amiosman

Hi All!

I've wanting to ask - Is there really a need to maintain a modern army nowadays? This is the context of the south east asian region.

I'm a bumiputra Malaysian (read Malay) & we hv pretty good relations with our neighbours Indonesia, Thailand, Singapore & Brunei. At least I think we do. Indeed there are tensions but not to the point of going to war.

I understand detterence but really why start a mini arms race. Match Singapore's air force, at par with Indonesian navy & the likes. When will it end.

Malaysia just acquired 18 Sukhoi 30MK for USD900 mill. Truthfully, how long will 18 planes last in a full blown war. The money can be better utilised to buy new choppers for SAR & transport to replace the Sikorsky S68 (more than 25 yrs old mind u). Submarines? Who are we going to sneak up on?

The trend is now a lot of small wars instead of the occasional big wars like WW2. Why not concentrate on fighting terrorism? If no worth while targets can be found at home then help our neighbours put crosshairs on theirs. I'm a muslim & to me religion has nothing to do with terrorism. Its politics pure & simple. No religion on earth advocates killing people.

In my opinion our armed forces should go the way of educated personel. Go for quality not quantity.

My 2 cents

HistoricalDavid

No religion advocates killing people? Les lols?

Anyway you say the trend is towards small wars. Look at this. In 1978, Britain was friendly enough with Argentina to sell them Type 42 destroyers, which at the time were pretty advanced. In 1982, the two countries were at war.

The international situation changed in a mere 4 years from considerable friendship to armed conflict. That is the most glaring example that comes to mind but if you want more, just ask. Do you think terrorism is the only threat anyone will ever face? If so, change your whole military to mechanised infantry backed up by a few strike aircraft - no A2A capability - and no naval firepower except that needed for light amphibious assaults, and make the whole thing optimised for MOUT and COIN. You can't, can you.

Buying Flankers in small quantities is better than you think because a) it's not like Indonesia has loads, b) Good for regular airspace duties and c) If a full-blown war does loom then it's easier to acquire 100 Flankers up from 18 than 100 up from nothing.

Buying submarines is useful because there's no better way to secure the seas.

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HD Ready?

wabpilot

Amiosman has a good question, why would a peaceful nation with relatively good relationships with its neighbors need modern weaponry? The answer is the oft quoted Roman adage: si vis pacem, para bellum. In English, if you seek peace, prepare for war.

ChrisF202

One should always be prepared for war ... besides the military does alot more then fight wars; they provide aid after natural disasters, and in some nations they patrol borders and assist the civilian police forces, etc.

Firral

I wished to tell approximately too.
In world politics important not application of military force, but also threat. Nobody will threaten you and to impose the will while you are with it in parity. But if you are weak, to you can threaten and impose the requirements.
Age of that statement that has told wabpilot - some thousand years. But in our world actually a little that has changed...

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Feanor

18 MKs? That would mean a larger, and more potent, airforce then indonesia. Huh. Somehow I always thought Malaysia was weaker.

gunnut

Or in the words of Burt Gummer, hero of Tremors 1, 2, 3, and 4:

"If you need it and don't have it, you'll sing a different tune."

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"Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

Officer of Engineers

Look north, there's a dragon. Look west, there's an elephant.

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Chimo

physicsmonk

Sir,
Elephant lacks political will for military adventures despite having a good military.We are good when it comes to defending(like kargil) but we lack the aggression to meet our strategic or political objectives,which is quite unlike china.

Firral

Russian tsar, Peter the Great has told: " Russia has only two true allies: its army and fleet ".
It I about that what at you would not be good the attitude with neighbours and allies, really to hope it is possible only on own opportunities.

amiosman

Sorry if I sound naive but is 'dragon' China & 'elephant' India?

Officer of Engineers

When you're a mouse sleeping beside an elephant, no matter how good intentioned nor how benign the elephant, the mouse ain't going to get much sleep.

Yes

WhamBam

True, but he can't do anything much except hope for the elephant to continue to be benign.

Frankly I don't see India coming into Malaysian security calculations. Or I am missing something?

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There are 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don’t..

Officer of Engineers

Same as the Canadian security calculations vis-a-vi the US. Do your job securing your own borders or India will do it for you ... and not to your liking. This is what happened to the US-Canadian border after 11 Sept. $1bil in daily trade was reduced to a trickle until sufficient security measures were bought up to par on both sides of the border.

amiosman

That's my point - do we need it.

I'm not saying do away with the military. I wouldn't be living on earth if I said that. What im asking is Malaysia acquiring the right equipment. It seems to me we are upgrading in small steps in all services. Isn't that like being a jack of all trades, master at none?

Im thinking in the line of a wall of air defense systems & highly effective anti ship weapons. Wouldn't it be better to hv more units with defensive combat effectiveness than just a few with offensive capability which probably be matched by the other side anyway. Lets hv bigger shields rather than sharper spears. We are for peace are we not?

I just want to sleep sounder knowing my goverment is spending in the right direction.