Helicopters: Cost of ownership

**adroth** · 04 Dec 07,, 01:29

We've had a lot of discussions about the next generation helicopter for the Philippine Air Force on Timawa.net; most of which focused on the purchase price of helicopters. However, there was very little discussion about how much it would actually cost to operate the various helicopter types.

To spice up our discussions, I put together the following figures from the indicated sources. The discussion can be found here: Helicopters: Cost of ownership

Can anyone here provide additional information about other choppers that are out there?

Light helicopters

UH-1H: $835 per flight hour [1]

Huey II: $535 per flight hour [2]

S-76: $1,178 per flight hour (based on 2003 exchange rate of 7.7 $HK / USD) [6]

EC 155 Dauphin: $1,157 per flight hour (based on 2003 exchange rate of 7.7 $HK / USD) [7]

HH-65 Dolphin: $5,173 per flight hour (US Coast Guard version) [7]

Medium-lift helicopters

UH-60 Blackhawk: $2,199 per flight hour [3]

Mi-17: $2,850 per flight hour [4] (based on Croatian currency)

AS 332 Super Puma: $1,883 per flight hour (based on 2003 exchange rate of 7.7 $HK / USD) [8]

CH-47D Chinook: $2,403 - $2,723 per flight hour [11]

Heavy-lift helicopters

CH-53E Super Stallion: $20,000 per flight hour [5]

Attack helicopters

AH-64 Apache: $3,851 per flight hour [9]

AH-1S Cobra: $1,569 - $1,757 per flight hour [10]

**omon** · 04 Dec 07,, 02:45

buy a gyroplaine, it is much cheaper.

**Indirect Fire** · 04 Dec 07,, 02:53

Argggggg.... No Mi 24 Hind?

**adroth** · 04 Dec 07,, 06:09

Originally Posted by Indirect Fire

Argggggg.... No Mi 24 Hind?

'fraid not.

I couldn't find any cost references for the type. I was hoping there were already folks here who have done similar studies.

At any rate, these figures are really just ballpark figures. Costs will vary by individual aircraft, and will be affected by the labor costs of the operator.

When we published these on our forum, it did wonders in improving the overall quality of discussion with regard to PhAF chopper purchase suggestions.

**JA Boomer** · 04 Dec 07,, 06:19

Can anyone explain why cost of the Super Stallion is 734% the cost of the Chinook? I mean common, they are both at the top end of the scale...they should not be such a discrepancy.

**Jimmy** · 04 Dec 07,, 06:47

I'd imagine some of it is due to maritime use. Corrosion, weather, etc. I doubt that's ALL of it, but I could easily see that doubling the cost.

**omon** · 04 Dec 07,, 07:11

could be 2vs3 turbines, but still 700+%????

**adroth** · 04 Dec 07,, 17:32

Originally Posted by omon

could be 2vs3 turbines, but still 700+%????

Janes compiled the figures for the Stallion, and reportedly used the total annual cost of maintaining the type and dividing it by the total number of availability hours.

CH-53K: The U.S. Marines' HLR Helicopter Program (updated) (defense procurement, military acquisition, defence purchasing)

(The italicized numbers beside the figures are links to the source articles)

I once spoke to a Filipino serving in the USN who worked on this type, and he mentioned that this bird required interesting maintenance procedures. Some of the materials in the maintenance kits even required refrigeration -- precisely controlled at that. They reportedly got dinged in an inspection because they used a commercial ref that didn't have temp read-outs (the "proper" one they had conked out, and they just grabbed one from surplus). These were supposedly for the composite components.

This bird is tough, but making sure that it can take the punishment and works the way it should, requires a lot of TLC.

Do navy aircraft mechanics get paid more than their Army equivalents? That might have been factored into the total cost that Janes used.

**JAD_333** · 04 Dec 07,, 18:39

Originally Posted by adroth

Do navy aircraft mechanics get paid more than their Army equivalents? That might have been factored into the total cost that Janes used.

Doubtful, as the paygrades are the same across the board for all military branches. I don't know about civilians working for privately-owned service contractors. Government employed civilians service personnel are paid according to their civil service grade and efficiency level.

**Jimmy** · 04 Dec 07,, 23:37

Base pay will be the same, but various bonuses and incentives (sea pay, hostile fire pay, etc) will wreak havoc upon the numbers.

One thing I just realized...we fly helicopters (the Super Stallion) that cost more per hour than the 30 year old E-3.

**adroth** · 04 Dec 07,, 23:47

Originally Posted by Jimmy

One thing I just realized...we fly helicopters (the Super Stallion) that cost more per hour than the 30 year old E-3.

As air force guys on our forum, as well as one of our non-Filipino regulars who happens to work on aircraft parts industry, would say . . . helicopters are a whole lot more expensive to operate than fixed wing aircraft.

**Jimmy** · 05 Dec 07,, 05:31

Well, this is a $300M, 30 year old airframe with a big F-ing radar, 4 gas-guzzling/ozone-killing engines and 30 people on board.

And if your numbers are accurate, most helos are considerably cheaper than most fixed-wing (military, anyway).

**JA Boomer** · 05 Dec 07,, 06:04

Originally Posted by Jimmy

One thing I just realized...we fly helicopters (the Super Stallion) that cost more per hour than the 30 year old E-3.

Ya...bigger airframe, maritime operations, 3 engines all these things will no doubt bring up operating costs...but I am still skeptical about that listed cost for the Super Stallion.

**adroth** · 05 Dec 07,, 15:54

Originally Posted by Jimmy

And if your numbers are accurate, most helos are considerably cheaper than most fixed-wing (military, anyway).

Well . . . I'd take those with a grain of salt. After all, each bird is different. Labor costs and exchange rates also affect things.

We put that bit together at a time when kids were flooding our forum with all sorts of aircraft purchase suggestions for the PAF. We needed those figures to keep things real -- and they worked.

Was hoping to fine tune them here.

Like the reference link to the Stallion figure says, it comes from Janes. Whether or not the article misquoted Janes, is another matter altogether. The search for facts and figures continues.

**BD1** · 05 Dec 07,, 16:42

Adroth this is one interesting forum , noticed that you mentioned there something about similar thread about fighter´s cost of ownership . Could you give a link ?