M1A2 vs Challenger 2 (intelligent debate) - Page 6

Danowest · 02-07-2007, 20:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave angel

echo Dalem's comment.

both - when taken with their crews - are head and shoulders above anything they are ever likely to meet in anger.

Tanks are usually rated on firepower, mobility and protection.
The Chally main armament is very good with plenty of potential to fire future natures. It can also do bombardments because of it's rifled gun. Split ammo is safer but takes longer to load than the M1 one-piece. The M1 smoothbore defeats anything at present but would need a longer barrel to get faster projectiles. Infantry suppression is woeful on the Chally whereas the US have a total of three MGs and may be fitting a remote weapon system for the commander.
The M1 wins hands down on mobility; it has a very powerful and reliable gas turbine which drinks like a fish but just goes on and on. Compare that to the train engine in the Chally. Chally can go much further on a tank of fuel, and even further with it's extra fuel drums.
The bow of the M1 seems invulnerable while the sides are are weak. numerous M1A1 were lost to RPG attacks and i saw a SDG chally2 that took 8 direct RPG hits and a milan hit and still fought on. the only chally lost was due to a blue on blue incident from another chally2 (and that was a mess). Chally has a questionable bow-hence the ERA-but has fabulous add-on Dorchester on the sides. You are more likely to survive a turret strike in the Chally due to it's split ammo stowage and it's electric gun kit; ie no hydraulic fluid to explode.
Hope I haven't missed/misrepresented anything as it's been a while since I've been near a tank.

(Nearly forgot; Chally has a boiling vessel.

)

with thanks to ObnoviousJockGit and ArmySurplusSpecial for the technical gubbins....

within at least 5 years us brits would have incorperated electric armour onto the chally 2's, these have been tested with rpg rounds detonated on the armour with a crew inside and not even a scrath on the armour, would this factor tip the scales more toward the chally or what?

T_igger_cs_30 · 02-07-2007, 22:34 PM

Talk about being off thread

pdf27 · 02-08-2007, 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danowest

within at least 5 years us brits would have incorperated electric armour onto the chally 2's, these have been tested with rpg rounds detonated on the armour with a crew inside and not even a scrath on the armour, would this factor tip the scales more toward the chally or what?

Doubt it - this sort or thing is pretty much universally shared with the US so the M1 would have it too in the same timeframe. Probably sooner in fact as the US has a far bigger budget.

baz0927 · 02-21-2007, 06:07 AM

We the Brits did invent TOGS that we have on Chally2 and is the best night fighting gear in the world,not the fasted tank but with people like myself who was the best gunner in 1RTR in my time,we can destroy any enemy.

Weps · 02-21-2007, 12:03 PM

Why are we debating? We are allies if you people have forgotten. Aside from that unless youv'e crewed an M1A2, Chally2 and Leo 2 you can't say a damn thing about one or the other.

SO gentlemen please quit with the petty my tanks better than yours because BLOCK 3 TIS with 4th Gen FLIR is better than TOGS. I'd prefer to be an M1A2 fighting alongside a Challenger 2 with TOGS than fighting one, not because I fear it but because it's nice to have an ally with comparable gear and even compatible gear, and it just damn nice to have allies who speak English.

T_igger_cs_30 · 02-21-2007, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weps

.

Quote:

unless youv'e crewed an M1A2, Chally2 and Leo 2

you can't say a ..

I have , as I am sure others on here can say from there experience, nothing wrong with debate, experience does count but there are some very knowlegable contributors in this thread and indeed in this forum

Weps · 02-21-2007, 20:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T_igger_cs_30

I have , as I am sure others on here can say from there experience, nothing wrong with debate, experience does count but there are some very knowlegable contributors in this thread and indeed in this forum

I don't know if I caught your post right. You have actually crewed an M1A2, Challenger 2 and a Leopard 2? All three, you where a crew member of all three??

I myself understand your points. I myself, (not to boast) have extensive knowledge of the M1 Series tank. Aswell as older US armor platforms.

zraver · 02-21-2007, 21:44 PM

I am a DAT so if I feel like talking I will.

T_igger_cs_30 · 02-21-2007, 21:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weps

I don't know if I caught your post right. You have actually crewed an M1A2, Challenger 2 and a Leopard 2? All three, you where a crew member of all three??

I myself understand your points. I myself, (not to boast) have extensive knowledge of the M1 Series tank. Aswell as older US armor platforms.

I have experience of all 3 yes, not as a serving member of the armed forces anymore, but have driven and gunned all 3, but my opinion on this subject is all 3 have the own strengths, but at the end of the day Tanks of this calibre are as good as the "sunray and crew" as I stated in an earlier post.
My own experience of tanks as a crewman and commander is Centurion, Cheiftain and Challenger 1, oh and have crawled about Conqueror

zraver · 02-22-2007, 08:18 AM

Pattons and Abrams on my end

glyn · 02-22-2007, 09:58 AM

Have we any members who served on M-103s? I would like to hear their views on it. Might be worth starting a 'T-10, Conqueror & M-103 thread'.

zraver · 02-22-2007, 12:39 PM

I crawled around a M-103 at Ft Lewis's museum when I was a kid first tank I was ever on. But I've never crewed one

T_igger_cs_30 · 02-22-2007, 13:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glyn

Have we any members who served on M-103s? I would like to hear their views on it. Might be worth starting a 'T-10, Conqueror & M-103 thread'.

Glyn for starters ..............

Conqueror MK2 Mini Walk Around

Ex MIB · 02-22-2007, 13:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glyn

Have we any members who served on M-103s? I would like to hear their views on it. Might be worth starting a 'T-10, Conqueror & M-103 thread'.

Hmmm Glyn, "Centurion" and "Rank" spring to mind (or would that be "Tigger"

), and in your case Boudica's charriot driver is probably more apt...

dave lukins · 02-22-2007, 16:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ex MIB

Hmmm Glyn, "Centurion" and "Rank" spring to mind (or would that be "Tigger"

), and in your case Boudica's charriot driver is probably more apt...

John, even now Glyn drives his Merc with a guy walking in front waving a Flag!! the AA still salute him

02-07-2007, 22:34 PM	#77 (permalink)
T_igger_cs_30 *Military Professional* Join Date: 01-04-07 Location: Canada Posts: 1,943 Country:	Talk about being off thread __________________ $<img src=http://C:\Documents and Settings\Wayne Smith\My Documents\002...My Pictures border=0 alt= />$ FEAR NAUGHT I don't work here ...I am an analyst!

02-21-2007, 06:07 AM	#79 (permalink)
baz0927 Fish *Military Professional* Join Date: 02-19-07 Location: Wirral/UK Posts: 49 Country:	We the Brits did invent TOGS that we have on Chally2 and is the best night fighting gear in the world,not the fasted tank but with people like myself who was the best gunner in 1RTR in my time,we can destroy any enemy. __________________ Fear Naught.

02-21-2007, 12:03 PM	#80 (permalink)
Weps Regular Join Date: 09-14-05 Location: Radcliff Posts: 75 Country:	Why are we debating? We are allies if you people have forgotten. Aside from that unless youv'e crewed an M1A2, Chally2 and Leo 2 you can't say a damn thing about one or the other. SO gentlemen please quit with the petty my tanks better than yours because BLOCK 3 TIS with 4th Gen FLIR is better than TOGS. I'd prefer to be an M1A2 fighting alongside a Challenger 2 with TOGS than fighting one, not because I fear it but because it's nice to have an ally with comparable gear and even compatible gear, and it just damn nice to have allies who speak English. __________________

02-22-2007, 09:58 AM	#86 (permalink)
glyn *Military Professional* Join Date: 09-15-06 Location: Penzance, Cornwall UK Posts: 6,886	Have we any members who served on M-103s? I would like to hear their views on it. Might be worth starting a 'T-10, Conqueror & M-103 thread'. __________________ Semper in excretum. Solum profunda variat.

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02-21-2007, 21:44 PM	#83 (permalink)
zraver Contrary by nature. *Military Professional* Join Date: 10-22-06 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,163 Country:	I am a DAT so if I feel like talking I will.

02-22-2007, 08:18 AM	#85 (permalink)
zraver Contrary by nature. *Military Professional* Join Date: 10-22-06 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,163 Country:	Pattons and Abrams on my end

02-22-2007, 12:39 PM	#87 (permalink)
zraver Contrary by nature. *Military Professional* Join Date: 10-22-06 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,163 Country:	I crawled around a M-103 at Ft Lewis's museum when I was a kid first tank I was ever on. But I've never crewed one

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