highsea

So how do the range controllers keep track of the Raptors during the exercise, and how do they integrate data from the Raptor into the debriefings? Are they debriefed separately from the other participants?

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TheBigThug

Ok I see what you are coming too. Specific Data is datalinked as it is a Net Centric Fighter, Certain Blocks of aircraft types allready utilise it, but not in all squadrons as with all things it is a funding and schedule issue, The ACMI tracker system is slowly phasing out, But is still the predominent system still in use. It is a legacy sytem that has been continually evolved.

The question of briefings is abit broad? I'll simplify it. Each Red Flag has a specific focus, each year that Focus changes. Sometimes we have Nato participents, Sometimes we do not. All of this is planned years in advance and sometimes, aircraft such as the F22 reach a specific milistone in its development or operation and it is added to the mix. Many things govern this, new technology and systems in operation, Ops tempo, Etc. etc etc.

Each system is evaluated at differnt levels or Tiers. These help the force planers evaluate or Strategies, Equipment and personel.

Was the F22 Evaluated as an integral peice of the Exercise.."Yes", Was it evaluated seperately.. "Yes" And Much bigger things are still being discussed and evaluated. I have yet to see the specific findings. It is above me.

The key point of any exercise is whether the sytems that participated in that battle plan, Could conduct the same mission sucessfully in a War.

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highsea

Thanks BigThug-

I am aware how Raptor handles data, I just wasn't sure the range was equipped to communicate on the Raptor's terms. Obviously they can track position via transponders, but I was curious how the engagement data were fed back to the ACMI shack- i.e. are they equipped to recieve EOB data from Raptor.

(Obviously they are, since that's where most of the Raptor's testing was done- doh!)

Wrt the debriefings, I was referring to the individual post-flight debriefings- practices such as using the ACMI data to show blue air what red air was seeing.

Anyway, that's what I was driving at- I was just curious if the F-22A was fitted with ACMI to simplify logistics, since this was Raptor's first Flag.

Jimmy

I would expect the Nellis range to be equipped with pretty much everything needed to communicate/track everything the USAF has.

highsea

Normal ATC can track and communicate with everythig the USAF has, via Mode C transponders and radios. I was more interested in the logistics during the exercise, specifically post-flight debriefings.

Every other AC in Red Flag (possibly excepting F117, B2, E3) is carrying ACMI equipment.

I was curious if Raptor was also, from a coordination perspective wrt the ACMI shack and the F-15's et al that the Raptor is working combined flight ops with.

TheBigThug

Ok- The logistics issue would be the same as any other "Expeditionary deployment" When a unit deploys it takes all it's hardware as it would to support itself in the function of its mission. This would include Command and control systems, Support Systems, and Combat Systems.

The "Range" comment is too non specific to identify anything.

Traditionally Red and Green flag are held In the the desert south west. The tip of that Tier is typically the command element that resides at Nellis AFB. This is predominately were the public recieve their information on the Public affairs side of the exercise. This is the side the media reports on. However the operating envelope of Red Flag Can and does consume the vast area of the Desert Southwest. Units deploy and operate out of nearly 15 Bases in the area. It is the only way to stage and expeditionary force. Ofton times units are actually flying from as far as 800nm away to participate in an exercise for their sortie generation (as it would exist in a real conflict)

Various systems are integrated together to form the synergy of the exercise. Not all systems can cross share their information, therefore this data is collected and relayed through various forms to a central area for the Top tier planners to observe (typically General Staff Commanders, Defense Contractors etc) So through the years their has been some development in aiding the people that define and guide our Defense policy decisions and support. Essentially the facility is nothing more than a media presentation and observation platform.

Now in saying this, THE ACMI capability is fairly limited to a couple Specific areas of UTTR, GOLDWATER and NEllis Ranges. The rest of that Capibility is in the use of GCI (Ground Control Intercept) ACI (Air COntrol Intercept) With these elements a Team structure of Referees and planners observe each element and make decisions. ( this often were the mulligans are created) Ofton times those commanders that are observing the battle and what phase of events are taking place will request a "dead asset" to regenerate and prosecute a plan against an event they saw. It allows the observers to dynamically test an expeditionary warplan outside the scope of the scheduled events.

The point I am making here is that "acmi pods" are such a small peice of the overal puzzle and is not a system you would use in warfare. It is nothing more than benefiting the "media Room" and yet has no true bearing on the Warfighting command and control system other than being what it is. "A presentation tool"

The True method of the warfighting capability is in the Datalinked warfighting systems that tie the Command and control to the Systems in the Battle. the Media Room is being continually updated with this data. so that it too can be evaluated and allow the contractors to see how their products and programs are working in a dynamic battlefield.

highsea

Thanks BigThug-

It has always been my understanding that the ACMI data (when available) was used in debriefings and evaluations- both real-time and post-flight. I know it's not part of the combat equipment. I also realize there are other factors in play, and that decisions are not based solely on one set of data.

I just built'em, I don't fly'em, so I apologize if I was asking a question that seems stupid to you. I have interest the Raptor's evolution, since I had some involvement in the first wingsets.

Jimmy

That's what I've seen it used for. An ACMI debrief was a rare experience for us, but it was something everybody wanted (as long as it wasnt supposed to start at 6pm).