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Thread: Destroyers - Fletcher Class

  1. #1561
    Senior Contributor blidgepump's Avatar
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    Christmas came early....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ytlas View Post
    Salty,

    That is the best present! Thank you!

    The tour just got a little bit better.

  2. #1562
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    I was just looking at the General Booklet Plans of the USS Sigsbee
    http://www.hnsa.org/doc/plans/dd502.pdf
    and the compartment of A-0103 was the bridge urinal space as built.
    You don't suppose that on the ships that received later mods that the bridge personnel had to give up their urinal?

    Attachment 30881

  3. #1563
    Senior Contributor blidgepump's Avatar
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    Offiicers urinal not adequate to suppress fire.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ytlas View Post
    I was just looking at the General Booklet Plans of the USS Sigsbee
    http://www.hnsa.org/doc/plans/dd502.pdf
    and the compartment of A-0103 was the bridge urinal space as built.
    You don't suppose that on the ships that received later mods that the bridge personnel had to give up their urinal?

    Attachment 30881
    Salty,

    You present a lot of questions for me to ask with just one of your postings. but it is still very interesting to me !

    First... did the USN take the position that an Officer could not urinate sufficiently to suppress a fire in the 7.2 ammo locker?

    Second... get me straight on this deck identifier thing ( Please !)

    Is the Main deck ( i.e. the deck that runs from bow to stern ) called the Main deck?

    Is the first deck above the main deck referred to as the 01 level ? and so forth as you climb higher?

    When to go below are the decks numbered 1 through 2,3,4,5, as you descend?
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    Last edited by blidgepump; 24 Nov 12, at 21:39.

  4. #1564
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    Quote Originally Posted by blidgepump View Post
    Salty,

    You present a lot of questions for me to ask with just one of your postings. but it is still very interesting to me !

    First... did the USN take the position that an Officer could not urinate sufficiently to suppress a fire in the 7.2 ammo locker?

    Second... get me straight on this deck identifier thing ( Please !)

    Is the Main deck ( i.e. the deck that runs from bow to stern ) called the Main deck?

    Is the first deck above the main deck referred to as the 01 level ? and so forth as you climb higher?

    When to go below are the decks numbered 1 through 2,3,4,5, as you descend?
    Yup, Main Deck is normally 1 and when you go up it's 01 and up. I seem to remember a ship where the main deck was 01 but since I can't come up with a name or class maybe it's just brain damage.

    Decks below main deck are 2, 3, 4. Don't forget compartments with even numbers to port and odd numbers to starboard.


    They might have relocated the urinal somewhere else aft on the same level or one level below but close. I imagine in the thick of battle, the sailors on the bridge of Fletcher Class DD's didn't always need to find urinals to take care of business.
    Last edited by Ytlas; 24 Nov 12, at 23:02.

  5. #1565
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    Quote Originally Posted by blidgepump View Post
    Salty,

    You present a lot of questions for me to ask with just one of your postings. but it is still very interesting to me !

    First... did the USN take the position that an Officer could not urinate sufficiently to suppress a fire in the 7.2 ammo locker?

    Second... get me straight on this deck identifier thing ( Please !)

    Is the Main deck ( i.e. the deck that runs from bow to stern ) called the Main deck?

    Is the first deck above the main deck referred to as the 01 level ? and so forth as you climb higher?

    When to go below are the decks numbered 1 through 2,3,4,5, as you descend?
    Good thing you had a guide otherwise you would have gotten lost. Luckily you had light to see. When in the ghost fleet there are lights maybe 50% of the time. So when we go there and I manage to stumble onto one of the ship document spaces I check for the diagrams, by systems, of the ships layout. Once I get that then all I have to do is look up what spaces we are trying to find and note the space number. Then it is off into the dark we go.

    Note that the Iowa has a O12 Level in the tower. The Hornet has an O11 Level which is where you stand on top of the island. Try going from O10 down to main deck on the Hornet at least 6-8 times a days. You are going O1-O10 with main deck being equivalent to almost three decks (hanger space) for a total of 13 levels. Then there are the trips to my storage area at O5, Admiral's Sea Cabin, which also has a working head, thank you. At the end of an 8 hour day my legs and lower back are aching.

  6. #1566
    Senior Contributor blidgepump's Avatar
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    Moving on....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ytlas View Post
    I imagine in the thick of battle, the sailors on the bridge of Fletcher Class DD's didn't always need to find urinals to take care of business.
    Probably just evaporated!

    I now understand "the tag" on the sea water line,too, TY.
    There will be some better photos of the 7.2 and shuttle ports later in the thread.
    The plan sheets will help track my progress from bow to stern on many levels or is that decks ???

  7. #1567
    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ytlas View Post
    I was just looking at the General Booklet Plans of the USS Sigsbee
    http://www.hnsa.org/doc/plans/dd502.pdf
    and the compartment of A-0103 was the bridge urinal space as built.
    You don't suppose that on the ships that received later mods that the bridge personnel had to give up their urinal?
    Sigsbee was a round bridge Fletcher, Sullivans was a square bridge one. According to my "Anatomy of the Ship: USS Sullivans" there never was bridge urinal on the 01 level.
    There was a Bridge Head on the 02 level though
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

  8. #1568
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    I missed that feature....

    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    Sigsbee was a round bridge Fletcher, Sullivans was a square bridge one. According to my "Anatomy of the Ship: USS Sullivans" there never was bridge urinal on the 01 level.
    There was a Bridge Head on the 02 level though
    I took quite a few pictures of the bridge "02 level" and I missed the urinal on my tour if it still exist!
    One reason I enjoy this thread is learning. But as you stated GG, each Fletcher DD was customized extensively.
    "The Sullivans" has been modified from it's service profile to allow for tourists. Thus some of the information to
    follow may not necessary be an accurate "As is" for the DD reporting to duty circa 1945 to 1964!

    But I did pay attention to the "scuttlebutt" on the ship as warned by Salty.
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    Last edited by blidgepump; 25 Nov 12, at 20:12.

  9. #1569
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    Quote Originally Posted by blidgepump View Post
    I took quite a few pictures of the bridge "02 level" and I missed the urinal on my tour if it still exist!
    One reason I enjoy this thread is learning. But as you stated GG, each Fletcher DD was customized extensively.
    "The Sullivans" has been modified from it's service profile to allow for tourists. Thus some of the information to
    follow may not necessary be an accurate "As is" for the DD reporting to duty circa 1945 to 1964!

    But I did pay attention to the "scuttlebutt" on the ship as warned by Salty.
    If GG says there's a urinal I'm sure there is. Obviously the space has to be locked up or people will use it. When ships came in for overhaul and the crews moved off. They tried to secure the urinals and commodes by using plastic and even duct taping plywood over the commodes. It usually wasn't too long and you'd see the duct tape cut and the plywood moved a bit on the commodes.

  10. #1570
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    Looking at the book, there was a head on the 02 level in 1944. Just behind the sea cabin washroom. On the port side it was the aft hatch. The only other hatch on that side was for the pilot room.

    In 1959 refit, the head went away. Space taken by the Sonar Control room.

    During that same time on the 01 level the Radio room Coding room and 40mm ready service room got chopped to hell with the majority of the space being taken by the 7.2 handling room.

    Thats what you have to love about Fletchers. Each one is a bit different than the other.
    Last edited by Gun Grape; 25 Nov 12, at 22:15.
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

  11. #1571
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    Looking at the book, there was a head on the 02 level in 1944. Just behind the sea cabin washroom. On the port side it was the aft hatch. The only other hatch on that side was for the pilot room.

    In 1959 refit, the head went away. Space taken by the Sonar Control room.

    During that same time on the 01 level the Radio room Coding room and 40mm ready service room got chopped to hell with the majority of the space being taken by the 7.2 handling room.

    Thats what you have to love about Fletchers. Each one is a bit different than the other.
    Usually there is a Planning Yard for a class of ship. With the Sigsbee's plans, I'd say that New York Navy Yard was the planning yard for the class. I would expect that for each type of mod, there would be additional revised prints done so that other ships of the class getting the same mods in any yard would have prints to work off of. I wouldn't expect the Navy to be happy with the ship doing it's own DIY projects except for a dire emergency.

  12. #1572
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    It was a wartime class with 10 different yards building the ships. Some mods came down mid construction and partial mods were included in some of those builds depending on the yard. Same with ships coming back to the yards for refit, or to repair battle damage. Some got full updates, some partial and some none depending on what stage of building they were when the alts were approved.

    Just figuring out what ship had what AA guns at any one time can be a nightmare. Some started out with 1.1s (First of the class). That was deemed inadequate, but there was a shortage of 40mm mounts. Same with the 20mm. What number and what location.

    Then there were forward base modifications and repairs that caused differences.

    (edit) 175 Fletchers were commissioned between June 1942 and Sept 1944. That's why, when building a model, you pick the individual ship AND the date you want he to represent.

    Post war mods are just as bad.

    Some ships stayed as original in WW2. Some got the late war AA mods. Some were converted to DDE. Some got trainable hedgehog launchers in place of the 52 mount. Some got Weapon Alpha in the 52 slot. Some kept the 52 mount and only got 7.2in fixed hedgehogss where the foreward 40mm mounts were. Some had the 40mm replaced with 3/50s, some didn't. Three got FRAMed.

    In reality, the only difference between ships built now and those then was the scale (largest class ever built) and the compressed time. The USS Wasp is a different ship than the Iwo Jima. Both as built and as presently in commission. Same class but one commissioned in 89 the other in 2001. And look at the different Domes, antennas and especially the aft end views.
    Last edited by Gun Grape; 26 Nov 12, at 04:45.
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

  13. #1573
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    You still need plans because pieces like foundations for the small weapons are built in shops then taken out to the ship. You need plans to figure out how to fix the battle damage. When you remove a damaged stern, bow, superstructure pieces and then install another one that was fabricated in a shop, everything better have been built to the exact specs of the prints or they're not going to line up. I can remember on some of the mods of some ships where they had like Naval Architects come out and check the work in progress, even make some changes in the plans on site before going back to the office. Those changes were going to help the next time a ship needed that work, no matter what yard.

    I screwed up my knee at work and after spending one day sitting with the sick, lame and lazy, I volunteered for any duty to get me out of the room of bums. I got up to Plan Files where I spent a lot of months cataloging and going over tens of thousands of blueprints. My knee was better after a short time but I embedded myself in that section for quite a while. There was a lot of interesting stuff buried in the vault.
    Last edited by Ytlas; 26 Nov 12, at 05:23.

  14. #1574
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    Labor saving device.....

    Next stop on the tour....

    A place that every sailor appreciates, the powered windlass to hoist the anchor(s)
    If I am getting the swing of things, Level 1, frame 10 to 18 on center looking aft?

    It appears the crew is serious about securing the anchors with the "dogs" tied off?
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    Last edited by blidgepump; 26 Nov 12, at 16:53.

  15. #1575
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    Looking from another view in the Windlass compartment...

    Another view of the Windlass drive looking to starboard.
    When one has time to study the picture questions surface.
    The assumption is that the brass wheel in the upper right corner
    is a "brake" to control the drive mechanism for the anchor chain.
    Power for the large reduction gear is a electric motor which sits to the left out of frame.
    The deck hatch is one of those numerous places there just wasn't time to explore.
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    Last edited by blidgepump; 27 Nov 12, at 17:13.

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