rickusn

The USN you ask?

2 CV

10 CVN( Plus 1+1 building)

12 Amphibious assault carriers(Plus 1+1 building)

25 CG-47 Aegis Cruisers(three to be decommissioned soon)(the rest being modernized) 9,600fl

3 DD-963(All to be decommissioned soon) 9300fl

43 DDG-51 AEGIS Destroyers(Plus 19 building) 8900-9200fl(Japan has similar ships)

30 FFG-7 4100fl (This is the OHP class found in a # of other navies)

SSN

1 774 class(building up to 30)

3 21 class

50 688 class


4 SSGN

14 SSBN

rickusn

Ya know whats irritating in my life.............well I can count on one hand the people who are REALLY interested in Naval affairs.

Its a shame really .

InVada

Like to add Australia has confirmed building of 3 Aegis equiped Air warfare destroyers, and are also tendering for 2 large Amphibious Assault ships around the 20,000 to 27,000 tonne class. There tossing between a larger version of the New Spanish assault ship and the new French assault ships. There is speculation that down the track they might acquire VSTOL JSF's for deployment on these new ships. The Australian navy requirement is that these new ships can hold up to 18 helicopters. There will be enough room on these ships for aircraft deployment. And the Oliver Hazard Perry (Adelaide) frigates are currently being upgraded to SM-2 missile standard. The MEKO 200 (Anzac class) frigates are being upgraded with the evolved sea-sparrow missile system to.

rickusn

Yes Austrailia is an excellent medium size Navy and with its modernization plans will only get better. Thx Rick

I tried to leave out shipbuilding plans where first steel has not yet been cut.

The main reason Russia isnt in a Tier of its own is because it basically(exception modest submarine programs) has no mod. plan.

IT also lacks adequate maintenance, spare parts, operational funds and a trained professional enlisted corps.

Now its Pacific Fleet destroyer squadron did make a deployment for ops with India earlier this year. And the Northern Fleet battle group centerd around the aircraft carrier Kunetsov recently returned from a N. Atlantic deployment.

Its interesting though that the Kirov class battle cruiser remained at anchor off Iceland for the duration of the deployment.

If funding isnt increased soon the Russian Navy will continue to deteriorate. But they are making some progress as evidenced by the above deployments.

ajaybhutani

when are these ships expected to be inducted??

rickusn

If I remember correctly sometime early in the next decade.

rickusn

Indian Navy Update Point/Counterpoint:

'Indian Navy will become leaner and meaner'

November 04, 2004 20:10 IST



The Indian Navy is on course to becoming a leaner force with augmented weapon, sensor and network-centric competence to give it endurance, punch and extended operational range, Chief of Naval Staff Admiral Arun Prakash has said.

"By 2015-20 the Indian Navy will be a three-aircraft carrier force -- one aircraft carrier on either coast and one in reserve – with adequate surface and subsurface combatants, robust reserves and sound logistical support for blue water operations and visibility wherever national interests dictate," Admiral Prakash told the 'Jane's Defence Weekly'.

"In the past, our ship-building and force-planning went awry due to the skewed debate over large versus small units," he said. The continuing reappraisal of the navy is going to rectify this error by maintaining little more than half of its 140-145 vessels as ocean-going, he said. The remainder will be assigned for coastal duties.

Admiral Prakash said work on refurbishing the Admiral Gorshkov, the 44,500-tonne Kiev-class Russian aircraft carrier that India acquired for the price of its refit (estimated at about 675 million dollars), at Russia's Sevmash shipyard is "encouraging".

He said, "The service is keeping its options open for a new enhanced weapons fit, fire-control system, radar and sensors for the 20 MIG-29K fighters, including four trainers, meant for the Gorshkov.

The navy reportedly paid 1.5 billion dollars for the 20 MIG-29Ks.

Admiral Prakash said the Indian Navy also plans to buy between 15 and 20 MIG-29Ks for the 35,000-37,000 tonne Air Defence Ship being built locally.

He regretted the "lacunae" in the Indian Navy's submarine building programme, stressing that it is a problem that needs the government's immediate attention, as many submarines are scheduled to retire by 2010.

He hoped the Project 75 contract to build six French Scorpene e-class submarines at Mazagaon dockyard in Mumbai will be signed soon.

According to the report, India is in talks with the US government for acquiring between six and eight refurbished P-3C Orions through the US foreign military sales programme, with the option of obtaining an equal number later. The acquisition will help the navy meet its maritime patrol needs. "But we would need assurances of life-time product support from the US," Admiral Prakash said.

The report said nearly a third of the service's 27 Sea King helicopters are grounded for nearly three years because of a shortage of spares following sanctions imposed by Washington on India in the wake of the 1998 nuclear tests.

The Indian Navy is carefully watching China's naval buildup and also the developments in the Pakistan navy. Of particular interest, said the Admiral, are China's naval activities in Myanmar, where it is helping modernise the country's armed forces and its ports, and its role in developing Gwadar on Pakistan's western Makran coast.

A Chinese naval presence in Gwadar will give Beijing a strategic edge in the oil-rich Persian Gulf area, Admiral Prakash said. "We are watching China's navy making an entry to our west and east, but there is no cause for trepidation. We, too, are building up our navy and are quite capable of looking after ourselves," he said



The Indian Navy's white elephant
You have recently completed your bungalow and are on the lookout to hire some people for security. Pandu chowkidar has agreed to do the job along with his friend for about Rs 2,000 a month per person. But your good friend who has a security business steps in. Don't waste your money, he says. I have a surplus of these people. I can give you a couple free. But what about some electronic fencing and surveillance cameras? Before you know it he has sold you equipment worth a couple of lakhs.




India's imminent purchase of the Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov comes pretty close to this illogical purchase.

A little background first. The Gorshkov is one of four carriers built by the erstwhile Soviet Union during the Seventies at the height of the Cold War. The first three, the Kiev, the Minsk and the Novorossyisk, saw operational service in the Soviet Navy during the late Seventies and the Eighties.

When the Cold War ended the Russians no longer could sustain a fleet with so many carriers and they were all sold for scrap in the early Nineties.

The Gorshkov, earlier called the Baku, was the last to be completed and did not become operational until 1986. Her operational career was cut short, however, when a devastating fire crippled the ship. Although she was repaired, the Gorshkov never saw operational service thereafter.

In the late Eighties, the Indian Navy began to look for options to replace the ageing Vikrant and Viraat. The original idea was to build one in India. Various actions were taken towards that goal.

Apparently wanting to get into the act, the Russians offered the Gorshkov to the navy in 1994. The purchase had many difficulties. The ship was far bigger that what the navy was looking for. At 45,000 tons and with a deep draught, the ship was not capable of entering Mumbai harbour, which was the logical place for basing it if the navy wanted it primarily as an air defence ship for the Western Fleet.

The navy also did not have adequate facilities to carry out major repairs. But though the price was more than ten times what the navy had paid for the Viraat, it was still worth consideration at Rs 1,000 crore. Many in the navy were for the deal.

But when the navy dilly-dallied, the Russians hit upon a new gambit. We will give you the carrier free, they said. Just take it away and do what you want with it.

Naval eyes lit up at the word 'free'. When the navy and defence ministry were truly and properly hooked, the Russians slowly let in the rider. You will, of course, need to modify and refit the ship for use in India. We will do it for you. It will only take a couple of years and cost you Rs 3,000 crore.

And of course you will require a squadron or two of our latest carrier-based fighter, the MiG 29K. Cost? Another 6,000 crore. Thus the total cost of this rather doubtful acquisition is anywhere between Rs 6,000 crore and Rs 10,000 crore.

In his first term as India's defence minister, George Fernandes promised to bring in greater transparency in India's arms deals. Yet these remain as opaque and unfathomable today as they ever were. No one can make head or tail out of the Gorshkov purchase. Why is a poor nation so intent on seeing through this exorbitant deal? And where is the Indian Navy, with an annual budget of only 3,000 crore, finding the money to pay for all this? Can the job not be done much more cheaply?

Not getting the right answers to these questions, the general belief is that there is something fishy about the whole deal. Recent deals with Russia, including the Rs 6,000 crore Su-30MK deal and Rs 4,500 crore frigate deal, have all been subjects of controversy. None of these deals has been adequately explained by the government.

There is no doubt that the Indian Navy requires a carrier. It needs it to defend its fleet on the high seas against air strikes. Anti-submarine helicopter patrols and strikes against surface targets are added bonuses, not necessities.

Are there reasonable alternatives? Of course there are. The requirements of the navy can be met by a small, 20,000 ton air defence ship. Indeed, the government has placed an order for just such a ship with the Cochin Shipyard. A Spanish yard will build such a ship for about Rs 3,000 crore. The Koreans will build a utility carrier by modifying a merchant ship with a flattop for Rs 500 crore and deliver it in 18 months. Getting the Gorshkov to do the job is like using Schumacher's F1 Ferrari to do your weekly shopping.

The purchase of the Gorshkov at this price will also bring many other headaches to the navy. Apart from the basing and refitting problems, there will be operational problems. No naval chief will ever be willing to risk such a high-value ship in the Arabian Sea in any conflict with Pakistan. Karwar will not be ready for another 10 years and basing the Gorshkov on the east coast will create other difficulties.

In today's charged atmosphere, a conflict can erupt at short notice and be over before the mighty Gorshkov arrives to deliver her punch. The purchase will also require the navy to mortgage its capital expenditure for the next several years. Indeed, it will be a millstone around the necks of the next two chiefs.

Viewed from all sides, if the prime minister inks the Gorshkov deal during his visit to Moscow, it will be the most illogical purchase ever between India and Russia.

With the Indian economy in the doldrums, or at least not as bright as it once was, the last thing we want is a profligate armed force. The Indian Navy cannot expect the nation to give it everything it wants at the cost of the nation's economy. Alternatively, the navy has to live within its budget. Cheaper alternatives to the Gorshkov must be considered.

Traditionally, naval ships have been painted a shade of dark gray. If the Gorshkov is purchased, the Indian Navy might make an exception and paint the ship white. For the aircraft carrier is bound to be the biggest white elephant in the navy's fleet.

Admiral (retd) J G Nadkarni

rickusn

(Tier 7)(A mixed bag of older and in some cases modern ships most have no SSKs )(

New Zealand

2 German-built MEKO 200 3500fl

Bahrain

1 ex-USN OHP 3700fl

UAE

2 ex-Netherlands Kortenaer 3800fl

Poland(should be in the next tier up)

FF

2 ex-USN OHP 3700fl

1+1 +4 MEKO 100 very capable,armed like a MEKO 200 but only 2100fl maybe only two will be built vice 6

SSK

1 Russian built- KILO

4 small coastal ex-Norwegian German-built Type 207

Romania

1 DD Russian-built 5,800fl of limited combat value

2 ex-UK Boxer class 4900fl

Ukraine

1 ex-Russian Krivak III 3700fl

Mexico

4 ex-USN Knox class 4300fl of limited combat value

Algeria

3 small frigates

SSK

2 Russian-built Kilo

Libya

1 small frigate

Ecuador

FF

2 ex-UK Leander 3200fl

SSK

2 German-built Type 209

Bangladesh

1 S. Korean-built is not oprational because of serious construction defects

3 ex-UK of little combat value

1 small frigate

Morrocco

1 small frigate

Bulgaria

1 small frigate

SSK

1 ex-Soviet Romeo of limited combat value

Oman

2 small frigates

Uruquay

3 ex-French 2200fl over 40 years old of limited combat value



That makes 51 plus the USN. Ive attempted to list only small frigates thatt are relatively modern and useful combat value approx 1000-2000fl. Ive not noted numerous patrol vessels similar to USCG Cutters. Ive not noted numerous heavily armed missle boats of approx 250-700fl.

Ive have not commented for the most part on amphibious warfare ships, mine warfare ships and logistics ships. Although theses are an important part of an effective navy.

Except as noted and sometimes subjectively and unconciously have I taken into account funding, personnel issues, training, optempo, maintenance etc in addition to relative combat capabilities.


The end.

rickusn

Hokum I disagree a little about your opinion on the 1982 UK ships and systems and now. But there is no doubt that the UK needs to modernize its AAW and carrier force forwith. Its frigates are far more capable than those extant in 1982.

This from the GlobalSecurity website:

"Following the Falklands conflict, major changes were evidently needed to the Type 42, including an improved close-in weapons fit and improved damage control. A twin 30mm cannon, the GCM-A03, was added. And the 20mm Oerlikon guns were shifted to new platforms, with much improved GAM-B01 guns fitted. Subsequently, many other improvements were implemented, including an updated ECM, a new 3-D search radar (the Type 996) replaced the elderly Type 992 P/Q/R. First Mark 36 super-RBOC and later Sea Gnat counter-measures launchers replaced the Corvus launchers. Additionally, a new navigation radar, additional amidships superstructure, improved ADAWS integrated computing systems and updated SeaDart fire control and fusing systems were added."

In addition they were hampered by not having early-warning aircraft partially corrected with AEW Sea King Helos.

The Russian systems have many electronic deficiencies although the missles themselves are quite good. The Kirov class is of dubious value. The Sovremmennys also have inadequacies including inadequate ASW capabilities and especially apparently troublesome propulsion plants requiring much maintenance. The Udaloys are a response to the Spruance class being withdrawn from USN service and not nearly as capable. The Slavas have extremely limited combat value and damage control features they are more for prestige than anything and used primaril
y as Flagships. The Krivaks will soon cease to exist. There are no new surface combatants even planned.

From Combat Fleets about the Slavas:

"Officer accommodations are opulent by Western standards, even to the extent of installing a waterfall-equipped belowdecks swimming and a sauna"

The Russians do have large, long-range AShM but they are difficult to target. But once targeted no one has really developed effective countermeasures of either hard-kill or soft-kill. The Russians are producing a Harpoon/Exocet type missle now. The USN withdrew tactical Tomahawk many years ago although it is neither as large or as fast as the Russian missles.

Kontakt Era

Is India's Navy Any Good Compared To The Rest Of The Worlds Navy?

InVada

ajaybhutani

The 3 new Australian Airfare destroyers will be introduced from 2013 at a cost of $4.5 to $6 billion. The Australian government is deciding between an Evolved version of the Spanish designed F100, an Evolved version of the German Type F124 or the American Arleigh Burke Class destroyer. There most likely to form a part in the Missile Shield, armed with the new anti-ballistic missile the US are working on.

The 2 new Assault Ships will be introduced into service between 2010-2014 at a cost of $2 billion. The designs are being chosen from the French group Armaris for an extended version of there Mistral class, and the Spanish group IZAR.

rickusn

The navies in each Tier are ranked in no particular order.

{Tier 1}

<USN>

2 CV

10+1+1 CVN

12+1+1 Amphibious assault carriers

Cruisers

0+? CGX

25 CG-47 Aegis MK-41 VLS SM-2 Cruisers(three to be decommissioned soon)(the rest being modernized) 9,600fl

DDG

43+19 DDG-51 AEGIS MK41 -VLS SM-2 8900-9200fl (Japan has similar ships)

DD

0+? DDX

3 DD-963 (All to be decommissioned soon) 9300fl

FF

0+? LCS

30 4100fl (This is the OHP class found in a # of other navies)(USN ships no longer have SM-1/Harpoon missle launchers. There combat value is quite low)

SSN

1 774 class(building up to 30)

3 21 class

50 688 class


4 SSGN

14 SSBN


{Tier 2}

<France>

(building two amphibious assault carriers but not planned to operate fixed wing aircraft)

1 CVN

DDG

0+3 Horizon 7000fl

1 Masurca SAM built 1970 will retire soon

FFG(are typed as DDGs but are really frigates)

2 Cassard(have recycled SM-1 systems)

DD/FF(the first nine are typed DD but role is much like modern frigates)

0+17 5400fl (These will replace the above two units, one decommissioned Tourville class plus the two survivors, seven G. Leygues and the five La Fayette)

7 4500fl

2 5900fl

5 3600fl(no sonar)

9 small frigates

SSN

0+6 Barracuda to replace Rubis class

6 Rubis

4 SSBN

<UK>

0+2 CV

3 CVH(plus one amphibious assault carrier can operate Harriers )

DDG/FFG (Size and role more akin to modern AAW frigates)

0+8 Type 45 to replace Type 42

9 Type42 4300fl

FF

4 Type 22 4900fl

16 Type 23(three being prematurely decommissioned w/ 2 of them possibly being sold to Chili)

SSN

0+8 Astute to replace those below

11 Trafalger/Swiftsure

4 SSBN

<Russia>

(Surface combatants they have about 35. With as few as 19 operational. Divided between four (Northern, Pacific,Baltic Sea, Black Sea) non-supporting or ever will be mutually supportable fleets.)

1 CV

Cruisers

1-2 Kirov battle cruisers 26000fl

3 Slava cruisers 11500fl

DDG

4-9 Sovremmeny(sources conflict) (although the missles are of relatively short range compared to western DDGs) 8500fl

0-2 Kashin DDG(last I heard they were non-operational) 4500fl

DD

9 Udaloy (including the one II) 8400fl

FF

0-8 Krivak (last I heard they were all to be decommissioned by 2005) 3500fl

1 Neustrashimy 4300fl

1 Gepard(Caspian sea) 2000fl

A number of small frigates of little combat value.


12-20 SSN approx. operational(could be some Victor III left and not all of other classes in service are operational)

7 SSGN approx operational

7 Kilo SSK approx operational

9-14 SSBN approx operational(the five surviving Delta III were to be decommissioned by now but may stay in operation for some time yet)



{Tier 3}

<Japan>

(no carriers, SSNs, SSBNs but excellent modern forces otherwise in relatively large #s)(Would move up with carriers, SSNs/SSBNs these are not beyond their means but taboo politically and socially)

0 +4 Building four new 17000fl helicopter carriers could easily operate VSTOL aircraft. They are quite controversial.

4 DDH(To be replaced by the above) 6600-6800fl

4+2 US-design A Burke AEGIS DDG 9500fl

5 SM-1 DDG4800-5600fl

The following classed by Japan as DD are more akin to multi-purpose Frigates although the MK41 VLS equipped are extremely capable the four newest carry SM-2 controlled by a so-called mini-AEGIS:

4+4 MK41VLS(32) Takinami 5300fl

9 MK 41(16) and Mk 48 VLS Murasame 5100fl

8 Asagari4300fl

11 Hatsuyuki 3700fl

9 small frigates of little combat value although modern

18 modern SSK could have up to 30(building one per year) but are retiring units with only 20 years of service to save manning/operating costs.


<India>

(two carriers but older)(Plan to build three new indigenous design carriers)(Could move up if Fleet modernization plans move forward in a timely manner)(no SSNs or SSBNs)(Plan to lease one Akula SSN from Russia)

0+3 Indigenous design

1 CVL Ex-UK built

1 CVL Ex-Russian built

DDG

0+3 Aster SAM 6900

3 Project 15 SAN 7 6700

5 Russian-design Kashin SAN 1 4900fl

FFG

0+12 Project 17 SAN 7 5400fl

3+3 Russian-Krivak SAN 7 4,000fl

FF

2+1 Project 16A 4500fl

3 Project 16 4300fl

4 UK Leander 3000fl

8 small frigates

SSN

0+1 Russian-built Akula

SSK

0+ 6 possibly French-design Scorpene

6 German Type 209

10 Russian- built Kilo

2 Russian -built Foxtrot(obsolete)


<China>

(no carriers)( otherwise same as above as relates modernization)

DDGs

0+2 O52C AEGIS-Type

0+2 O52B SAN 7

2 +2 Russian- Built Sovremmenyy SAN 7 8500

DD(although armed more like multi-purpose frigates)

1 Luhai 6600fl

2 Luhu 5700fl

The below classified DD but would be classed Frigate by world standards :

16 Luda 7 of which have been modernized to some extent but still pretty much obsolete by world class standards 4000fl

0+4 new large Lafayette-type Frigates 3600fl

12 relatively modern Frigates but smallish 2300 fl

31 small Frigates of little combat value

1 SSBN (no operational missles)

3 SSN ( 5 built not a success the survivors may not be operational)

4 Russian-built Kilo SSK

5 Song SSK

19 Mings based on Russian Romeo design SSK

32 Romeo SSK

All but the Kilos and possibly the Song(some sources say they are a disappointment) have little combat value.



{Tier 4}

(All have a small carrier, Italy two, one is under construction)(Spain is building an Amphibious Assault Carrier as well)(well balanced fleets)

(excellent all around forces)(lack #s and SSNs/SSBNs)(modernizing)

<Italy>

(the new Horizon AAW ships may be designated as frigates)

DDG/FFG

0+2 Horizon class ASTER VLS 6700 fl

4 SM-1(two 1973 and two 1993)4500fl&5400fl respectively

FF

8 Mastrale 3200fl

4 Lupo variants(no sonar) 2500fl

4 small frigates of little combat value

SSK

0+2 German-design Type 212

6 indigenous design

<Spain>

FFG

2+2 AEGIS MK-41 VLS SM-2 5800fl

6 US-design OHP 4100fl

3 US-design modified Knox class SM-1 4200fl

SSK

0+4 French-design Scorpene

4 French-design Agosta

2 French-design Daphne


<Brazil>

(only reason here is they have a small carrier w/o it would move down to Tier 5B)

FF

4 ex-UK Broadsword 4400fl

6 UK-design 3800fl

2 ex-US Garcia 3600fl(of little combat value)

4+1 indigenous design 2400fl

SSK

4+1 German-design Type 209



{Tier 5A}

(For the most part very modern ships and balanced fleets)
(lack #s, carriers, SSNs, SSBNs but forces are very modern)

<The Netherlands>

FFG

3+1 APAR MK-41 VLS SM-2 6000fl

2 SM-1(being sold to Chile) 3800fl

FF

8 3200fl(two being sold to Chile)

SSK

4 indigenous design

<Germany>

FFG

2+1 APAR MK-41 VLS SM-2 5700fl

FF

4 4500fl

8 Dutch-design Kortenaer 3800fl

SSK

1+3 Type 212

11 type 206(very small coastal type)


<Austrailia>

(Once again modernization plans must move forward. Planned to build two amphibious assault carriers)

0+ 3 DDG/FFG AEGIS SM-2 design not finalised

FFG

6 US-design OHP SM-1 4100fl(two will soon be decommissioned w/the other four being modernized)

FF

6+2 German-design MEKO 200 3600fl

SSK

6 Swedish-design

<Canada>

(Lack modernization plans and funding)

DDG/FFG

3 Mk-41 VLS SM-2 5100fl(older but modernized one already out of service)

FF

12 4800fl

SSK

4 ex-UK Upholder class

<S. Korea>

(Are in the midst of modernization)(they are also building two medium size Amphibious Assault Carriers)

FFG

0+3 AEGIS SM-2

2+4 Mk-41 VLS SM-2 5000fl

FF

3 3900fl

9 2200fl

24 small frigates of little combat value

SSK

0+3 German- design Type 214

9 German design Type 209



{Tier 5B}

(These countries have same limitations as above plus their ships are a mix of older and newer but in some cases less capable ships than above although Taiwan and Turkey have many more surface combatants #s wise)

<Taiwan>

DDG

0+4 ex- Kidd class DDG(replacing 7 ex-US WWII vintage DD) 9600fl

FFG

8 OHP design Frigates 4100fl

FF

6 Lafayette design Frigates (w/ sonar unlike the French units) 3700fl,

8 ex-US Knox class Frigates 4300fl

0+20 indigenous design? 2000fl

SSK

2 Netherlands-built (but are trying to buy 8 modern ones)

<Turkey>

FFG

8 ex-US OHP Frigates 3900fl

FF

8 MEKO 200 Frigates 3000-3400fl

5 ex-US Knox Frigates 4300fl

SSK

12 +2 German-design Type 209

<Greece>

DDG

1 ex-US 4800fl

FF

4 MEKO 200 Frigates 3200fl

10 ex-Netherlands Kortenaer Frigate 3800fl

SSK

0+4 German design Type 214

8 German-design Type 209



Tiers 6A, 6B, 6C are navies in flux. But I thought some type of breakdown was necessary. 6A navies are on the cutting edge of technology but #s are closer to 6C which are modern compared to 6B in general.(Notable exception is Pakistan and Chiles new build SSKs.)



{Tier 6A}

(These countries are modernizing but have ships in far fewer #s than above, SSK are modern )

<Sweden>

5 Visby Stealth Corvettes 620fl(state of the art I would not normally list them)

SSK

4 indigenous designs

<Norway >

FFG

0+5 AEGIS MK-41 VLS Spanish-built 5100fl(To replace the small frigates below)

4 small frigates of limited combat value

SSK

6 German-built Type 210

<Denmark>

FFG

0+2 (Flexible Support ships a cross between a frigate and an amphibious ship) 6300fl

0+3 (slightly smaller than the above design not finalised)(To replace the small frigates below)

3 small frigates quite well-armed

SSK

1 ex-Swedish

<S.Africa>

FF

1+3 German-built MEKO 200 3600fl

SSK

3 German-built Type 209



{Tier 6B}

(These countries have older ships although especially in the case of Pakistan have good SSKs)(Have generally a couple more vessels than above.)

<Chile>

Replacing current fleet(4 ex-UK DD 6200fl and 4 ex-UK Frigates 3200fl)(2 or 3 of these in reserve) with up to 3 ex-UK Frigates w/ one already in service 4300-4900fl plus 4 ex-Netherlands Frigates. 3200-3800fl

SSK

1+1 French-built Scorpene
2 German-built 209

<Pakistan>

(6 ex-UK Frigates) 3700fl

(8 SSK w/ one building)(all French-built)

<Peru>

1 ex-Netherlands Cruiser 12000fl of little combat value

4 Lupo class Frigates 2500fl (were to get four ex-Italian Lupo Frigates but apparently this wont happen)

6 SSK German-built Type 209

<Venezuela>

6 Lupo class Frigates 2500fl

2 German-Built Type 209 SSK

<Indonesia>

6 UK-design ex-Netherland frigates 3000fl

2 SSK German-built Type 209


{Tier 6C}

(few ships mostly quite modern except Thailand but they do have a small carrier)(are not far behind the above navies and in somes areas superior)

<Thailand>

(no SSK)

FF

2 Chinese-built 3000fl
2 ex-US Knox class

4 small frigates of little combat value

<Argentina>

(vessels are newer than in Tier 6B but has similar #s although many are much smaller than those above)

FF

4 MEKO 360 3400fl

8 small frigates

SSK

2 German-built TR-1700

1 " " Type 209

<Iran>

(lack adequate surface combatants)

5 small frigates of little combat value(are building new ones)

SSK

3 Russian-built Kilo

<Singapore>

FF

0+6 French-designed 3200fl

SSK

4 ex-Swedish

<Malaysia>

FF

4 Frigates 2000fl-2300fl

SSK

0+-2 French-built Scorpene

<Saudi Arabia>

(no SSKs but very modern surface combatants)

FF

3 French-built 4700fl

4 " " 2600fl

4 small frigates

<Israel>

(lack adequate surface combatants)

3 small frigates but very powerful

SSK

3 German-built Type 800

<Portugal>

0+1 ex-US OHP 4100fl

FF

3 MEKO 200 3200fl

SSK

2 French- built being replaced by:

2 German-built

<Colombia>

4 small frigates very well armed

SSK

2 German-built Type 209

<Egypt>

( Like Argentina it could easily be in 6B as here)

FFG

4 ex-US OHP 3900fl

FF

2 ex-US Knox 4200fl

4 small frigates

SSK

4 Chinese Romeo but heavily modernized

<Poland>

FF

2 ex-USN OHP 3700fl

1+1 +4 MEKO 100 very capable,armed like a MEKO 200 but only 2100fl maybe only two will be built vice 6

SSK

1 Russian built- KILO

4 small coastal ex-Norwegian German-built Type 207




{Tier 7}

(A mixed bag of older and in some cases modern ships most have no SSKs )

<Belgium>

FF

3 indigenous design 2400fl

<New Zealand>

FF

2 German-built MEKO 200 3500fl

<Bahrain>

FFG

1 ex-USN OHP 3700fl

<UAE>

FF

2 ex-Netherlands Kortenaer 3800fl

<Romania>

DD

1 Russian-built 5,800fl of limited combat value

FF

2 ex-UK Boxer class 4900fl

<Ukraine>

FF

1 ex-Russian Krivak III 3700fl

Mexico

FF

4 ex-USN Knox class 4300fl of limited combat value

<Algeria>

3 small frigates

SSK

2 Russian-built Kilo

<Libya>

1 small frigate

<Ecuador>

FF

2 ex-UK Leander 3200fl

SSK

2 German-built Type 209

<Bangladesh>

FF

1 S. Korean-built is not oprational because of serious construction defects

3 ex-UK of little combat value

1 small frigate

<Morrocco>

1 small frigate

<Bulgaria>

1 small frigate

SSK

1 ex-Soviet Romeo of limited combat value

<Oman>

2 small frigates

<Uruquay>

FF

3 ex-French 2200fl over 40 years old of limited combat value



That makes 52 plus the USN.

Ive attempted to list only small frigates that are relatively modern and useful combat value approx 1000-2000fl.

Ive not noted numerous patrol vessels similar to USCG Cutters.

Ive not noted numerous heavily armed missle boats of approx 250-700fl.

Ive have not commented for the most part on amphibious warfare ships, mine warfare ships and logistics ships. Although theses are an important part of an effective navy.

Except as noted and sometimes subjectively and unconciously have I taken into account funding, personnel issues, training, optempo, maintenance etc in addition to age and relative combat capabilities of many platforms.

Once again I would be happy to try and answer general/specific questions of navies or platforms.

Kipruss

I've always wondered if NZ could take on Bahrain! That oil is ours

rickusn

LOL It would be a sea battle for the ages!!!!! Destined to be studied in great detail for centuries to come. LOL

Kipruss

This is a good thread, Rick. Nice Research. I was interested in Janes' analysis on these Defense (really Offense) matters but when I looked at the prices to "subscribe" I nearly had a fit.