TopHatter

OK, fine. Let them drive to their heart's content. They'll probably be pulled over fairly quickly for failing to obey roadsigns (a basic command of English is useful, though the pretty colors and symbols can compensate for the lack).

However, regardless if they are pulled over or not, if I.D. is requested by a police officer, they darn well shouldnt be able to produce it. Why not? Because they're ILLEGAL!

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Confed999

I give up on this one, I still have no idea what you're arguing...

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I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry

Veni Vidi Vici

Thats one of the only ways we can get 'em deported if we can catch them committing an illegal act(other then being here of course). In my line of work it sucks to know that someone is illegal but not be able to do a damn thing about it.

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TopHatter

Oh you have got to be kidding me.
Let me get this straight. Someone is illegally in the country, you as an LEO can prove this, and yet your hands are tied? Uh..why?

Trooth

Perhaps i am making a fundamental mistake. Don't you have to demonstrate some competence with a car / roadsigns etc to get a driving license in the US? I am assuming you do and therefore someone passing that test would be a good thing? Hell you could give them a driving license with "illegal immigrant" all over it if you wanted to.

I see that as a seperate arguement from them being in the country, which of course they shouldn't be, but are they actually going to be removed (and therefore not drive illegally and perhaps dangerously anyway?

What ID do people use in the US to get a driving license anyway? Would illegal immigrants have that anyway?

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TopHatter

As I recall, I needed something that the US Mail had delivered to me at my new address, or a receipt for rent with the address on it. Although, most of the time, when I move within the state of Florida, I just bring my old one, tell them I've moved, smile for the camera and walk out with a new one.

Trooth

This might be my confusion, in earlier posts the drivers licesne was mentioned as an "all purpose" ID. But if the ID for it is so easily obtained, i am surprised it can carry so much weight (i.e. receiving state services).

TopHatter

Let's back up just a tad. I was answering your question about the "ID used to obtain a driver's license", not how to actually get one.
I'm sure you do don't need me to tell how you actually get obtain one.
Further, I have only had to renew or update my DL. It's been around 15 years since I actually had to obtain one for the first time, so my memory is a little hazy on the details.
Yes, a DL is a 'jack of all trades' I.D. that is used for....well, just about everything, from proving your age to buy cigs and alcohol to proving you are indeed the person authorized to use that credit card you just presented for payment of goods and services.

dalem

I guess a load of rock salt in the backside is too much paperwork?

-dale

dalem

I would appreciate it if you would please answer my question from above so I can try and figure out if we are even operating with the same boundary conditions:

"As an extreme example, some of them are going to acquire guns - should we allow them to be licensed to own a firearm? After all, by your logic they are going to have them anyway, right?"

-dale

ChrisF202

Thats because most Americans still live under a false notion that immigrants "just want a better life". For some, that is true; but for a large majority of them "a better life" translates to joining a gang/criminal actions, raping the benefits of our country (in terms of education, healthcare, etc) and the like.

Thankfully, more Americans are waking up and admitting that we have a serious problem over immigration numbers.

Veni Vidi Vici

Yep, and unless I can catch them red handed commiting a criminal act I have no right to arrest or detain them. Damn politicians pass these crappy laws to be PC to the criminals.

Trooth

Do you have to pass a competency test to own a firearm? If poeple are going to have guns anyway then making sure they can handle them propoerly can't be a bad thing. As i understand it people have to have backrgound check to have a gun therefore being an illegal immigrant would disqualify them under the background checks? Or would they just be able to flash their driver's license to get a gun? In which case i think the ID system needs an overhaul and no they should not have driver's licenses! But i think this debate is just highlighting a flaw in the system.

TopHatter

The laws regarding the regulation of firearms vary from state to state, sometimes wildly. There are, of course, federal laws regarding firearms that are applicable throughout the country, such as owning a machine gun (gotta get that Class III permit to own one).

To answer your question a bit more directly, and only in the context of the State of Florida: No, you do not need to pass any kind of test (other than a cursory background check) to own a "firearm".
However, are you refering to a rifle or handgun? Will said firearm be purchased from a business or a private owner? I was able to purchase my dinky little .380 handgun from a private owner (a good friend and co-worker) without involving the State in the transaction at all. Detailed receipts/photos of the pistol's serial number were written up and signed by all parties, including a witness.
Now, getting a Carry Concealed Permit, that is a little different story, but still not tremendously difficult, unless of course you happen to be a convicted criminal or someone with a history of mental illness.

dalem

So you are in favor of allowing illegal aliens to become legally licensed for priveleged activities while they are here illegally? I'm afraid I can no longer respect anything you have to say on this topic.

-dale