23Likes
LinkBack URL
About LinkBacks
Reply With QuoteBF,
You sure you didn't use Ozi accent in your replies? You managed to piss both Armenian and a Turkish member over same topic.
Must be something about the beer
genocide is not just a word. it is a definition of certain act.Genocide is just a word.
Your offensive arguments against Turkey don't change the reality and they don't help.
If there is discrimination than there is hate crime. stupid, foolish etc don't save them. there is discrimination here.It is not a 'hate law' it is a stupid, foolish, offensive & potentially dangerous law
.....Oh dear! we have another one. Yes, yes, yes, its all about the French hating the Turks. poor little you.
At the end when I say "the genocide did not happen" i am breaking the french law. But when i say, "The french parliament is consisted of idiots and their law is a joke" it's fine. Fair enough?
BF,
You sure you didn't use Ozi accent in your replies? You managed to piss both Armenian and a Turkish member over same topic.
Must be something about the beer
No such thing as a good tax - Churchill
To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.
I notice you've avoided replying to most of what I wrote. I was hoping I misjudged you. Guess not.
Genocide is a recently invented word whose meaning is often far from clear. It can be used to describe everything from language policy in schools to Auschwitz & the Killing Fields. it tends to get flung around in arguments and court cases in such a way that it is difficult to use it meaningfully. I prefer terms such as 'democide' or 'mass murder' (approximately the same thing), as they save having to get into the nebulous world of specific intent. Mass murder was committed in Turkey. Does it upset you that the French are simply accusing you of mass murder, or is it only the genocide claim that upsets you? If it is the former than the word is irrelevant.Originally Posted by isim
Which 'offensive arguments'? What 'reality' and what don't they help? I'm not here to 'help' anyone, I'm here to argue for the value of historical truth & freedom of speech. Your nation has committed much greater crimes against both than the current French state. it just happens that on this occasion they are the ones acting appallingly.Your offensive arguments against Turkey don't change the reality and they don't help.
Explain. What discrimination? Because France isn't passing laws about every 'genocide' this becomes a 'hate law'? Bullshit. You are just huffy because someone is calling your nation out on its past. I doubt you have the slightest understanding of what makes these laws bad or dangerous.If there is discrimination than there is hate crime. stupid, foolish etc don't save them. there is discrimination here.
I'm still waiting for you to explain to me why Turkey's laws that have been used to persecute people for their views are not 'hate laws'. I'm also waiting for you to tell me if you are opposed to Turkey punishing people for expressing the view that there was an Armenian Genocide.
OK, you've lost me. Have you read my posts on this thread? Have you actually noticed that I am passionately opposed to the law? You should not be punished for expressing that opinion. Neither should people in Turkey be punished for disagreeing with you. You seem not to care much about that. At his point you look just like Ararat - too busy engaging in an ethnic p!ssing contest to understand what is really dangerous & offensive about these laws. Happy enough to put on jackboots & stomp on people when they disagree with you, but crying 'hate' when the boot is on someone else's foot. Do you have a worthwhile contribution to make here or are you just trying to make sure that Turkey isn't left out when it comes to the trolling?At the end when I say "the genocide did not happen" i am breaking the french law. But when i say, "The french parliament is consisted of idiots and their law is a joke" it's fine. Fair enough?
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
Apparently my accent irritates trolls no matter what their nationality. Guess its my fault for standing on principle rather than picking a tribe. Happens all the time. Back to the beer I s'pose.BF,
You sure you didn't use Ozi accent in your replies? You managed to piss both Armenian and a Turkish member over same topic.
Must be something about the beer
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
yep. you are arrogant.Apparently my accent irritates trolls no matter what their nationality.
"They should know well that they are not in a postion to write history of a selected country. " this was my post that you quoted and this one is your response to my post "Governments should never write history - that includes the government of Turkey." i avoided replying most of your arguments because first they are not clear and second i found them irrelevant for topic and simply didn't care them. i mean why do you include turkey in it. do you mean turkish governments write history or what, it is not clear. "Neither should people in Turkey be punished for disagreeing with you." similar, do you mean people are punished if they say "armenian genocide" did happened or they shouldn't be punished if they say "armenian genocide" did happened. not clear.I notice you've avoided replying to most of what I wrote.
which law? if you care me that much, i give you my perspective for discrimination. france, turkey,... doesn't change it. so what?I'm still waiting for you to explain to me why Turkey's laws that have been used to persecute people for their views are not 'hate laws'.
you wait to much stuff. depends on the view. People are free to accept "armenian genocide" and they are free to talk about history or genocide with their own perspective but "dirty turkish blood" is not a view. it is an insult and should be punished because first of all it is insult and second it provokes crowds. this one is for mass media. on facebook or people on their daily life accuse each other being fashist to not accept so called armenian genocide with no base.I'm also waiting for you to tell me if you are opposed to Turkey punishing people for expressing the view that there was an Armenian Genocide.
No i haven't. And that post wasn't to you. Solve your over sympathy problem and don't drink much.OK, you've lost me. Have you read my posts on this thread?
As I thought, just one more troll with nothing worthwhile to contribute. We should give you & Ararat a thread where you can see which one can out-troll the other.
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
He is not arrogant (on his page at least) - you are just wrong.yep. you are arrogant. your monologs are funny because you ask question to me and answer it in the name of me with your funny brain reading method.
People kicked out Araat's internet teeth because he was a fascist who wanted o muzzle free speech - guess what we now think the same about you.it is an insult and should be punished because first of all it is insult and second it provokes crowds. this one is for mass media. on facebook or people on their daily life accuse each other being fashist to not accept so called armenian genocide with no base.
Maybe Araat might not run from a member for a change.As I thought, just one more troll with nothing worthwhile to contribute. We should give you & Ararat a thread where you can see which one can out-troll the other.
To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway
That would be cool!
Gee, thanks.
...maybe.Maybe Araat might not run from a member for a change.
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
I'm too lazy to go back and click the LIKE buttons on posts 133 and 138 so just consider it clicked.
Damn, two likes for BF's posts on the same thread.
Something is seriously wrong with me today.
it was answer to bigfella's question, it wasn't about Ararat: "I'm also waiting for you to tell me if you are opposed to Turkey punishing people for expressing the view that there was an Armenian Genocide. " I respect to your club but I have no intent to be part of it. I see discrimination in this law and i think it is foot steps of racism. I thought it was worthwhile to contribute.it is an insult and should be punished because first of all it is insult and second it provokes crowds. this one is for mass media. on facebook or people on their daily life accuse each other being fashist to not accept so called armenian genocide with no base.People kicked out Araat's internet teeth because he was a fascist who wanted o muzzle free speech - guess what we now think the same about you.
I respect to bigfella's ottoman history knowledge. But I guess I know better than him when, why Armenians relocated what happened during relocation and what happened after relocation. Only legal definition of genocide etc. And i am right. Therefore i don't taste to talk when "Armenians in train" recall holocaust in your head... For me, discrimination, foot steps of racism, leaving stable grounds, parliaments writing history of others etc are worthwhile to talk about with you.
Last edited by isim; 26 Jan 12, at 12:26.
You act like you have never heard about Article 301 which makes it a crime to insult Turkishness whatever that means.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article...ish_Penal_Code)
have you also heard of this guy named Orhan Pamuk who was hauled to court for saying that Turkey committed crimes against Kurds and Armenians.
Orhan Pamuk - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't care how you call it but Turkey is guilty of committing mass murder of Armenians. Go suck a lemon if you aint happy with what I said.....
Seek Save Serve Medic
Really. How did I act like I never heard about Article 301? Please explain, entertain me. Your link doesn't work. here is the article :You act like you have never heard about Article 301 which makes it a crime to insult Turkishness whatever that means.If you care me that much instead of the topic. I hate laws that limits free expression and i dislike cheap insults.Before amendments were made to Article 301 on April 30, 2008, the article stated the following:[8]
1.A person who publicly denigrates Turkishness, the Republic or the Grand National Assembly of Turkey, shall be punishable by imprisonment of between six months and three years.
2.A person who publicly denigrates the Government of the Republic of Turkey, the judicial institutions of the State, the military or security organizations shall be punishable by imprisonment of between six months and two years.
3.In cases where denigration of Turkishness is committed by a Turkish citizen in another country the punishment shall be increased by one third.
4.Expressions of thought intended to criticize shall not constitute a crime.
I live in Turkey. Of course I know him.have you also heard of this guy named Orhan Pamuk
Turkey her self guilty or curent turkish goverment guilty or Turks are guilty; what you mean? Is Armenia guilty for mass murder of Turks? And who the clever are you tell me Turkey is guilty? Keep the lemon.Turkey is guilty
Don Quijote please.if you aint happy with what I said.....
Thread: French National Assembly Criminalize Denying Armenian Genocide. my point: discrimination, foot steps of racism
Clinton sidesteps dispute between Turkey and France over genocide legislation - The Washington Post
Clinton sidesteps dispute between Turkey and France over genocide legislation
By Associated Press, Published: January 26
WASHINGTON — Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton on Thursday sidestepped a delicate dispute between two allies over the World War I-era killing of Armenians in Turkey.
Clinton was asked why the United States has not matched a move by French lawmakers to criminalize denial that the killings were genocide. The French legislation has enraged Turkey, which has threatened sanctions if French President Nicolas Sarkozy signs the bill.
7
Comments
Weigh In
Corrections?
inShare
The U.S. administration has avoided calling the killings genocide despite support for recognition by both Clinton and President Barack Obama when they were senators.
Clinton said the administration was wary of compromising free speech. She said the issue was best left for scholars.
“To try to use government power to resolve historical issues, I think, opens a door that is a very dangerous one to go through,” Clinton said at an event with U.S. State Department employees.
Historians estimate that up to 1.5 million Armenians were killed by Ottoman Turks around the time of World War I, an event widely viewed by scholars as the first genocide of the 20th century. Turkey denies that the deaths constituted genocide, saying the toll has been inflated and those killed were victims of civil war and unrest.
The issue has also previously roiled U.S.-Turkish relations. A move by a U.S. congressional panel in 2010 to advance a resolution by the House of Representatives recognizing the killings as genocide caused Turkey to temporarily withdraw its ambassador to Washington. The resolution was opposed by the Obama administration. Ultimately, the full House of Representatives did not bring the measure up for a vote.
Clinton said Thursday that the issue should be debated, but not settled by governments.
“We need to encourage anyone on any side of any contentious historical debate to get out into the marketplace of ideas,” she said. “Muster your evidence, put forth your arguments, and you know, be willing to engage.”
.
To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway
You are quite welcome... arrogant bastard...Gee, thanks.
Guess he did....maybe.
To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
Share this thread with friends: