.

[leib10]

I've only shot the PS90, but it'll do.

Yes, changing magazines is awkward, especially in a prone position. Hell, everything about the gun is awkward, such as the "foregrip", short buttstock that forces you to crane your neck down very uncomfortably (especially for taller users), and abysmal trigger pull (seemingly a trait of most FN guns). Not to mention the fact that the ammo is unique, difficult to find, and very expensive.

I would never, ever, own one. If one came into my possession I would sell it and buy something else without thinking. IMO the MP5 is better in every single way except for the ability to penetrate body armor. I have shot FA MP5s and those are an absolute blast. :)

As for the MP7, I've yet to see a real one, let alone hold it and fire it. Given HK's somewhat closed-minded approach to the civilian market, it's likely I will probably never handle one unless I join LE or the military.

[astralis]

gunnut,

Terrorists don't wear body armor. A 9mm bullet does about as much damage to an unarmored target as a 5.7mm bullet. Let's not develop weapons needed to fight the last war against the Warsaw Pact. Let's put our money on things we need to fight terrorists.

oh, i don't know. hezbollah and some of the iraqi insurgents would disagree with that first sentence....

[gunnut]

I have not heard any reports of terrorists and insurgents with body armor. In that case, I'm not sure using P90 is the proper solution. The logistics of fielding a 3rd type of ammo and a whole new firearm, let alone the training, in large numbers is very challenging. It might be easier just to issue more M-4 carbines or develop a hyper velocity 9mm round.

There was this M-4 derivative called Carbon-15. I handled one at my local gun shop years ago. It's pretty much an M-4, but weighs only 6 lb. I think this would be a better solution as a PDW for military than the P90. It handles and operates just like the standard M-16 type rifle. It's very conventional (other than the material used) and the 5.56mm packs a way more powerful punch than any 5.7mm out there.

Of course special ops with their special requirement and more rigorous training can use P90 if they deem it necessary.

[Stan187]

gunnut,



oh, i don't know. hezbollah and some of the iraqi insurgents would disagree with that first sentence....

No they wouldn't, because they consider themselves freedom fighters.

Honestly guys, for PDW's, I see much more promise in the Knight's Armament PDW chambered in 6x35, as well as the Magpul PDR. We still don't really know how these tiny Euro-PDW catridges will perform against human targets. Sure, I've seen the MP7 blow apart a PASGT helmet on FutureWeapons. So what? It was only strong enough to stop a 9mm FMJ in the first place.

[Triple C]

I have not heard any reports of terrorists and insurgents with body armor.

I have. I don't remember who, or from where; it might be a marine from tanknet.

A couple of photographed Hezbullah and Iraqi insurgents, dead and alive, seem to be wearing vests.