Thread: Climate Change is real!!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by gunnut

No it's not.

He's a hypocrite because he's calling us to conserve while he uses $30k of energy in ONE of his 4 mansions. To get us to go along, he cooks up this global warming hoax to scare people.

You cite legitimate grounds for accusing Al Gore of a hypocritical lifestyle, which may or may not be true. However, I said it was disingenuous to accuse him of hypocrisy based on the waste caused by the Live Earth concerts. You have not refuted my point about that.

You impute Al Gore with a scare motivation. What, in your opinion, does Al Gore have to gain by pressing the issue of global warming? Why would he scare people?

Why do you think global warming is a hoax?

Earth does what earth wants. We have no say in it.

That is not a view endorsed by most scientists or by common sense. Earth is subject to human influence. It appears that our influence of late has been profound.

I will conserve for conservation's sake, namely it makes economical sense. I will not conserve because some airhead celebrities believe the earth is coming to an end.

I am glad that you find it reasonable to conserve, even if only in economic terms.

Few, if any, climatologists claim that the Earth will come to end. Instead, the idea is that human influence will make the continuation of human civilization more difficult. Global warming will probably lead to erratic climate, which will wreak havoc on crops and water supplies. Furthermore, the rise in sea level will result in the displacement of millions of humans.

Read through all the threads in the forum about global warming. There's more than enough evidence to counter the "the debate is over" claim.

I don't have time to do that. I have followed a good amount of the debate. Usually it consists of conservatives on this board mistakenly claiming that global warming is hoax or a liberal conspiracy. The debate is usually cyclical, as the appearance of yet another global warming thread proves.

Originally Posted by Bulgaroctonus

You impute Al Gore with a scare motivation. What, in your opinion, does Al Gore have to gain by pressing the issue of global warming? Why would he scare people?

Sorry, jumping in here...

Al Gore himself has justified his use of hyperbole and scare tactics to motivate his disciples:

"
Given that starting point, I believe it is appropriate to have an over-representation of factual presentations on how dangerous it is, as a predicate for opening up the audience to listen to what the solutions are, and how hopeful it is that we are going to solve this crisis."

From here.

Why do you think global warming is a hoax?

Because it hasn't passed any scientific tests.

That is not a view endorsed by most scientists or by common sense. Earth is subject to human influence. It appears that our influence of late has been profound.

Scientific consensus is a shelter for the foolish - it is neither scientifically rigorous or intellectually honest. And your comment about "common sense" is nonsense. To what "influence", especially "of late" are you specifically referring?

I am glad that you find it reasonable to conserve, even if only in economic terms.

Few, if any, climatologists claim that the Earth will come to end. Instead, the idea is that human influence will make the continuation of human civilization more difficult. Global warming will probably lead to erratic climate, which will wreak havoc on crops and water supplies. Furthermore, the rise in sea level will result in the displacement of millions of humans.

Yeah yeah, we've heard the preaching. Now prove it. Prove any of it.

I don't have time to do that. I have followed a good amount of the debate. Usually it consists of conservatives on this board mistakenly claiming that global warming is hoax or a liberal conspiracy. The debate is usually cyclical, as the appearance of yet another global warming thread proves.

Bullsh*t. You claim that human industry is affecting the global climate. Now prove it. Don't whine and claim you're enlightened, just simply prove it.

Prove.

It.

-dale

Originally Posted by dalem

Bulgy, if you believe that Al Gore believes what he says, then the Earth is seconds away from melting into a gooey slushpile - anything short of him sitting cross-legged in front of a grass hut breathing shallowly into a bowl of water lillies is rank hypocrisy.

Of course he is wrong though, and being proven more wrong every day. Hard to convince someone that their religion is wrong though.

-dale

You are incorrect in your assessment of Al Gore's hypocrisy because you imply a false dilemma: that prevention of global warming demands cessation of modern society and the forfeiture of all material comforts. This is neither the position of Al Gore nor the position of conservationists. As the below excerpt form the Guardian shows, Gore has been reluctant to divorce Americans from their lifestyles:

There are indeed plenty of signals pointing in the opposite direction, towards a run. Gore is fond of quoting Churchill and his warnings of "the gathering storm" of fascism. And everyone knows that Churchill came out of the political wilderness to lead the battle against the storm. It's telling too that when it comes to the hard choices people will have to make to curb carbon emissions, Gore is reluctant to be specific, preferring to suggest that we in the west can both lead comfortable, luxurious lives and be good to the environment. Under pressure, he admits there will have to be hard choices, but even then he sounds more like a politician wary of alienating voters than an activist telling the unvarnished truth.

Interview: Al Gore on his mission to save the planet | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited

The recommendations in An Inconvenient Truth were reasonable things like having properly inflated tires and insulated houses. These are hardly the rantings of some anarcho-primitivist.

Furthermore, Al Gore does take steps to reduce his load on the environment. It is true that he is not a saint. However, he is doing more than you or I to lessen global warming. This comes from the same Guardian article:

Surely he could make a start by flying less? "Beginning two years ago, I made a decision to live a carbon-neutral life," he says, explaining that his family and businesses now do all they can to reduce their emissions and to "offset" the rest by giving money to carbon-reduction schemes in India and eastern Europe. He also says he has talked to Richard Branson at Virgin and British Airways about the problem with aviation fuel, one of the single biggest sources of carbon dioxide. "They're aware of it," he says. Mere awareness is hardly enough, is it? "There will have to be a day of reckoning that takes this into account," he concedes.

From a CNN Larry King Live interview with Al Gore (Aired June 13, 2006):

GORE: I drive a hybrid. Tipper and I got a Lexus hybrid. And we have a couple of Priuses in the family with our children. And I encourage people to make environmentally conscious choices because we all have to solve this climate crisis.

CNN.com - Transcripts

I saw your most recent post about global warming not passing any tests. How many documents do you want me to get to support global warming? Ten, a hundred, a thousand? I can easily do that to counter your mistaken claim. Let's settle for ten to start off. By Sunday, I will find ten good articles on global warming. You can find ten articles, preferably not from the American Petroleum Institute, that claim that global warming is not happening or is not due to human activity.

I know that you and many other conservatives view global warming as a hoax spawned by the amorphous 'left'. I ask you to put aside that for our debate, as hard as it may be. I don't mean this condescendingly. I think it is essential to stop viewing Al Gore and all the IPCC as adversarial.

I believe the climate crisis is not a political, but a moral issue.