Thread: New Star Trek movie.

Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen

the Épée/Degen came around the 17th Cenutry (depends on the exact definition of what a Épée/Degen ist), not during the medieval time. The whole fencing (in the way we understand it today) came around only after the end of the middle-age and increasing urbanisation and the creation of the "proto-middle-class".

My mistake. Renaissance period then? Actually, I don't know much about non-firearms. I know about some famous weapons like the gladius, the halberd, and the gutentag (did I spell that right?).

I'm going to see this and Terminator Salvation next week. Looking forward to them both.

Originally Posted by gunnut

My mistake. Renaissance period then? Actually, I don't know much about non-firearms.

pretty much, though I am lost with what you might mean with "Gutentag/Guten Tag". It is Germa and means "Good Day", but I can't think of any weapon that has a name that comes even close to it. Though sometimes the English language uses some weird (for German speaking) names for certain weapons. For example there is a certain Falchion-like weapon called "Langes Messer" in the english language world, which simply translate into "long knife".

This is like coming up with a fancy asian name for a martial art that involves a staff which would translate into something simple like "fighting with a wooden stick".

Originally Posted by snowhole

I'm going to see this and Terminator Salvation next week. Looking forward to them both.

It's not bad. Better than I expected, actually.

Maybe we should have a dedicated thread on it.

Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen

pretty much, though I am lost with what you might mean with "Gutentag/Guten Tag". It is Germa and means "Good Day", but I can't think of any weapon that has a name that comes even close to it. Though sometimes the English language uses some weird (for German speaking) names for certain weapons. For example there is a certain Falchion-like weapon called "Langes Messer" in the english language world, which simply translate into "long knife".

This is like coming up with a fancy asian name for a martial art that involves a staff which would translate into something simple like "fighting with a wooden stick".

I saw that on the history channel. It's a spiked wooden club. Maybe that's an English name given to a Germanic weapon. There's a Chinese name for it too, literally "wolf's teeth club."

aah, now I got it. you are talking about a Morningstar/Morgenstern. You must known it under its Flemish name Guden Dag. It is a club like weapon with a metalic "head". Used as a cheap weapon against armored soldiers. Since you could not penetrate their heavy armour, you simply smach whatever is inside it.

You could compare a Morningstar to what is now a RPG in its role in warfare.

btw: One of the possible translations of my first name is Morningstar/Morgenstern.

edit: Mh I did a bit reading and it might be that a Guden Dag is not exactly the same like a Morningstar (as some of my books claim). An alternative description i found made it more look like a spear like weapon.

Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen

aah, now I got it. you are talking about a Morningstar/Morgenstern. You must known it under its Flemish name Guden Dag. It is a club like weapon with a metalic "head". Used as a cheap weapon against armored soldiers. Since you could not penetrate their heavy armour, you simply smach whatever is inside it.

You could compare a Morningstar to what is now a RPG in its role in warfare.

btw: One of the possible translations of my first name is Morningstar/Morgenstern.

edit: Mh I did a bit reading and it might be that a Guden Dag is not exactly the same like a Morningstar (as some of my books claim). An alternative description i found made it more look like a spear like weapon.

So it's guden dag, not guden tag...I shall make a note of that.

Morningstar, as far as I know, is a spiked ball attached to a handle via a chain.

the exact spelling might vary. for one languages change over time, and also back then you had no oxford dictonary. I.E. that different people used slight variations in spelling since there was noone to decide what the "right one" is.

And last, Flemish is a weird language anyway (actually it is more a collection of different dutch dialects)

edit:

A Morningstar can also be attached via a chain, but at least in English the term I have seen most times for this kind of weapon was Flail (and Flegel in German). But I don't really want to claim that I am exactly right on this subject, especially about the terms and names not in my mother language. Though what all those weapon have common (be it a mace or a spear like weapon, or one with a chained spiked ball, was the porpuse to offer a cheap way to deal with armored opponents.

In the episode "Naked Time" Sulu used a fencing foil, ostensibly with the practice tip removed and revealing a sharp point. Modern fencing foils do not have sharp tips even under the plastic knob.

When I fenced in college me and a few of the guys were Trek nerds, and one of us had a Takei-autographed picture of Sweaty Sulu with his foil that we propped up as our "mascot" during our tournaments.

The story goes that when they went to Takei and asked him if, per the script, he could chase people around with a katana a la a Samurai, he countered with "why make it so obvious - make him a swashbuckler instead of a stereotype" and when asked if he could fence, he said "yes!" then immediately ran out to take some lessons because he couldn't.

It's a great actor story, and I hope it's true.

Sporting foils are thin with a small bell guard and fairly whippy and bendy for the last half of the "blade". Foil is the basic fencing style and is highly stylized, with a limited target area (upper body excluding arms and head) and only the point involved for touches. It's the farthest removed from "real" combat but is excellent for teaching footwork, distance, timing, and hand-eye coordination. I considered myself a foil fencer, but never really got beyond "talented beginner" to the chagrin of my coach.

Epees are are quite thick and sturdy at the base with a triangular cross-section and a very large bell guard. They are relatively bendy at the last half but not light and "whippy" like a foil. They are heavy and you KNOW when you've been hit with an epee. Epee fencing is the closest to real smallsword dueling/fighting, with just the point being valid for touches and the whole body as target, but it's still quite stylized. I found epee incredibly fun, and a great "relaxer" after the rigorous form of foil. Plus I was fast enough to get away with things that you normally can't get away with in epee, so I really did very well against anyone my skill level or lower. Anyone even a little better than me in epee though would clean my clock handily. Ouch sez the collarbone.

Sabres are best described as foils that got their last half of the blade run over by a tank. They are very light and whippy and the whole front edge, about a foot of the back edge, and the point are all valid for touches. The guard is a medium-sized bell with a hand guard extending down to the pommel to protect the fingers. The style is reminiscent of cavalry training, with only the upper half of the body as a valid target, and a lot of running or "charging" attacks (the fleche) and yelling. I never really liked sabre.

-dale

I think I attended 2 classes of fencing back in college. That shows how much I know.

Then I started playing hockey. Out go all other sports I played/playing.

Originally Posted by gunnut

It's not bad. Better than I expected, actually.

Maybe we should have a dedicated thread on it.

Hmmm I'm wondering how Night at the Museum 2 could beat it in box office. Maybe people just think without Arnold it's different.

Originally Posted by snowhole

Hmmm I'm wondering how Night at the Museum 2 could beat it in box office. Maybe people just think without Arnold it's different.

Night at the museum was a funny flick. Im not one for Ben Stiller but he played a good role. The stone statue from Easter Island is funny and Atilla the Hun.

YouTube - Typography - Night at the Museum - "Dum Dum"

I do want to see the second movie as well. I hope its atleast as good as the first one.

Just saw Terminator Salvation and Star Trek XI. Well, I don't know how to put it...

Terminator Salvation is good but I kinda feel the plot a bit of cliche... Maybe I've just played too many games... A post-apocalypse era when humanity fights something inhuman, a resistance command in a nuclear submarine, a spiritual and field leader as hero, and they realises the spirit of humanity in this course... I've read and seen too many of such themes. Bottom line, not so mind blowing as the originals (1 and 2).

I have only seen one old-school Star Trek film (and a few animated series when I was young but I can't really remember them now except the theme tune) so it's hard to compare. I enjoyed the new one. I love space opera and seeing one on the big screen is quite an experience. Since I don't know any back stories of Star Trek, I have a question. Is Spock's girl-friend also in the old series and films? I kinda feel she's needless in the film. Just put a hot girl in there so that there's a chick in the film (and maybe to give Zachary Quinto a kiss scene)?

Spock never had a girlfriend - he was engaged at 7 years old.

-dale