-{SpoonmaN}-

Makes sense. If I were given the choice I'd go for the Army as well I think.

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"I have this to say to the people of Australia: Kick me, I'm different."

Wraith601

Don't get me wrong the Marines are great if thats what you wanna do. One thing they have as a plus is that their recruiting emphasies that they want people want to be Marines, the Army recruiters I've met with tend to stress the benefits more than anything else.

__________________
"We always have been, we are, and I hope that we always shall be, detested in France."
-Sir Arthur Wellesley

SnowLeopard

Mmmmmmm, that last part is what I've told people in my one jump. The plane worked but it was hardly perfectly good.

Though, you know, for me, jumping out of an airplane has only a portion of the andrenaline rush that rappealing does!

As far as benefits and action go, that's probably not only a difference in services but also in age. Ie, I got into the Navy, 20+ years ago, not because of the scholarship though it was a way in, but because I wanted to be on ships.

But................these days, when I go to job fairs and look at various police departments, one of my primary questions is what is the cost of living in their city. While the basic want of mission is all the same, police work, where one goes can depend on a more mature look at life.
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("If that chute don't open round, I'll be the first one on the ground!"--(wtte), running jody)

sappersgt

I remember the stall warning indicator going off and the guy behind me asking if I was nervous. "No, not really", I said. "I've got a parachute on and there's nobody between me and the door!".

-{SpoonmaN}-

Its the same deal with the entire Defence Force here, they tend to stress how good the pay, health benefits and educational opportunities are. It gives people the illusion that just because they're understaffed and working hard for recruits that they'll take anyone they can get, my idiot friends can't understand why I'm doing fitness training before I enlist in the Army Reserve, they seem to think the Army will lower their standards simply because I'm willing to join.
Personally I figure the recruiting problem could be adressed simply by increasing the pay, since it is a job that people deserve to make good money for, and in the Reserves in particular the pay is abismal (I'm not joining for that). The other idea being tabled frequently by the right is for a re-introduction of national service for both men and women when they finish high school (as a gap year between school and training, work aprenticeships and university etc.), but I wouldn't support that unless people had the option to do community service of some other kind (police, emergency work, aged care etc.). Maybe they could attract more people to the ADF by making that term shorter while the other kinds of service take longer. Still its academic the ADF is underfunded right now regardless.

sappersgt

You don't do it for the money. I just got back from Benehanas this evening where I was seated next to two Marine Sgts. They are married to each other and have an 18 month old son. He just came back from Iraq this week and she's shipping out the next. My bill came to about eighty bucks without a tip, pretty steep on Sergeants pay. Yeah, I remember being a Sargeant, so I told the waitress to add their bill to mine. They didn't find out till we left. I told them welcome home and enjoy the time they have together.

Wraith601

I'll actually be all right money wise as I'm single and have no children and my Bachelors Degree will automatically "promote" me to E-4, which is about a $400 a month pay raise plus I'm hoping for jump pay and I should a decent bonus but I'm not in it for the money, I'm pretty sure I can find a higher paying job elsewhere, but this is what I think I should be doing in life.

-{SpoonmaN}-

I'm 18 and I don't plan on having any kids so money's not really an issue for me these days, and I dont plan on having a Military career as such, I'll just ride out a 4 year term and then move on, hoping to go to university and move into federal law enforcement. Mainly doing the Reserves thing for discipline, fitness and maybe the opportunity to volunteer for a peacekeeping mission or something along those lines (if one ever comes up that requires whatever skills I'll possess). And I can assure you, in Australia the Military is pretty far from most people's minds, most of their large bases are located in remote areas far away from the cities (not a good idea in my opinion, I think they're planning to change this) and not many people seem to like the idea of service (they assume it automatically means you'll be sent to Iraq and die, even though we havent lost a soldier in combat there). Couple this with payrates that are pretty uncompetetive with civilian jobs (we're going rather well economically for now) and you have a largely poor opinion of the ADF as a career.

Maxor

To get back to the original topic...... there is no way on earth that the US military wants to transform most conflicts into guerilla type warefare it totally destroys the advantage of overwhelming firepower that the american military has. Sadly the other guy (country) needs to have his army stay around and fight which isn't particularly likely. Most of the countries which could plausably stand a chance or have the ability to inflict heavy casualties on the US military in a conventional armed conflict are either fairly staunch US allies, (NATO nations Austrailia and Israel) or are extremely interdependant on the US (russia, Ukraine{I think they may have joined nato I'd have to look it up} India, China). Special forces troops are not inexpensive and you can't really afford to disband or drastically reduce conventional forces as long as anyone else has some. Besides currently alot of US world power and prestiage is based on that advamtage destroyed by having low intensity conflicts all the time; their military power to anniliate any given nations military at most any time.

The only reason it is destroyed is because for some reason the US populace isn't into the whole idea kill everyone you can find and sow their fields with salt theory of warfare. I personally think this is a problem with the populace of the US projecting their personal desire for love and acceptance onto the country. It makes the US seem rather insecure to the rest of the world. That is fightening as well as the easy by which the US political system allows for fairly broad shifts in policy on an irregular basis which also tends to mystify the more glacial parts of the world when it comes to change.

-{SpoonmaN}-

Nope Ukraine isn't in NATO but most of the non-Soviet members of the former Pact are. I'm pretty sure Yeshenko wants to move the country into the EU and the NATO sphere but with all the trouble he's having at home I'm not so sure that'll happen. Its not such a big deal if Ukraine stays out of the EU and leans on Russia, since Russia wants greater integration with the EU on economic and humanitarian grounds anyway, so I'm sure their allies would follow.

SnowLeopard

It may have changed in 20 years, it may be that jump pay is different than hazardous duty pay BUT .......

.........I got hazardous duty pay for working the flight (helo) deck, was in charge of it for years. We only got that pay in a month when a helo actually touched down, NOT VERTREP, and then touched down so many times that month. It was something of bargaining and begging to see that all members of the flight deck crew got that money. It was also something like I would come off the bridge from a night watch, pick up my breakfest on a plate, and eat it on my way back to the flight deck for morning flight quarters.

The point is that back then, one didn't get the pay because they were qualified in something, one got the pay only if they did it that month and then, under certain conditions.

If you are depending on that pay, I'd check into it when you will get it.
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("How the shot man sees the receiving unrep ship."--Cartoon showing all the white inflatable vest (flightdeck) wearers (usually officers as safety observers) with score numbers., (w,stte), cartoon in the Navy Times)

Wraith601

E-4 base pay (plus the various allowances) are more than enough for me. I've lived as a collage student for 4 1/2 years, I know how to live on a budget.

Gun Grape

Don't count on those allowances either. Unless you are married and living off base the only allowance you rate is the yearly clothing allowance. Married will get you Rations(ComRats), except when deployed and off base will get you BAQ.

Other than that the Army feeds and houses you. For jump pay, you have to be in a jump status unit /billet and do, 1 jump a quarter. Thats from a couple of years back, but I don't think its changed.

Wraith601

I'm proably going for the 4th Brigade, 25th ID out of Fort Richardson, not many people trying to get posted in Alaska.

Like it's been said, you don't do it for the money.

Anon

WRT the US Army, Special Forces are mostly used and envisioned as both an unconventional training cadre as well as a field level liason force for communication and coordiation indigenous forces. Rangers are LRRP/Raider types, and Delta is our commando force.

PS: Aideed was not the target of the semi-disastrous(though still succesful) mogadishu raid. Several of his top deputies were. (5 of them IIRC, 4 of whom were succesfully captured).