Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 22

Thread: Russia To Give 10 MiG-29 to Lebanon

  1. #1
    Defense Moderator
    Defense Professional
    Lei Feng Protege
    xinhui's Avatar
    Join Date
    17 May 06
    Posts
    7,980

    Russia To Give 10 MiG-29 to Lebanon

    Washington Times
    December 17, 2008
    Pg. 12

    Russia To Give Fighter Jets

    MOSCOW -- Russian news agencies are reporting that Moscow has promised to deliver a batch of fighter jets to Lebanon .

    ITAR-Tass and Interfax have quoted Lebanese Defense Minister Elias Murr as saying that Russia has agreed to supply his country with 10 MiG-29 fighter jets.

    The ITAR-Tass said the planes will be provided as aid.

    Mr. Murr spoke during Tuesday's talks in Moscow with Russian Defense Minister Anatoly Serdyukov.

    Russia has sought to expand its clout in the Middle East and hopes to host a Mideast peace conference next year. It is a member of the so-called Quartet of Mideast peacemakers, which also includes the United States , the European Union and the United Nations.

  2. #2
    Senior Contributor chakos's Avatar
    Join Date
    21 Apr 08
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,294
    What use could Lebanon have for 10 Mig-29s apart from being able to gloat that it has 10 Mig-29s? Against external threats like Israel and Syria they would be crushed. Against internal threats they would be almost useless. How about some Mi-17 or Mi-24? If they are adamant on getting fixed wing wouldnt SU-25's be a lot more usefull?

  3. #3
    Senior Contributor xrough's Avatar
    Join Date
    09 Jan 07
    Location
    Manila
    Posts
    1,295

    Russia 'to give' Lebanon war jets

    Russia 'to give' Lebanon war jets


    Moscow is to give 10 MiG-29 fighter jets to Lebanon free of charge, says Russia's state news agency Interfax.

    The head of the Russia's defence cooperation body, Mikhail Dmitriyev, said the consignment was "a form of military and technical assistance".

    "We view the Lebanese army as the main guarantor of this nation's stability, therefore the armed forces of this country must be strengthened," he said.

    Delivery of the jets to Lebanon will also be paid for by the Russians.

    Mr Dmitriyev said the jets would be fully repaired and upgraded before being delivered.

    He added that the two countries were also discussing a possible sale of Russian armour to Beirut, reported Reuters. He said this was possible because of Lebanon's recent stability.

    Lebanon's military capability is greatly outweighed by Arab neighbour Syria, with which is has a history of sometimes strained relations, and the Jewish state Israel which lies to the south.

    Lebanon and Israel have never signed a peace treaty and Israeli fighter jets continually violate Lebanese airspace in what the Israeli military describes as reconnaissance missions, but which are condemned by the United Nations.

  4. #4
    Regular
    Join Date
    15 Oct 08
    Posts
    55
    Russia is simply using P.R. stunts like this to regain some influence and good will in the Middle east and Africa. Lebanon does not have the resources to maintain a operational Mig-29 squadron and whats more Russia knows this. And even if they had the resources to maintain the planes the pilots would Never be a match for an Israeli pilot. Who's training is on par with American Pilots.

    Just ask Syria what happened the last time they had a dogfight with Israeli pilots in 1981. wasn't it over 70 aircraft lost to 2 Israeli planes shot down. And those 2 shot down were actually due to Sam fire not pilot v pilot.
    Last edited by Thomas1016; 14 Jan 09, at 20:54.

  5. #5
    Field mechanik Senior Contributor omon's Avatar
    Join Date
    01 Nov 06
    Location
    bk
    Posts
    3,630
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas1016 View Post
    .

    Just ask Syria what happened the last time they had a dogfight with Israeli pilots in 1981. wasn't it over 70 aircraft lost to 2 Israeli planes shot down. And those 2 shot down were actually due to Sam fire not pilot v pilot.
    got any links for that???
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" B. Franklin

  6. #6
    Banned
    Join Date
    07 Jan 09
    Location
    4611'7.77"N 2118'47.76"E
    Posts
    669
    Quote Originally Posted by omon View Post
    got any links for that???
    be fair are u contesting the year or the ratio?

  7. #7
    In Memoriam/OAF-Old Aggravating Fart Senior Contributor Shamus's Avatar
    Join Date
    13 Apr 07
    Location
    Sebastian,Florida
    Posts
    4,059
    Lebanon is probably going to end up with the ones Algeria rejected and sent back..... http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/showthread.php?t=49076 .
    "Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the people alone. The people themselves, therefore, are its only safe depositories." Thomas Jefferson

  8. #8
    Regular
    Join Date
    15 Oct 08
    Posts
    55
    Quote Originally Posted by omon View Post
    got any links for that???
    ok I was wrong on the year. I was trying to remember from memory. it was in 1982 not 1981. Also I thought I remembered around 70 Migs shot down. checking other sources it apears to be somewhere in the 80 - 100 range.

    http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/...ure/82iaf.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli...82_Lebanon_War

    http://everything2.com/e2node/1982%2...n%2520Invasion

    http://www.reuters.com/article/topNe...79085720070906

    If you google I am sure you can find more sources. What can I say as you get older the memory starts to fade......
    Last edited by Thomas1016; 15 Jan 09, at 02:28.

  9. #9
    Senior Contributor Stitch's Avatar
    Join Date
    14 Nov 06
    Location
    Patterson, CA
    Posts
    3,080
    Quote Originally Posted by omon View Post
    got any links for that???
    Actually, it was more like 80 to 0. From wiki:

    "1982 Lebanon War
    June 8, 1982 1982 Lebanon War: The destruction of the entire Soviet supplied Syrian air-defense system in Lebanon within a few hours without a single warplane lost; Syria with the help of the Soviet Union built up an overlapping network of surface-to-air missiles. It achieved in dogfights a total of 80 Syrian planes shoot-downs, without a single Israeli plane being shot down."
    "There is never enough time to do or say all the things that we would wish. The thing is to try to do as much as you can in the time that you have. Remember Scrooge, time is short, and suddenly, you're not there any more." -Ghost of Christmas Present, Scrooge

  10. #10
    Regular
    Join Date
    15 Oct 08
    Posts
    55
    Quote Originally Posted by Stitch View Post
    Actually, it was more like 80 to 0. From wiki:

    "1982 Lebanon War
    June 8, 1982 – 1982 Lebanon War: The destruction of the entire Soviet supplied Syrian air-defense system in Lebanon within a few hours without a single warplane lost; Syria with the help of the Soviet Union built up an overlapping network of surface-to-air missiles. It achieved in dogfights a total of 80 Syrian planes shoot-downs, without a single Israeli plane being shot down."
    I do remember that it was a MAJOR embarrassment to the then Soviet Union. It's equipment was far inferior to what the west had supplied Israel with. To be fair though I am sure it was more due to the inferiority of Syrian pilot and SAM operator training.

    But the more I think about it has there been a war in the last 30 years where Russian equipment was not on the losing end of a major war? You can only blame it on the operator for so long........

  11. #11
    Officer of Engineers
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas1016 View Post
    But the more I think about it has there been a war in the last 30 years where Russian equipment was not on the losing end of a major war? You can only blame it on the operator for so long........
    Iran-Iraq and before then, South-Vietnam-North-Vietnam, Taiwan-Mainland China.

  12. #12
    Regular
    Join Date
    15 Oct 08
    Posts
    55
    Quote Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
    Iran-Iraq and before then, South-Vietnam-North-Vietnam, Taiwan-Mainland China.
    Iran/Iraq war - Iran used American aircraft and early on these proved devastating to the Iraqis. However this success quickly faded when the Iranians started to run out of spare parts due to the U.S. embargo. Then the Iraqis became the dominate air force. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2...War#Aircraft_2

    South Vietnam - The U.S. enjoyed Air superiority over both countries. However this is when the Soviets became masters of SAM technology. Which resulted in numerous shoot downs. In the 70's the U.S. began to adapt to this type of warfare with effective counter measures. The 1982 Lebanon war is an example when the Israelis obliterated the Syrian SAM defenses.

    All told, the U.S. Air Force flew 5.25 million sorties over South Vietnam, North Vietnam, northern and southern Laos, and Cambodia, losing 2,251 aircraft, 1,737 because of hostile action and 514 for operational reasons. 110 of the losses were helicopters and the rest fixed-wing. A ratio of roughly 0.4 losses per 1,000 sorties compared favorably with a 2.0 rate in Korea and the 9.7 figure during World War II.

    vast majority of aircraft lost in combat was due to anti aircraft fire. Not air to air combat. Hmmm, as far as Taiwan/China sorry but I do not remember a war fought during the last 30 years. Which by the way Vietnam was 40 years ago. But like I said before the older you get the more the memory goes )

    Ohh, and since your a Scotch taster have you ever had Royal Salute?
    Last edited by Thomas1016; 15 Jan 09, at 03:45.

  13. #13
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
    Join Date
    02 Aug 03
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    12,061
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas1016 View Post
    South Vietnam - The U.S. enjoyed Air superiority over both countries. However this is when the Soviets became masters of SAM technology. Which resulted in numerous shoot downs. In the 70's the U.S. began to adapt to this type of warfare with effective counter measures. The 1982 Lebanon war is an example when the Israelis obliterated the Syrian SAM defenses.

    All told, the U.S. Air Force flew 5.25 million sorties over South Vietnam, North Vietnam, northern and southern Laos, and Cambodia, losing 2,251 aircraft, 1,737 because of hostile action and 514 for operational reasons. 110 of the losses were helicopters and the rest fixed-wing. A ratio of roughly 0.4 losses per 1,000 sorties compared favorably with a 2.0 rate in Korea and the 9.7 figure during World War II.

    vast majority of aircraft lost in combat was due to anti aircraft fire. Not air to air combat. Hmmm, as far as Taiwan/China sorry but I do not remember a war fought during the last 30 years. Which by the way Vietnam was 40 years ago. But like I said before the older you get the more the memory goes )
    Thomas, the Colonel is talking about the VNAF vs. the VPAF, not the US vs. the VPAF.

    There has been military engagements between China and Taiwan during the Cold War, but I don't think any of them have been classified as being a full-blown war.
    "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

  14. #14
    New Member
    Join Date
    06 Oct 06
    Posts
    4
    With the current preference of Sukhoi over the MiG bureau within Russia, this is likely to be a PR move aimed at keeping MiG's production lines active.

  15. #15
    Field mechanik Senior Contributor omon's Avatar
    Join Date
    01 Nov 06
    Location
    bk
    Posts
    3,630
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas1016 View Post
    ok I was wrong on the year. I was trying to remember from memory. it was in 1982 not 1981. Also I thought I remembered around 70 Migs shot down. checking other sources it apears to be somewhere in the 80 - 100 range.

    http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/...ure/82iaf.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli...82_Lebanon_War

    http://everything2.com/e2node/1982%2...n%2520Invasion

    http://www.reuters.com/article/topNe...79085720070906

    If you google I am sure you can find more sources. What can I say as you get older the memory starts to fade......
    i,ve read those before asking you for links, however not a single one states idf planes were lost, neither they mentioned sam kills.
    no big deal, thou, honest mistake
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" B. Franklin

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. LCA beats F-16
    By Mr_Vastu in forum Military Aviation
    Replies: 150
    Last Post: 02 Sep 09,, 20:59
  2. Russia warns Ukraine it will retaliate over Nato
    By Ray in forum Europe and Russia
    Replies: 194
    Last Post: 27 Sep 08,, 23:12
  3. Hostile Russia!
    By Ray in forum Europe and Russia
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 30 Aug 08,, 10:27
  4. Analysis: Chechnya
    By Ironduke in forum Europe and Russia
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 29 Jul 08,, 00:30
  5. Does Anyone Feel Threat From N. Korea?
    By 1lonesoldier in forum East Asia and the Pacific
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 09 Jul 04,, 02:55

Share this thread with friends:

Share this thread with friends:

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •