Neutrinos faster than the speed of light????!!!!

**bigross86** · 30 Sep 11,, 07:28

Had a long discussion about this yesterday with a guy studying nuclear physics at the Technion (our MIT) and a couple other folks.

The physicist said that he read the article and the entire thing is bullshit. As soon as someone reviews the data-gathering methods, they'll prove the calculations are unworthy. The other guy said that just like every other scientific constant, C will also be disproved someday, though maybe not in our lifetime.

Then we delved into metaphysics. Because C has certain qualities in the system that it is present in, but it also lives in that system, if you take C into a different system, or alternatively, change the system, than C could change as well and wouldn't necessarily be the fastest thing in the universe.

As usual, XKCD comes to the rescue:

**Monash** · 05 Oct 11,, 10:37

One commentator expressed the opinion that these results if proved correct did not of themselves bring special relativity "crashing down".

He noted that for most every day observations of the immediate universe Newtons Laws of gravitation/motion were perfectly satisfactory with general relativity coming into its own only when dealing with extreme gravitational events and special relativity coming into its own when dealing with the motion of objects/particles at high speeds/accelerations.

He opined that even if these results proved correct it might simply be a case of redefining them in terms of a "special" subset or case of special relativity dealing with specific types of neutrinos passing through/interacting with ordinary matter under certain specific conditions. After all no one is claiming any dramatic results from what amounts to a violation of Einstein’s prohibition against travelling "faster" than light.

at least far as I am aware the Universe did not come to an end!

**dave lukins** · 05 Oct 11,, 11:51

Is there any special reason why we need to know the speed of light? CERN have spent Billions testing for it but why..to what end? Will the universe change if we find/never find out?

**snapper** · 05 Oct 11,, 14:29

We have to know ETA of the aliens!

**Sparking Neuron** · 05 Oct 11,, 14:41

Originally Posted by snapper

We have to know ETA of the aliens!

some say universe is perfectly old enough to host multiple level 3 civilizations(those who dwell on galactic level)....and that we might be monitored by some superior races

There must be some level threes out there in the universe.. but in milky way its highly unlikely by now. We'd know if someone was screwing with the stars around us.

**dave lukins** · 05 Oct 11,, 16:28

Originally Posted by Sparking Neuron

We'd know if someone was screwing with the stars around us.

They have taken one look at the mess we have made of this planet and decided to hightail it to a less hostile area before we get the technology to cause Big Bang 2 the sequel

**bigross86** · 05 Oct 11,, 18:36

If you've been keeping abreast of world news, the Nobel prize in physics this year was handed to the folks that discovered that the universe is still expanding at an ever increasing speed, which means that at the moment chances are that we're not headed for another big bang, but rather the universe will eventually just tear itself apart, but not before the sky turns dark because all the stars are too far away for us to see their light (if we as a race should ever last that long)

**Doktor** · 05 Oct 11,, 18:49

This is racist towards our race!

**dave lukins** · 05 Oct 11,, 19:10

Originally Posted by bigross86

If you've been keeping abreast of world news, the Nobel prize in physics this year was handed to the folks that discovered that the universe is still expanding at an ever increasing speed, which means that at the moment chances are that we're not headed for another big bang, but rather the universe will eventually just tear itself apart, but not before the sky turns dark because all the stars are too far away for us to see their light (if we as a race should ever last that long)

That theory has been around for many years. Why has it taken so long for the award? Maybe speed ain't that important anyway.

**tankie** · 05 Oct 11,, 19:22

Originally Posted by dave lukins

That theory has been around for many years. Why has it taken so long for the award? Maybe speed ain't that important anyway.

Light aint that fast anyway , try running around with a torch n see

**bigross86** · 05 Oct 11,, 20:09

Originally Posted by dave lukins

That theory has been around for many years. Why has it taken so long for the award? Maybe speed ain't that important anyway.

The Nobel committee only grants rewards to discoveries that have stood the test of time

**omon** · 05 Oct 11,, 20:24

Originally Posted by Sparking Neuron

We'd know if someone was screwing with the stars around us.

i seriously doubt that.

**Doktor** · 05 Oct 11,, 21:25

Originally Posted by bigross86

The Nobel committee only grants rewards to discoveries that have stood the test of time

Tankie's method seems like it passed the test

**Sparking Neuron** · 06 Oct 11,, 04:00

Originally Posted by omon

i seriously doubt that.

Ok..let me clear my point a little bit more;
According to Kardashev scale there are three levels of civilizations out there, he rated them on the base of their energy consumption & sources.

Type 1 civilizations adsorb almost all the energy on their planet. They control earth quacks, volcanoes & weather. They've cities in the ocean etc etc.
Type 2 civilizations are supposed to be stellar they own multiple star systems. They are the kinda people who'v exhausted all the resources from their planets and get energy directly from their mother star. And after they'r done with their star they head to colonize other stars. They are immortal and nothing know to our science including super novas can make then go extinct.
Then comes type 3 civilization. The Gods of the galaxy. They own their whole galaxy and harvest energy from its stars and black holes.

Now I don't think there is a type 3 in our milkyway at least, if there was then we'd been like their pets by now and our earth like a little fishtank for them. However, there are chances that there can be multiple type 2s out there. But they are not near us, if they were then we'd hv noticed some stars dimming down or something.

Wonder if some type 4 or beyond shows up from somewhere out of milky way.

btw we are type zero. We don't even rate on this scale cuz we get our energy from dead plants.

**Chogy** · 06 Oct 11,, 15:21

And then, the possibility exists that we are the highest life form in our galaxy, or maybe the universe. There may be plenty of life out there, but perhaps 99.9999% never gets past bacterial. We just don't know, and all these "life in the galaxy" equations and speculations are so full of subjective constants and numbers. Until we get visited, we may never know.

The other possibility is that there are hundreds of planets with beings like us, but the interstellar light-speed and distance issue may never get solved, regardless of technical competence, so what we have are scattered and isolated higher civilizations that cannot ever know about the others.

I've waffled back and forth over this. I love science fiction, but part of me doubts strongly. We may be very, very alone.