What does PAK FA T 50 mean for India?

**cdude** · 19 Mar 10, 19:24

Originally Posted by calass

There is no major country in the world other than India which shares the same Russian world view in most matters..

Like milking the last rupee out of India's hand on every project?

**kuku** · 19 Mar 10, 19:36

Originally Posted by Andrey Egorov

kuku, thanks. I understand India's position and I'm fully agree with it.

All this talk of F-35s and what not, a plane has to serve for a long time and the acquisition cost has to be minimal, even if it costs more in maintaining the plane, there is much more things that the limited money has to be utilised for.

There are articles about the western planes being less expensive in life time costs, more advanced and more effective through better availability (true dream machines), even then the initial cost of acquisition in large numbers is difficult to balance in a poor nations budget.

At the same time with the generation gap in technology(or propaganda) can not be ignored, i think there could be good money for this program, perhaps giving back the costs if proper checks are maintained (unlike previous programs like the many PRC made Mig-21s), even a light fighter based on this program sounds like a good investment, although the funds to do so might be difficult to find.

**calass** · 20 Mar 10, 02:36

Originally Posted by cdude

Like milking the last rupee out of India's hand on every project?

They give India stuff no country in the world will...of course they do not do it with the goodness of their heart and it cost a lot of money but they do know that their knowhow or derived items from that knowhow will never be used against them...

**cdude** · 20 Mar 10, 16:58

Originally Posted by calass

They give India stuff no country in the world will...of course they do not do it with the goodness of their heart and it cost a lot of money but they do know that their knowhow or derived items from that knowhow will never be used against them...

I agree. You can say the same to China/Pakistan or US/Pakistan relationship. But they hardly share any world view as all. I was questioning the previous posters view that Russia and India share the same world view.

**calass** · 20 Mar 10, 17:14

Originally Posted by cdude

I agree. You can say the same to China/Pakistan or US/Pakistan relationship. But they hardly share any world view as all. I was questioning the previous posters view that Russia and India share the same world view.

Well there is a difference as Pakistan can be considered a client country of both China and US...India cannot be called a client country of Russia anymore...a client country gets help on soft loans or as aid. Certainly Russia has not provided soft loans or aid to India in decades.As you have noted,they charge an arm and a leg nowdays.Friendship rates of the SU era are long gone.

And they pretty much share the same world view...tell me one major policy difference they have had in the last few years.Even when the world criticized Russia about Georgia,India kept her mouth pretty much shut.

I was replying to the Russian poster about some in Russia having reservations in transferring sensitive technology to another country with geo-political ambitions.There is no country more harmless to Russia than India..in the near and foreseeable future.

**Tronic** · 20 Mar 10, 18:15

Indian FGFA (PAK Fa) will be different, and it will be a further development of the current one. I don't know about "smaller and cheaper" (India is paying 50% of the entire development cost of this bird), India and Russia disagreed on the type of aircraft they both wanted. Russia wanted a single seater air superiority fighter, where India wanted a double seater aircraft with an air-to-ground as a primary role. So the Indian bird will most likely be a further development of this one, and rather than being smaller, it may just be slightly bigger than this one.

**Skywatcher** · 20 Mar 10, 22:40

It probably won't be opitimized for low observability, if those rumors are true. On the other hand, I thought the MCA was supposed to serve in a strike role?

**~~stealthh~~** · 25 Mar 10, 04:53

Originally Posted by Skywatcher

I've heard a newspaper report cite an unnamed Indian AF or MoD source saying that the Indian PAK-FA would have a RCS of 0.5m2, which frankly sounds ridiculous. If that's true, India might as well just buy the SU-35BM.

As far as I know, Russia was able to take an old Mig21, add some work on it to reduce its RCS down to 0.25m2. Maybe Russian members in here can clarify about this more clearly than anyone else

The only reliable source that I've heard about the RCS of PAK-FA is from some Russian working in the PAK-FA project. He mention that the goal is to have PAK-FA's rcs as small as a beak of a swallow; I don't know how big a beak is in term of m2

**raviku4213** · 30 Mar 10, 14:40

I dont think this craft is going to be ready as per its plan.. keeping the several hiccups that usaually come along the completion of a fully functional AC. Secondly i have not heard any development currently being progressed in India though the word is out. HAL insisted on having the development front to be done here as well (propabably some percentage of the work), however there is no news that i have come across the same like issues, completion, testing etc...

could anybody provide some insight..

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