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  • Originally posted by redchina View Post
    Many people can find their cars from google earth, and now some people say Chinese satellite can't even find an aircraft carrier. Ridiculous. I agree I have nearly zero military knowledge, but you have some common sense please.
    Heres the trouble with that.

    1) Locating a CV on the open water is diffacult enough for her own airwings to locate her even in daylight and more so especially at night on a dark sea. (There is no light at sea at nighttime and zero being emiited from the ship herself) and she sure wont be holding up a sign stating "here we are". Even most experienced pilots have probelemd locating her at times.

    2) Your satellite "may" locate 1 of 11 CV's at sea how sure would you be that this particular one is the one you are searching for at any given point.

    3) Satellites dont stay stationary. You would only get surveilence once every so many hours as the satellite follows its orbit.

    4) Ever hear of jamming your sat with another military sat. Not saying it happens but would not put it out of reason either.

    And that is common sense.;)

    And if you notice Google Earth is not exactly time elapsed.

    In all honesty, the only way you are going to locate a USN CVN is either on the nightly news or if shes in port. Blindly looking for a CVN at sea in real time is wasting your time.
    Last edited by Dreadnought; 24 Sep 08,, 14:10.
    Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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    • Maybe, but I should have more engineering knowledge than you.

      Comment


      • you haven't demonstrated any.
        There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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        • Originally posted by redchina View Post
          Maybe, but I should have more engineering knowledge than you.
          A snobish answer coming from a person who has ABSOLUTELY no idea of just how much engineering knowledge I posess. Especially when it comes to the USN. Please demonstrate this "superior" knowledge and not with replies like above if you dont mind. The floor is now yours........
          Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

          Comment


          • The standard way to locate a CV is to use the spy satellites providing the early stage warning or alert, then use UAV to conduct the real-time reconnaissance and locating.

            China has optical/infrared/radar spy sats, good enough for locating CVs, and long range stealth UAVs. That shouldn't be a big problem for them, at least for near coast range, say 1000 - 1500 kms.

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            • Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
              Heres the trouble with that.
              1) 2) 3) 4)
              And that is common sense.;)

              And if you notice Google Earth is not exactly time elapsed.

              In all honesty, the only way you are going to locate a USN CVN is either on the nightly news or if shes in port. Blindly looking for a CVN at sea in real time is wasting your time.
              1) The ship is not a black hole, and you are saying zero light emitted. Additionally, there are many kind special lenses, cheapest one is ultra red. And it is not located pilot's eyes btw, it is by the camera. The fastest camera can make several million frames per second. As I said, I have nearly zero knowledge regards to those military thing, but one thousand frame is really enough for this case.

              2) kind of beyond of my knowledge, but if the camera can take one thousand frame per sec, it can sweep a huge area in short time. Let say each picture is 100m x 100m, you do the math.

              3) ever hear stationary satellite? (hope this is the right name in English, in Chinese it is 同步卫星, or maybe synchro satellite)

              4) Have no idea about the jamming, if you are confident that Chinese satellite will be jammed for sure and nothing happen to US satellite, then you are right.

              These are the common sense I have.

              And if as you said, you can locate a ship when it is in port, then why not track it real time especially in war time. Don't tell me zero light emitted, and the satellite can be stationary and camera can move much faster than a ship.

              As for google earth, you know it is free. I hope China can make picture that those free stuff.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by longbow View Post
                The standard way to locate a CV is to use the spy satellites providing the early stage warning or alert, then use UAV to conduct the real-time reconnaissance and locating.

                China has optical/infrared/radar spy sats, good enough for locating CVs, and long range stealth UAVs. That shouldn't be a big problem for them, at least for near coast range, say 1000 - 1500 kms.
                And if jammed by US military satellites? Or drones detected either by her CAP, EC2 or other methods what then?
                Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

                Comment


                • Have a sense of humor please, and I am talking to engineers not you.

                  Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
                  A snobish answer coming from a person who has ABSOLUTELY no idea of just how much engineering knowledge I posess. Especially when it comes to the USN. Please demonstrate this "superior" knowledge and not with replies like above if you dont mind. The floor is now yours........

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
                    And if jammed by US military satellites? Or drones detected either by her CAP, EC2 or other methods what then?
                    Not sure how US sats can jam other sats? It's very hard to jam multiple-sensor reconnaissance sat even from the ground.

                    The modern stealth UAV is not that easy to be detected, it has a very small radar footprint, infrared way doesn't have a very long range. Even you shoot down a UAV, your location is disclosed already.

                    The bottom line, they can send many UAVs. It would be particular risky for a US CV to enter Chinese coastal area, say 1500km range, and not being detected/located by them.

                    Comment


                    • And if as you said, you can locate a ship when it is in port, then why not track it real time especially in war time. Don't tell me zero light emitted, and the satellite can be stationary and camera can move much faster than a ship.

                      As for google earth, you know it is free. I hope China can make picture that those free stuff.[/QUOTE]


                      Ok, I will say this one more time, ZERO light emitted unless warrented it is SOP (Standard Operating Procedure) especially for any USN warship on a war footing. Any USN sailor will tell you the very same thing. And any USN aviator will tell you the very same. This is why it is so diffacult for CV landing at night time.

                      Did you know that a lit cigarette can be seen up to five miles away at night upon the open seas?;)

                      Google Earth? Read ALOT more about Google Earth. Even with a membership the magnification it gives is no where near adequate perception needed especially to spot a CV on the open sea and most definately not at night.

                      Tell you what you do your homework with Google and I will be waiting to see your results. Garenteed you find zip unless shes in port.;)
                      Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by longbow View Post
                        Not sure how US sats can jam other sats? It's very hard to jam multiple-sensor reconnaissance sat even from the ground.

                        The modern stealth UAV is not that easy to be detected, it has a very small radar footprint, infrared way doesn't have a very long range. Even you shoot down a UAV, your location is disclosed already.

                        The bottom line, they can send many UAVs. It would be particular risky for a US CV to enter Chinese coastal area, say 1500km range, and not being detected/located by them.
                        Longbow, Do you think Aegis is only used for missle launches? The UAV would be picked up and quickly delt with. Aegis can do much much more then the normal adverstisments claims.

                        Thats not to say they could not locate a CV within their territorial waters. However intelligence provides that boundary and no CO of and CVN is going to risk his group anywhere close to enemy shores in this day and age. That is if the standing Admiral and the CO of the CVN want to keep their position very long and the sailor/avaitors want to continue breathing.
                        Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
                          Did you know that a lit cigarette can be seen up to five miles away at night upon the open seas?;)
                          It's so true. And that's why a Chinese drone can locate an American aircraft carrier far far away from it, before it being detected. Since a CV emits a lot, heat, wireless waves, and radar signals...

                          Watch Chinese UAV program, it will be very interesting. They cloned the American drone(Boeing), also they come out with their own version.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
                            Longbow, Do you think Aegis is only used for missle launches? The UAV would be picked up and quickly delt with. Aegis can do much much more then the normal adverstisments claims.
                            We leave this thing alone, this will be the question open for debate. I don't think anybody know the real answer of it today.

                            But I will say, it is all up to who finds whom first, a UAV or a CV? it will be an interesting thing for next 10 years.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by longbow View Post
                              We leave this thing alone, this will be the question open for debate. I don't think anybody know the real answer of it today.

                              But I will say, it is all up to who finds whom first, a UAV or a CV? it will be an interesting thing for next 10 years.
                              Fair enough, My money rests on AEGIS.;)
                              Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by redchina View Post
                                Maybe, but I should have more engineering knowledge than you.
                                I'm still awaiting a demonstration posed upon this statement though.:)
                                Last edited by Dreadnought; 24 Sep 08,, 16:27.
                                Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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