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  • Trump interview with CNBC at Davos:

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    • Well the Dems have ditched all pretense now abut this being about dreamers and are demanding open borders. They do seem to be trying on that age old GOP tactic of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

      This plan flies in the face of what most Americans believe," Schumer said on Twitter. While Trump "finally acknowledged that the Dreamers should be allowed to stay here and become citizens, he uses them as a tool to tear apart our legal immigration system and adopt the wish list that anti-immigration hard-liners have advocated for for years

      https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...schumer-371139

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      • I am happy my friend - who was a child 'illegal' in the US taken by her Mother running from the Serbo Croat war - is now back in Europe.

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        • Does Europe want to take the rest of the Dreamers, too? Surely they can claim political asylum because America is run by the Mega-Death-CommuNazis now.
          "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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          • Surely they can claim political asylum because America is run by the Mega-Death-CommuNazis now.
            FINALLY, took them long enough to take over.

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            There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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            • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
              Does Europe want to take the rest of the Dreamers, too? Surely they can claim political asylum because America is run by the Mega-Death-CommuNazis now.
              My friend was from Croatia originally but it was your loss. She got a scholarship to do Maths at Cambridge (England). How many young people get scholarships to top level Universities to study maths every year? I am guessing not many. Last I heard she was working at CERN (where the LHC is).

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              • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                My friend was from Croatia originally but it was your loss. She got a scholarship to do Maths at Cambridge (England). How many young people get scholarships to top level Universities to study maths every year? I am guessing not many. Last I heard she was working at CERN (where the LHC is).
                Then its not our loss, CERN's work is internationally funded and we have full access to its research. Someone else paid for her education and we still get her work product.

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                • Yeah, I don't think CERN specifically is a good example, because their findings aren't exactly proprietary.

                  I don't particularly have a problem with high-skill immigrants (only Steve Bannon does), I have a problem with people doing an end-around the law.
                  "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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                  • Originally posted by zraver View Post
                    Then its not our loss, CERN's work is internationally funded and we have full access to its research. Someone else paid for her education and we still get her work product.
                    Losing intelligent young people is a loss in my book. I have no problem with Ukrainians going abroad to study and broaden their perspective but I want them home again.

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                    • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                      Losing intelligent young people is a loss in my book. I have no problem with Ukrainians going abroad to study and broaden their perspective but I want them home again.
                      We didn't lose her, we get her work product and the EU picks up all the costs.

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                      • In the case of Ukraine, your nationals can make a bunch of money and send it back as remittance payments. Happens pretty frequently in the US. Remittances are a big chunk of cash inflows for some countries.
                        "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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                        • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Losing intelligent young people is a loss in my book. I have no problem with Ukrainians going abroad to study and broaden their perspective but I want them home again.
                          You do realize that:

                          1. Republicans and Trump in general do not want to kick out DACA kids unless they are actually criminals.
                          2. We actually want to retain highly talented immigrants in the US and want to change policy to favor said category at the expense of others currently favored by Dems for political reasons.
                          3. This would actually be unfavorable for YOUR country and the Croatias of the world should we succeed because it would have the exact effect of pulling talent out of your countries to ours?

                          But that's why they call it competition. We want to compete for the best talent. What we don't want to do is make it difficult for law abiding people with/ demonstrated talent to stay because we are making too much room for others to cut in line bY circumventing the law.

                          Today in the US you can get a PhD at a Stanford, MIT or Harvard and still have to jump through five flamming hoops of fire to get a citizenship. There are literally thousands of people like your friend whom we, the American tax payer have literally PAID millions of dollars EACH to educate only to pull out the welcome mat AFTER they graduate. If that sounds stupid to you, it SO IS.
                          Last edited by citanon; 31 Jan 18,, 16:35.

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                          • Originally posted by zraver View Post
                            We didn't lose her, we get her work product and the EU picks up all the costs.
                            Until we get a Trumpet spouting 'Europe first' which dissolves the Transatlantic alliance and allows the Muscovites to win. Nor by the way do I see that the US is a CERN member... don't know for sure but it appears not from the wiki - Observer status apparently, along with UNESCO and Muscovy among others - which means sod all basically - so apart from journals I am not sure what CERN research the US has access to.

                            Originally posted by citanon View Post
                            But that's why they call it competition. We want to compete for the best talent. What we don't want to do is make it difficult for law abiding people with/ demonstrated talent to stay because we are making too much room for others to cut in line bY circumventing the law.
                            So perhaps an academic, commercial or practical qualification and/or working say 10yrs and paying taxes with no criminal record should earn citizenship? I mean I would hate to lose young maths or physics students from Ukraine or Europe in general. As you say it is about competition - also for the brightest young people.

                            Originally posted by citanon View Post
                            Today in the US you can get a PhD at a Stanford, MIT or Harvard and still have to jump through five flamming hoops of fire to get a citizenship. There are literally thousands of people like your friend whom we, the American tax payer have literally PAID millions of dollars EACH to educate only to pull out the welcome mat AFTER they graduate. If that sounds stupid to you, it SO IS.
                            Don't your students get loans? In both the UK and Ukraine (I cannot speak of other European countries) that I know of 'Foreign Students' actually pay substantially more in tuition fees than natives so help support the Universities.

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                            • A: your hypothetical is actually tougher than Trump's proposal.

                              B: not if you are in a US science and engineering PhD. We pay for everything, including a stipend up to $40k per year. Fr a typical graduate student, the government pays $70k per year to the University to keep said person in school, and spend around $20k to $100k per year in material costs and expenditures, but the universities also charge now about 70% overhead, so you can multiply that by 3.5. So now we are into the $150k to $500k per year territory.

                              The typical serious American PhD at a top tier school lasts about 7 years, with maximal expenditures over about 4 of those plus a couple of years of taking classes, and training and one lost to screwing around and being depressed.

                              So for a typical MIT PhD, you are looking at close to or over $1 million in governmental outlays (and other minor support from charitable foundations).

                              After all that you'd think we'd hand out a green card with the diploma but no, it's better get a sponsor before your PCT runs out or GTFO.

                              The stupidity and loss in this system cannot be adequately described in words.

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                              • GOP faces new shutdown threat from within

                                Congress is a week away from another government shutdown. And if it happens this time, the blame may lie with Republicans, who are struggling to keep their lawmakers in line.

                                Republicans have considered a stopgap funding bill that could run one month or possibly deeper into March, according to multiple sources. Discussions have been fluid, however, as House and Senate Republicans gather this week in West Virginia for their annual retreat. The House could vote as soon as Tuesday, two days before funding runs dry.

                                But many rank-and-file GOP lawmakers who reluctantly backed the last temporary funding bill, including conservatives and defense hawks, are balking at yet another patch.

                                With Congress now staring down its fifth short-term spending bill since September, frustration is spreading across the House Republican Conference, particularly as negotiations have stalled over raising stiff budget caps and providing relief to so-called Dreamers, undocumented immigrants brought to the U.S. as children.

                                House Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows is threatening to withhold votes for another funding bill without more concessions on immigration. The North Carolina Republican told reporters this week that members of his hard-line caucus couldn’t vote for the bill until Speaker Paul Ryan makes good on his promise to push a more conservative immigration plan.
                                https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...80576?lo=ap_a1
                                "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

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