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  • Power Projection

    The Indian and Chinese are investing much money in their armies. But can they compete with armies of the UK, Germany, US and Russia when it comes down to power projection? With countries has the best power projection and how long will it take for China and India to become an major international player?

  • #2
    Power projection capability is probably directly proportional to the number of foreign bases a country has, aircraft carrier groups and maybe even nuke subs with SLBMs

    US(don't think allies like Germany and UK need to be mentioned seperately) is a dumb shoo-in as the major player in all 3 categories. Russia currently has limited projection capabilities..

    China,India too have limited projection capabilities.. China for the subs they have and India for the blue-water navy and it is on its way to getting 3 AC carriers for the navy..India interestingly has an increased presence in central asia with an airbase in Ayni,Tajikistan plus the possibility of having limited number of troops in Afghanistan(Karzai seems to keep reqeusting troops frm India)..China doesn't seem to have any overseas military presence yet

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Mercenary View Post
      India interestingly has an increased presence in central asia with an airbase in Ayni,Tajikistan plus the possibility of having limited number of troops in Afghanistan(Karzai seems to keep reqeusting troops frm India)..China doesn't seem to have any overseas military presence yet
      Who better and with more experience to fight in the mountains than the Troops from India? However, Logistics must be an nightmare.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Mercenary View Post
        Power projection capability is probably directly proportional to the number of foreign bases a country has, aircraft carrier groups and maybe even nuke subs with SLBMs

        US(don't think allies like Germany and UK need to be mentioned seperately) is a dumb shoo-in as the major player in all 3 categories. Russia currently has limited projection capabilities..

        China,India too have limited projection capabilities.. China for the subs they have and India for the blue-water navy and it is on its way to getting 3 AC carriers for the navy..India interestingly has an increased presence in central asia with an airbase in Ayni,Tajikistan plus the possibility of having limited number of troops in Afghanistan(Karzai seems to keep reqeusting troops frm India)..China doesn't seem to have any overseas military presence yet
        China has a number of smallmissions and basing rights. But these don't mean much without the force to use them. Power projection is a misleading term/question. Do you mean globally, nuclear, regionally, economic, P5 vote etc? While the US leads in all these areas for obvious reasons. Russia, India, China, EU have signifigant abilties in one of more areas as do smaller countries like the Suadis or Iranians. Perhaps you should narrow your question down to one or more semi-specific broad areas.

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        • #5
          One single USN CVBG got more power projection than any other group of countries can hope to muster.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
            One single USN CVBG got more power projection than any other group of countries can hope to muster.
            Ouch! A crushing blow for the Indian and Chinese fanbois.
            "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
              One single USN CVBG got more power projection than any other group of countries can hope to muster.
              Sir, I can state that after taking a trek with the USN CVBG as of recently your assertions are pretty much spot on as usual and that is without hornblowing.
              Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                One single USN CVBG got more power projection than any other group of countries can hope to muster.
                Sir
                Aren\'t they called Carrier Strike Groups (CSG) now , and I completely agree that 1 USN Carrier group has more power projection than any other country can put together.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                  Ouch! A crushing blow for the Indian and Chinese fanbois.
                  no GN..its not...the discussion was abt who would be the NEXT BEST after USA..

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                    Ouch! A crushing blow for the Indian and Chinese fanbois.
                    Of course, China and India both can't project much power to let's say Middle East.

                    But China can probably project more power to Taiwan than a US Carrier group.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by yeung3939 View Post
                      But China can probably project more power to Taiwan than a US Carrier group.
                      Nope.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by yeung3939 View Post
                        Of course, China and India both can't project much power to let's say Middle East.

                        But China can probably project more power to Taiwan than a US Carrier group.

                        If the scales were as comprehensively tilted as you insist..then the PLA armed forces would already be in Taiwan. you seem to underestimate the power of a US carrier group by quite a bit... and Japan isn't that far from Taiwan..there are US forces based in Japan too..

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mercenary View Post
                          If the scales were as comprehensively tilted as you insist..then the PLA armed forces would already be in Taiwan. you seem to underestimate the power of a US carrier group by quite a bit... and Japan isn't that far from Taiwan..there are US forces based in Japan too..
                          Aren't we talking about power projection?

                          How many fighter/strike jets does a single carrier group have? 48?
                          China surely has a much larger number of planes with air-dominance/strike capability. Those old planes can still help to project power.

                          There are also ballistic missiles, MLRS, navy ships.

                          If you are talking about the ability to send troops onto the Island, China also has an edge over a single carrier group.

                          China doesn't have enough power projection capability to take Taiwan doesn't mean its power projection capabilit is weaker than a single carrier group.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by yeung3939 View Post
                            Aren't we talking about power projection?

                            How many fighter/strike jets does a single carrier group have? 48?
                            China surely has a much larger number of planes with air-dominance/strike capability. Those old planes can still help to project power.
                            With the exception of the PLANAF, the PLAAF never left the sight of land. Plus, the carrier planes fight as a group, not as an individuals. They don't have to down every plane. Knock out the C2 and the majority of the Chinese planes will crash into the ocean by getting lost.

                            Also, to win this fight, the USN just have to sink the invasion force ... extremely easy.

                            Originally posted by yeung3939 View Post
                            There are also ballistic missiles, MLRS, navy ships.
                            You can't hit what you cannot find.

                            Originally posted by yeung3939 View Post
                            If you are talking about the ability to send troops onto the Island, China also has an edge over a single carrier group.
                            How about the ability to land troops?

                            Originally posted by yeung3939 View Post
                            China doesn't have enough power projection capability to take Taiwan doesn't mean its power projection capabilit is weaker than a single carrier group.
                            In absolute terms, if you mean that a carrier cannot carry the war deep into China, you're right but a fight out in the Taiwan Straits is one in which China will lose.

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                            • #15
                              a fight out in the Taiwan Straits is one in which China will lose
                              I've said it before & I'll say it again, any Chinese attempt to invade Taiwan anywhere in the forseeable future will rapidly degenerate into the largest open water distance swim in human history.
                              sigpic

                              Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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