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I don't want to belabor the point; however, did you read the post before the last one you hust made? Please do.
Iowa Class Battleships
Virginia Class Nuclear Attack Submarines
Amphibious Assault Ships
Aerligh Burk Class Destroyers
Nimitz Class Carriers
Littoral Combat Ships
[QUOTE=D-Wray] By the way when citing the sinking of the Bismarck or Yamato why don't you cout the number of shells, torpedoes, and bombs it took to sink them? QUOTE]
Unfortunately, one torpedo to screw up (pardon pun) the Bismark's prop/s and rudder and I am under the impression that the Yamato was beached and used as a fixed battery.
Where's the bloody gin? An army marches on its liver, not its ruddy stomach.
I don't want to belabor the point; however, did you read the post before the last one you hust made? Please do.
The post immediately previous or the last post that I made.Originally Posted by Franco Lolan
Where's the bloody gin? An army marches on its liver, not its ruddy stomach.
"Granit and Sunburns are dedicated carrier killers."
Actually Sandbox and Shipwreck(Granit) are the dedicated Carrier killers....and they attack on a steep diving trajectory to buckle the flight deck.
Despite their massive warheads, they are not designed to punch through 18" steel plates.
Sunburn's 320kg(Compared to 1000kg for sandbox and 900kg for Shipwreck) warhead is far too small to penetrate an Iowa's armored citadel or dual spaced triple layered hull.
Last edited by Bill; 27 Nov 04, at 07:41.
good point. I see.
However, are battleships useful right now unless in bombarding shore targets?
(Ironically, I was telling this to my little brother (age 7) yesterday)
I understand that a battleship would be great if armed with rail guns, but are 16" what we need right now?
DARPA fully tested 13" and 11" sabot rounds in the 80s that had ranges of 65 and 90 miles respectively.
That's longer range than a Harpoon, at about 4x the flight speed, and with a quite capable warhead.
Several types were produced, including DPICM(cluster/mine), HE, and AP.
The Iowas also carry 32 TLAM cruise missiles and 16 Harpoon missiles with a secondary battery of 12x 5" guns.
An Iowa can also launch as many as 4 MV-22 Osprey or 6 MH-53 helos for Specops raids. Assuming the F-35B VTOL version of JSF ever works, an Iowa could rearm and refuel two of those at a time. For ASW duty, an Iowa can fully support the operations of 8-10 MH-60 Seahawks.
Finally, the Iowas even as currently configured have 6 onboard RPVs.
Yeah, they'd most certainly still have a role to fill in today's navy.
Last edited by Bill; 28 Nov 04, at 21:58.
The entire discussion is based on the fact that there is no current weapon in the armoury or other countries to take out a BB.
This may change if they r introduced in larger no.s..Developing larger torpedoes and larger AShMs would be a likely response by other countries...A larger moskit preferably an air launched one fitted on a Tu 22 or Tu 160 could be introduced by Russia(for themselves/China)..Also larger torpedoes could be made...Also other countries could themselves introduce the BBs...
But you r right in saying that they would be a cheap platform 4 intimidating and attacking poor countries...
interesting. status of Iowa Class:
http://www.warships1.com/US/BB61stats/-home page
http://www.warships1.com/US/BB61stat...-BB2-pst03.htm -saying how not obsolete
Last edited by Franco Lolan; 28 Nov 04, at 19:50.
"Also other countries could themselves introduce the BBs..."
That's pretty funny.
Russia already uses the SS-N-19 shipwreck. It's hard to imagine an AShM any bigger than that thing, and besides, an Iowa would be escorted by numerous Aegis warships anyway. You'd have to beat their defensive screen just to get a chance at hitting an Iowa.
Regardless, today's torps would be pretty effective against an Iowa, but again, you've got to beat the BBs screen first before you can even try.
Two of the four Iowa BBs, the USS Iowa and the USS Wisconson are still in the USN Category B reserve force.
Last edited by Bill; 28 Nov 04, at 21:57.
/*Also other countries could themselves introduce the BBs..."
That's pretty funny. */
What's so funny abt it?
They'd have to build them from scratch.
Forgetting the fact that 95% of the world utterly lacks the industry or technology to build one, would you care to venture a guess as to what it would cost to build a modern battleship?
You're talking super carrier $$$.
NO Nation has built a battleship since 1945.
Of course the one thing that should REALLY be on the most needed list but isn't is tactical carrier aircraft.
USN has a TON of unused deck space nowadays.
[QUOTE=The Chap]Yes that one lucky torpedoe hit the Bismarcks Achilles heel and jammed the rudder however that was a long way from sinking her. The Bismarck at that time was a lone ship (having released the Prinz Eugen to escape) against the bulk of the whole British Navy after her and still fought it out to the end. It was the Musashi that was grounded not the Yamato. The Yamato was sunk elswhere. None of that was the point anyway everyone seems so in love with these fire and forget weapons (self guided) that they forget one shot, one missile, one torpedo is not enough to do the job with a battleship it'll take that hit and keep on fighting and as has been pointed out by others battleships do not operate alone so that getting those multiple hits needed to do the jop is not so easy.By the way when citing the sinking of the Bismarck or Yamato why don't you cout the number of shells, torpedoes, and bombs it took to sink them? QUOTE]
Unfortunately, one torpedo to screw up (pardon pun) the Bismark's prop/s and rudder and I am under the impression that the Yamato was beached and used as a fixed battery.
Ah, yes. More proof -were it needed - that God is indeed an Englishman
Where's the bloody gin? An army marches on its liver, not its ruddy stomach.
US ASW efforts have languished since the Soviet threat disappeared, and the biggest threat to a CBG comes from SSK's. The recent excersizes with the Aussies and their Collins Class boats should have driven this point home.
Supersonic ASM's like P-800/Yakhont/Brahmos, or Sunburn/Moskit have to get within the defensive screen to be a threat. The longest range ASCM is the Brahmos/Yakhont at 300 km. It would be awfully tough for an aircraft or skimmer to penetrate the defensive screen that far if the CBG is on a wartime footing. But the sub-launched version, the P-800 can be fired from a 650mm tube, same as the SS-N-16 Stallion. Akula Class has 4 650mm tubes.
Kilos can carry the (SS-N-27) cruise missile system which fires the 3M-54E1 ASM. Range is 220km with 450kg high explosive warhead.
Not to mention the variety of torps that both boats can carry.
With the buildup of the Chinese SSK fleet, I see that as the biggest threat to the USN. Kilos are a known quantity, but the 093 and Yuan class boats are unknowns.
We have only the 3 Seawolf class boats and the one Virginia class. We should have 30.
So I vote for Virginia Class SSN.
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