Marines killed Iraqis ‘in cold blood’

**Tronic** · 18 May 06,, 04:01

Lawmaker: Marines killed Iraqis ‘in cold blood’
Navy conducting war crimes probe into November violence in Haditha
By Jim Miklaszewski
and Mike Viqueira
NBC News
Updated: 9:27 p.m. ET May 17, 2006
WASHINGTON - A Pentagon probe into the death of Iraqi civilians last November in the Iraqi city of Haditha will show that U.S. Marines "killed innocent civilians in cold blood," a U.S. lawmaker said Wednesday.

From the beginning, Iraqis in the town of Haditha said U.S. Marines deliberately killed 15 unarmed Iraqi civilians, including seven women and three children.

One young Iraqi girl said the Marines killed six members of her family, including her parents. “The Americans came into the room where my father was praying,” she said, “and shot him.”
On Wednesday, Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., said the accounts are true.

Military officials told NBC News that the Marine Corps' own evidence appears to show Murtha is right.

A videotape taken by an Iraqi showed the aftermath of the alleged attack: a blood-smeared bedroom floor and bits of what appear to be human flesh and bullet holes on the walls.

The video, obtained by Time magazine, was broadcast a day after town residents told The Associated Press that American troops entered homes on Nov. 19 and shot dead 15 members of two families, including a 3-year-old girl, after a roadside bomb killed a U.S. Marine.

On Nov. 20, U.S. Marines spokesman Capt. Jeffrey Pool issued a statement saying that on the previous day a roadside bomb had killed 15 civilians and a Marine. In a later gunbattle, U.S. and Iraqi troops killed eight insurgents, he said.

U.S. military officials later confirmed that the version of events was wrong.

Murtha, a vocal opponent of the war in Iraq, said at a news conference Wednesday that sources within the military have told him that an internal investigation will show that "there was no firefight, there was no IED (improvised explosive device) that killed these innocent people. Our troops overreacted because of the pressure on them, and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood."

Military officials say Marine Corp photos taken immediately after the incident show many of the victims were shot at close range, in the head and chest, execution-style. One photo shows a mother and young child bent over on the floor as if in prayer, shot dead, said the officials, who spoke to NBC News on condition of anonymity because the investigation hasn't been completed.

One military official says it appears the civilians were deliberately killed by the Marines, who were outraged at the death of their fellow Marine.

“This one is ugly," one official told NBC News.

Three Marine officers — commanders in Haditha — have been relieved of duty, and at least 12 Marines in all are under investigation for what would be the worst single incident involving the deliberate killing of civilians by U.S. military in Iraq.

The Marine Corps issued a statement in response to Murtha's remarks:

"There is an ongoing investigation; therefore, any comment at this time would be inappropriate and could undermine the investigatory and possible legal process. As soon as the facts are known and decisions on future actions are made, we will make that information available to the public to the fullest extent allowable."

Murtha held the news conference to mark six months since his initial call for "redeployment" of U.S. forces from Iraq.

He said U.S. forces were under undue pressure in Iraq because of poor planning and allocation of resources by the Bush administration.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12838343/

**Confed999** · 18 May 06,, 06:44

Nice of Murtha to convict them without an investigation, charges, or a trial.

**Tronic** · 19 May 06,, 00:27

true... the investigations are still going on... just have to wait for the results...

**Bill** · 19 May 06,, 01:41

He's probably already seen the testimony.

And it appears as if they probably did it.

**Confed999** · 19 May 06,, 03:30

Originally Posted by M21Sniper

He's probably already seen the testimony.

And it appears as if they probably did it.

Did it, or didn't, it is not his place to say, and it is definately not his place to use it for further politicization.

**Bill** · 19 May 06,, 04:22

Originally Posted by Confed999

Did it, or didn't, it is not his place to say, and it is definately not his place to use it for further politicization.

I agree with that for sure.

**astralis** · 19 May 06,, 05:38

confed,

Did it, or didn't, it is not his place to say, and it is definately not his place to use it for further politicization.

whose place is it, then?

**Confed999** · 19 May 06,, 06:06

Originally Posted by astralis

confed,

whose place is it, then?

The Marine Corps issued a statement in response to Murtha's remarks:

"There is an ongoing investigation; therefore, any comment at this time would be inappropriate and could undermine the investigatory and possible legal process. As soon as the facts are known and decisions on future actions are made, we will make that information available to the public to the fullest extent allowable."

Politicians have no place in the enforcement of laws, declaring charges, or judging at the trials, of the common citizen or soldier of the United States. Murtha is playing politics, and being an *** hole, nothing more.

**astralis** · 19 May 06,, 09:41

but the man's not judging anything (legally). his words don't mean the marines in question will necessarily be convicted, or freed.

so a politician runs his mouth off...what's new?

at least, as m21 pointed out, murtha is most likely correct in what he said.

**Tronic** · 19 May 06,, 12:52

but he's not the one responsible for breaking such news to the public... You think he cares about the Iraqis or the Marines??? No, all he cares about are the votes...

**Shek** · 19 May 06,, 13:17

Originally Posted by astralis

but the man's not judging anything (legally). his words don't mean the marines in question will necessarily be convicted, or freed.

so a politician runs his mouth off...what's new?

at least, as m21 pointed out, murtha is most likely correct in what he said.

When he states that the Haditha incident is the My Lai of Iraq, then he's judging and comparing. Let's not forget how the Sites video sparked a bunch of nothing over the insurgent that was killed in the mosque in Fallujah. My gut feeling on this one is that the Marines most likely committed misconduct. To what extent, we'll see, but all the facts just aren't out. However, Murtha goes much further than that and describes it as an execution. We'll just have to wait and see, but Murtha is stuck in Vietnam IMO, and a liability.

CHRIS MATTHEWS, HOST: Let me ask you Mr. Murtha to give us some details about that. Draw us a picture of what happened at Haditha.

REP. JOHN “JACK” MURTHA: Well, I’ll tell you exactly what happened. One Marine was killed and the Marines just said we’re going to take care – we don’t know who the enemy is, the pressure was too much on them, so they went into houses and they actually killed civilians. And, and –

MATTHEWS:—was this My Lai? Was this a case of – when you say cold blood Congressman, a lot of people think you’re basically saying you got some civilians sitting in a room around a field and they’re executed.

MURTHA: That’s exactly it.

**InfiniteDreams** · 03 Jun 06,, 10:11

“Congressmen who willfully take actions during wartime that damage morale and undermine the military are saboteurs and should be arrested, exiled or hanged.”
Abraham Lincoln

**reeson** · 03 Jun 06,, 15:22

My letter ran in today's Washington Times. See below:

Our Values Will Prevail

Reports concerning the alleged massacre of Iraqi civilians at the hands of U.S. Marines have created quite a firestorm in the media, and in the United States Congress as well. Most of the headlines that I have read have convicted the Marine unit in question while official investigations are still not complete.

Many people have the initial inclination to be skeptical of the U.S. military’s ability to police itself, but I am not one of them. As a member of the U.S. military, I believe that the investigation will be conducted fairly and completely, and that those guilty of crimes will be punished while those who are innocent will be exonerated. I believe this because all members of our armed forces live their lives as professionals, committed to specific core values and ethical standards that guide us to do what is right, both legally and morally.

Of course, there are incidents of atrocities in virtually every conflict involving American military forces. But these are isolated incidents and are not representative of the quality of character found in the vast majority of uniformed personnel. While we may find out that the allegations of murder and cover-up are substantiated, we have to have faith in the magnificent men and women of our armed forces who will ensure that ultimately we will do what is right. We have to have faith that our values will prevail.

In the Army, we use the acronym LDRSHIP for our core values: Loyalty, Duty, Respect, Selfless Service, Honor, Integrity, and Personal Courage. These values influence every action we take, both in peace and in war. Violations of these values are not acceptable and thus not tolerated. The Marines have a similar set of core values: Honor, Courage and Commitment. A quick scan of the website www.usmcpress.com provides insightful details on these values and reinforces the high standard the American people expect.

The first Marine value, Honor, “…requires each Marine to exemplify the ultimate standard in ethical and moral conduct.” Further, “Each Marine must cling to an uncompromising code of personal integrity, accountable for his actions and holding others accountable for theirs.” For Courage, the website states “Courage is moral strength, the will to heed the inner voice of conscience, the will to do what is right regardless of the conduct of others.” These values define the character of each individual Marine, even if some may have failed to follow them.

In some cases, our military justice system may have been slow to respond. But it does ultimately respond. From the conviction of Lieutenant Calley for the My Lai massacre, to the convictions resulting from the Abu Ghraib scandal and the conviction of an Army sergeant for the rape and murder of a child in Kosovo, and from the exoneration of Lieutenant Pantano for the murder of two Iraqis to the support of the Marine corporal who shot a wounded insurgent in a mosque in Fallujah, there has been justice.

In this case, as well, there will be justice. There will be justice because those of us who serve, almost without exception, believe that the people and the nation we protect are more important than any one of us individually, and more important than any group of us collectively. We have dedicated ourselves to protect and serve this nation and its people, often at the cost of our lives. We will continue to do so and will only tolerate those among us who are willing to live by our values.

CPT Greg Reeson
United States Army
Fort Lee, Virginia

**~~Hari_Om~~** · 03 Jun 06,, 19:28

As an Indian, I would truly like to be understanding.

But I am given no choice when I have to read the drivel about the excessive use of force by the Indian Armed forces dished out by the US State Department practically every year.

Reciprocity does rule.

Would not using Airpower by way of an AC 130 on a building to suppress terrorists in Birmingham, Alabama be excessive use of force?

So why is it alright in Ishaqi, Baghdad ?

How many instances in a counter insurgency war in Jammu & Kashmir have you come across the Indian Armed Forces using indiscriminate weapons ie : either Air Power or for that matter Artillery to meet a counter insurgency objective?

If none, why the drivel from the State Department’s annual report.

Perhaps the difference is that one is an occupation Army the other is not, so one can afford to be blasé about civilian deaths. To be entirely specific the Indian Army does nor operate as an Army of occupation.

People who throw stones should not live in glass houses.

I am OK with people who do not throw stones.

So can I hear from the American’s here why their State department is wrong as ……………?

**Confed999** · 04 Jun 06,, 01:46