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  • #31
    Originally posted by Ike99
    "Horrido-
    The war in Iraq is also legitimate, and not illegal, because under the terms of the ceasefire,"

    It is not legitimate. It is illegal. Because Americans invent stories about WMD's and the US governmant says it is legal doesn't make it legal.

    The UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan has said many times the US-led invasion of Iraq was an illegal act that contravened the UN charter. Therefore illegal. Look it up. ;)

    Wrong answer. Unless in your next post you can provide legal, documented proof that the re-invasion of Iraq contravened the UN charter or was otherwise illegal under international law, you will be banned. I do not care what Kofi Inane says, it is his opinion, but he is also flat WRONG. I can certainly provide records of the ceasefire, and Iraq's violations, that make the re-invasion legitimate.

    And considering your bias towards China, you gonna pull out of Tibet and apologise and provide reparations to Vietnam for those illegal trysts?
    The black flag is raised: Ban them all... Let the Admin sort them out.

    I know I'm going to have the last word... I have powers of deletion and lock.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Ike99
      Well Dreadnoughnt It really isn'y my opinion but a fact. When Bush invaded Iraq he never had a UN mandate authorizing a use of force, therefore it was an illegal use of force. An act of agression by international law any way you look at it. A warcrime. He is just powerful enough to get away with it though.
      Yes he did. Read all the UNSCRs about Kuwait-Iraq, and you'll find you're wrong.

      However, I'm open to you showing me in the 17 (maybe it's 18, I can't remember because there are so many of them!) resolutions where it prevented member nations from enforcing the resolutions.
      "So little pains do the vulgar take in the investigation of truth, accepting readily the first story that comes to hand." Thucydides 1.20.3

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Ike99
        It is not legitimate. It is illegal. Because Americans invent stories about WMD's and the US governmant says it is legal doesn't make it legal.

        The UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan has said many times the US-led invasion of Iraq was an illegal act that contravened the UN charter. Therefore illegal. Look it up. ;)
        The UN has no such "single voice" authority, and has made no official charge. Therefore your claim is specious, and saying it over and over gives it no more factual power than clapping your hands and crying out that you believe in fairies gets you a date with Tinkerbell.

        -dale

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Ike99
          I don't share your opinion. I think it is because the US strongarms financialy, politicaly and militarily other nations. China very shortly have the worlds largest economy and shortly be the most powerful country in the world. Yet I don't see massive security forces needed and a wave of protestors when their leaders visit foreign countries.
          China? HA! When China becomes the most powerful nation on this earth it will replace the US as the most hated. Ask India, Vietnam, Japan, and all other nations that border China how "friendly" the Chinese government is. Think of the US "strongarm" policy, as you put it, subtract freedom, add more totalitarianism, and there's China for you.

          Originally posted by Ike99
          It is not legitimate. It is illegal. Because Americans invent stories about WMD's and the US governmant says it is legal doesn't make it legal.
          You're right, we did invent stories about Saddam and his WMD.

          http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2...3/101911.shtml


          We did launch an illegal and illegitimate attack on the sovereign nation of Iraq.

          http://www.cnn.com/US/9812/16/clinton.iraq.speech/

          Do you dare to deny these reports by the Liberal News Daily network?

          Originally posted by Ike99
          The UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan has said many times the US-led invasion of Iraq was an illegal act that contravened the UN charter. Therefore illegal. Look it up. ;)
          Wow, Kofi Annan says so then it must be true. He got kickbacks from the Oil For Food program. He failed to prosecute those UN peacekeepers who raped children in Africa. What a model citizen he is. I am so glad he's here to tell us that we were wrong.

          By the way, you never gave me your thoughts on FDR's unprovoked attacks on the Germans in 1940. How about the deployment of US combat troops in Vietnam in 1965 under LBJ without UN sanction?
          "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

          Comment


          • #35
            To start with a couple quotes Horrido....

            November 20, 2003
            Pentagon Official Richard Perle-

            "I think in this case international law stood in the way of doing the right thing.... international law ... would have required us to leave Saddam Hussein alone"

            UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan-

            "I have indicated that it was not in conformity with the UN charter from our point of view, and from the charter point of view it was illegal"


            Charter of the United Nations

            CHAPTER I
            Article 1
            1. To maintain international peace and security, and to that end: to take effective collective measures for the prevention and removal of threats to the peace....(Broken)

            Article 2
            4. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations.
            (Broken)

            CHAPTER VI
            Article 37
            2. If the Security Council deems that the continuance of the dispute is in fact likely to endanger the maintenance of international peace and security, it
            shall decide whether to take action under Article 36 or to recommend such
            terms of settlement as it may consider appropriate.
            (Broken)

            CHAPTER VII
            Article 46
            Plans for the application of armed force shall be made by the Security Council with the assistance of the Military Staff Committee.
            (Broken)


            Some people can argue on other points if the invasion of Iraq was illegal or not but the ones above are definate infrengments upon international law.


            "Horrido-Wrong answer. Unless in your next post dah...dah...dah...you will be banned."

            Well aint we just a bit insecure about ourselves. If this is the way you really feel then pull the trigger big boy, just after you do so be sure to add to your topic headings..."Censored for US viewpoints only, all others will be banned." That way the facism can be absorbed in its pure form without flavoring it with hypocracy.

            But if you don't ban me....we really should move the discussion to another thread. This one is really about what chavez said about the Malvinas. I think everyone has agreed he is a blowhard.

            Comment


            • #36
              UN Resolution 1441

              http://www.un.int/usa/sres-iraq.htm

              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UN_Secu...esolution_1441
              "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

              Comment


              • #37
                Congratulations, Ike, by posting the articles supporting your point of view, you have narrowly escaped the guillotine. I am certainly not insecure about myself, just easily annoyed by skipping record repeats when people have explained to you why you are wrong. There is no fascism here, we have gone after rightwing whackos just as manically as the left. The difference is, there are fewer of them to hold as an example. You also need to learn to keep things in perspective and in comparison with what other parts of the world have done, lest you fall into the philosophical farse of "straining at gnats and swollowing elephants."

                And Gunnut has graciously provided the reason you are wrong, Ike: UN Resolution 1441, which abides by the Articles you have posted and authorizes the United States to bring Iraq to compliance. WMD's were an accidental red herring used by the Right, and are now an intentional red herring used by the Left. The ones you trust so dearly are those who are intentionally misleading and lying to you.
                Last edited by Horrido; 15 Feb 06,, 01:22.
                The black flag is raised: Ban them all... Let the Admin sort them out.

                I know I'm going to have the last word... I have powers of deletion and lock.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Ike99
                  But...sence we are speaking of the MALVINAS. Look at a map and see where Britian is in relation to the Malvinas. Now look at Argentina and look at its relationship to the Malvinas. Pretty simple really. The British empire is gone, its a relic from the past. There Argentinas
                  Spoken like a true Argentinian. I suppose Hawaii should secede from the United States then, eh?
                  Got some news for you sir, Argentina already tried and failed to wrest the FALKLANDS from the British. You're not getting them back. The junta is gone. Deal with it.
                  “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Ike99
                    CHAPTER VI
                    Article 37
                    2. If the Security Council deems that the continuance of the dispute is in fact likely to endanger the maintenance of international peace and security, it
                    shall decide whether to take action under Article 36 or to recommend such
                    terms of settlement as it may consider appropriate.
                    (Broken)

                    CHAPTER VII
                    Article 46
                    Plans for the application of armed force shall be made by the Security Council with the assistance of the Military Staff Committee.
                    (Broken)
                    Explain to me how these are broken when the UNSC has NOT decided anything?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Ike99
                      To start with a couple quotes Horrido....

                      November 20, 2003
                      Pentagon Official Richard Perle-

                      "I think in this case international law stood in the way of doing the right thing.... international law ... would have required us to leave Saddam Hussein alone"

                      UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan-

                      "I have indicated that it was not in conformity with the UN charter from our point of view, and from the charter point of view it was illegal"


                      Charter of the United Nations

                      CHAPTER I
                      Article 1
                      1. To maintain international peace and security, and to that end: to take effective collective measures for the prevention and removal of threats to the peace....(Broken)

                      Article 2
                      4. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations.
                      (Broken)

                      CHAPTER VI
                      Article 37
                      2. If the Security Council deems that the continuance of the dispute is in fact likely to endanger the maintenance of international peace and security, it
                      shall decide whether to take action under Article 36 or to recommend such
                      terms of settlement as it may consider appropriate.
                      (Broken)

                      CHAPTER VII
                      Article 46
                      Plans for the application of armed force shall be made by the Security Council with the assistance of the Military Staff Committee.
                      (Broken)


                      Some people can argue on other points if the invasion of Iraq was illegal or not but the ones above are definate infrengments upon international law.


                      "Horrido-Wrong answer. Unless in your next post dah...dah...dah...you will be banned."

                      Well aint we just a bit insecure about ourselves. If this is the way you really feel then pull the trigger big boy, just after you do so be sure to add to your topic headings..."Censored for US viewpoints only, all others will be banned." That way the facism can be absorbed in its pure form without flavoring it with hypocracy.

                      But if you don't ban me....we really should move the discussion to another thread. This one is really about what chavez said about the Malvinas. I think everyone has agreed he is a blowhard.
                      The Far Leftist retards killed more people than the "American Imperialist", Soviet Union, China, Cambodia, Eastern Europe, Africa, Vietnam... Get over it.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Ike99
                        "We are hated because we are the most powerful, most prosperous, most free, nation on this earth."

                        I don't share your opinion. I think it is because the US strongarms financialy, politicaly and militarily other nations. China very shortly have the worlds largest economy and shortly be the most powerful country in the world. Yet I don't see massive security forces needed and a wave of protestors when their leaders visit foreign countries.

                        "*HATED? Who cares most countries that aren't ran by democracy hate
                        anybody that is anyway..."

                        Well this is a pretty good example of US foreign policy and how it has isolated itself.

                        "Horrido-
                        The war in Iraq is also legitimate, and not illegal, because under the terms of the ceasefire,"

                        It is not legitimate. It is illegal. Because Americans invent stories about WMD's and the US governmant says it is legal doesn't make it legal.

                        The UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan has said many times the US-led invasion of Iraq was an illegal act that contravened the UN charter. Therefore illegal. Look it up. ;)
                        China? You mean the Chinese "communist" government butched their own people of more than 50 millions during their last 56years and they NEVER NEVER apologied for their atorcities until today.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Enzo Ferrari
                          China? You mean the Chinese "communist" government butched their own people of more than 50 millions during their last 56years and they NEVER NEVER apologied for their atorcities until today.
                          I'm sure the Liberal News Daily won't tell him that
                          "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Ike quit wasting our time avoiding our pesky facts.....

                            Iraq war was LEGAL.....

                            Afganistan was attacked justly.....

                            I have more trust in G.W. Bush's judgement than yours....

                            Accept these FACTS and move on.
                            Facts to a liberal is like Kryptonite to Superman.

                            -- Larry Elder

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              The Three Stooges have been resurrected in South America!
                              Morales in Bolivia, with his plan of legalizing the growing of coca plants…(for home consumption, of course!)
                              Chavez in Venezuela with his galloping paranoia!
                              Castro, …well for being Castro!
                              When we blindly adopt a religion, a political system, a literary dogma, we become automatons. We cease to grow. - Anais Nin

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Ike99
                                The UN Secretary-Genaral Kofi Annan has said many times the US-led invasion of Iraq was an illegal act that contravened the UN charter. Therefore illegal. Look it up.
                                The UNSG got no authority to declare anything legal or illegal. Look it up.

                                Comment

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