Thread: Su-27 or F-15?

Originally Posted by canoe

Interesting to see the Superhonet and the Eurofighter have approximately the same RCS. I actually guessed that would be the case awhile back.

You can definately see the newer radars are able to distinguish small targets alot further away now though. And I think those are in the clean configuration given some weapons today seem to have larger RCS values then the aircraft carrying them.

that was the main reasoning why stealth effectiveness is diminishing with time..... it is easier to upgrade radar capabiliteis that stealthy capabilities. Many here stated that F-22 are stealthier than F-117....... but for clear reason nobody have any data on how much and what is its actual RSC. From what I understand F-117 LOW VISIBILITY ADVANTAGE will not be sustainable in 3-5 years. The upgrades for landbased radars which can see it perfectly exist are fielded in small quatities and were tested from sea against F-117. Now the work is on upgrade of onboard radar....... it is possible and will be done.

ps. F-22 still has other unmatched advantages though....

Garry dont forget that the US has barely even scratched the surface of "Active stealth" systems, so i would not expect stealth to become 'inneffective' any time soon.

I would also remind everyone that however good the RCS of the F-117, B-2 and F-22 may be, that when you support them with EA-6B jamming support they might as well be ghosts. Fell the APG-77 has so much raw jamming power it doesnt even need any Prowler support.

I would also state that US SEAD/ECM technology and systems are improving at a very fast pace as well.

BTW, ive actually seen it stated by people who are probably in a position to know what theyre talking about state that the F22 is the stealthiest jet ever fielded.

Originally Posted by M21Sniper

Garry dont forget that the US has barely even scratched the surface of "Active stealth" systems, so i would not expect stealth to become 'inneffective' any time soon.

I would also remind everyone that however good the RCS of the F-117, B-2 and F-22 may be, that when you support them with EA-6B jamming support they might as well be ghosts. Fell the APG-77 has so much raw jamming power it doesnt even need any Prowler support.

I would also state that US SEAD/ECM technology and systems are improving at a very fast pace as well.

BTW, ive actually seen it stated by people who are probably in a position to know what theyre talking about state that the F22 is the stealthiest jet ever fielded.

I agree. From what I heard when discussed this issue in November 2005 with a friend from Sukhoi Design Bureau - RADAR IS CENTRAL POINT FOR 5TH GEN. It even may become a major SHORT-MID RANGE WEAPON. The radar was tested as an weapon and it turned that a focused high power beam may completelly and unrepairably disable unshielded electronic curcuits of a 4th Generation aircraft at range of 5km. The testing was done on ground in 2003 by Tishin Institute with a modification of Zaslon-M radar........ They also made analysis of the damage and potential protection measures. The conlcusion - comlete shielding of all circuits would add 20-30% of wight to 4th generation aircraft.......

However another conclusion made - The power of such focused beam dimishies significantly with distance and that current technology for focusing and managing of beam can not make radar as an effective weapon beyond 10km.

Originally Posted by The_Burning_Kid

Well here's the place I got it from:



This guy is pretty respected and I know him. He's knows a lot about aerospace technology and the field and I think he might have a degree in that, but I"m not sure.

could be, but a lot of the radar numbers are really classified. I'm pretty sure he just took those Chinese fighter radar numbers of sinodefense.com and they are not all correct.

I believe N-011M's range of 160KM is vs 5m^2 targets. The Russians tend to list their tracking range against 5m^2 targets.

KS-172 is not in service. Just like other Russian projects, hyped, but underfunded, meaning that they normally never come out on schedule.

This needs to take the variants into account, since there is a big difference between the F-15A and the F-15K, just as there is between the Su-27 and the Su-35, if you count them as the same aircraft or not. Both have been adapted considerably to employ new technologies and to fill new roles like the Sea Flanker, Strike Eagle and Super Flanker.
In general, the Eagle benefits from superior American avionics to give it the edge in BVR, which is probably a greater advantage than the superior maneuverability of the Flanker.

I hardly doubt this. New flankers like Su-35 equipped with RLSU-27 radar systems composed of the forward-looking N011 slotted-antenna radar and the small N012 rear-looking radar located in the central tailboom offer extended target acquisition range, air-to-surface stand-off attack capability, simultaneous tracking of more targets, surveillance and tracking of targets in the rear hemisphere and improved counter ECM. They're also capable of terrain-mapping, enabling nap-of-the-eartch (NOE) and obstacle avoidance. The N011M is an even greater advancement of this.

Originally Posted by Captain Drunk

I hardly doubt this. New flankers like Su-35 equipped with RLSU-27 radar systems composed of the forward-looking N011 slotted-antenna radar and the small N012 rear-looking radar located in the central tailboom offer extended target acquisition range, air-to-surface stand-off attack capability, simultaneous tracking of more targets, surveillance and tracking of targets in the rear hemisphere and improved counter ECM. They're also capable of terrain-mapping, enabling nap-of-the-eartch (NOE) and obstacle avoidance. The N011M is an even greater advancement of this.

Call me when they have 500+ of them. An awesome one-of-a-kind airshow plane means nothing...remember tail 711? Anyway, the 35 has a good radar, probably better than the average APG-63 (I think the new upgrade is probably still better).

When did the F100 PW-220 came into service? How is it when compared with contemporary Su-27s?