Neonazi Terrorism in Germany

**Dreadnought** · 22 Nov 11,, 19:52

Originally Posted by Bigfella

Didn't say legalize all drugs DN, just dope. You also dodged the issue of speeding. I live in an area riddled wiht heroin, but the only times my life has been under threat (twice) were as a result of people breaking the law in a car (one speeding & crossing onto our side of the road & hitting our car head on, the other someone running a red light while I was crossing & hitting me hard enough to throw me several metres in the air & break 3 ribs). Car drivers do far more damage to society every year than dope smokers, welfare cheats & terrorists all rolled into one. Why not treat them with a fraction the harshness we reserve for someone who sells a little weed? The answer is obvious - if we treated law breaking drivers like the life threatening criminals they are, rather than giving them slap on the wrist, the scream would be so loud that no politician could stand it. People always find an excuse for their own rule bending & a reason why it isn't worthy of the sort of punishment 'real criminals' should get. My point is that people never see themselves as 'political pets', even when thay clearly are.

Well I didnt mean to "dodge" the topic of speeding but as far as speeding goes here in the US there are some states if not mistaken (VA is one) that so many miles over the speed limit will land you in jail for the night outside of your fine and car impounded .Many states here prohibit the use of radar detectors and if caught a huge fine and its confiscated. I have zero problem with your proposition it would generate more money for those towns and who knows maybe set up someting similar to the CAT (Catastrophic Loss) fund we have here. I'm not even sure if it still exists of has been renamed since then. None the less I have no problem with it. I just recieved a ticket not long ago on a farm road, no one on it and the police sitting in a field late on a sunday afternoon. I paid it. It was my first in probably 7-9 years so its not going to hurt.

You would be surprised the amount of letters (3) I recieved in the mail the following day from "lawyers" who were more then happy to represent me in traffic court if I wanted to pay them. I paid the fine, I figured 1 every 7-9 years is not all that bad. Hopefully this time I will go longer.

Welfare and UE though are State funded until exausted and then they become Federally funded. They need to fix the loopholes that many extort.

**kato** · 01 Dec 11,, 20:12

The Federal Criminal Police Agency (BKA) has published a wanted poster. Information wanted, not people.

Name: fahndungsplakat__120x169,property=poster.jpg
Views: 339
Size: 394.5 KB

Name: fahndungsplakat__120x169,property=poster.jpg
Views: 339
Size: 394.5 KB

The state police of Baden-Württemberg is still promising some €300,000 for information with regard to the murder of the police officer in 2007 btw.

**BD1** · 01 Dec 11,, 22:27

what´s the last line meant generally for us all or do you have someone special here in mind?

**kato** · 02 Dec 11,, 05:58

Generally.

Mostly because the BKA poster doesn't mention how much can be in it for people who become snitches.

**kato** · 07 Jan 12,, 11:48

The defense attorneys of Beate Zschäpe are currently complaining about the conditions she's being held under.

Apparently she's on solitary, 24 hours in her cell. Voluntarily relinquished her right to the daily one-hour yard walk since the other girls at the prison tend to spit at her and threaten her. She's also claimed to be on suicide watch according to her attorneys, which supposedly includes 24 hour lights on in her cell. Showers twice weekly, weekly search of her cell.

Federal Attorney and JVA Cologne (the prison) both haven't commented yet.

SPON published an English-language interview with one of her attorneys last week btw:
Alleged*Neo-Nazi Terrorist's Lawyer: 'I See No Convincing Reason to Suspect Her' - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International

**kato** · 07 Jan 12,, 12:25

Originally Posted by Doktor

Politically motivated crimes associated with the far right in Germany are not so benign as you stated. Around 15,000 to 20,000 such crimes are committed per year.

That's hype really.

Statistics, from the Federal Domestic Intelligence Report 2010:

Right-Wing Political Crimes:
- Total: 15,905 politically motivated rightwing-extremist crimes (-15.2%)
- Classification:
  - 762 violent crimes (including 6 attempted murders, 2 uses of explosives, 4 attacks on transportation)
  - 11,384 propaganda crimes (e.g.: swastika graffiti; showing Hitler salute; wearing Nazi insignia etc pp)
  - 3,750 various crimes (e.g. property damage or Volksverhetzung)
- Violent crimes:
  - Targeting: 37.4% committed against foreigners, 36.1% committed against leftwing-extremists, 26.5% committed against the general population
  - Territorial distribution for violent crimes: 18.9% in South Germany (ca 40% of population), 38.3% in North Germany (ca 40% of population), 42.8% in East Germany (ca 20% of population)
Left-Wing Political Crimes:
- Total: 3,747 politically motivated leftwing-extremist crimes (-20.8%)
- Classification:
  - 944 violent crimes (including 4 attempted murders, 5 uses of explosives, 34 attacks on transportation)
  - 2,803 various crimes (mostly property damage)
- Violent crimes:
  - Targeting: 46.9% committed against rightwing-extremists, 53.1% committed against the general population
  - Territorial distribution: 28.2% in South Germany, 39.8% in North Germany, 32.0% in East Germany
Politically-motivated Foreigner Crimes:
- Total: 790 politically motivated foreigner extremist crimes (+11.7%)
- Classification:
  - 130 violent crimes (including 2 attempted murders, 2 uses of explosives, 1 attack on transportation)
  - 660 various crimes
- Violent crimes:
  - Territorial distribution: 43.8% in South Germany, 42.3% in North Germany, 13.9% in East Germany
  - Note: 39.2% of such violent crimes took place in a single state, Baden-Württemberg (accounting for 13% of the German population)

Members of potentially violent political organizations in Germany on domestic intelligence watchlist:

Rightwing Extremists (total: 26,000, including 9,500 potentially violent people):
- Rightwing-extremist subculture: 8,300 people
- Neonazi groups: 5,600 people
- formal party members: 9,600 people (6,600 for NPD, 3,000 for DVU)
- other rightwing-extremists: 2,500 people
Leftwing Extremists (total: 32,000, including 6,800 potentially violent people):
- Autonome and other violent subculture: 6,800 people (plus several thousand mobilization reserve)
- Marxist groups within Die Linke: 2,900 people (1,200 Communist Platform, 700 Socialist Left, 500 Cuba Si, 500 various others)
- members of other formal parties: 6,000 people (4,000 for DKP, 2,000 for MLPD)
- various Marxist-Leninist, Stalinist, Maoist or Trotzkist organizations: 11,500 people
- other leftwing-extremists: 5,400 people (all within Red Aid)
Islamist Extremists (total: 37,500 people):
- Milli Görus: 30,000 people
- various Turkish organizations: 1,400 people
- various Arab organizations: 3,700 people (including 900 Hisbollah and 1,300 Muslim Brotherhood)
- various other organizations: 2,400 (including 700 Tablighi Jama'at and 500 various Chechen organizations)
Ethnically grouped extremists (total: 24,900 people):
- Kurdish Workers Party (PKK): 11,500 people
- Turkish-Democratic Idealists Federation (ADÜTDF): 7,000 people
- other Turkish and Kurdish organizations: 2,600 people (1,300 TKP/ML, 600 MLKP, 700 DHKP-C)
- Tamil, Indian and Iranian organizations: 2,000 people (1,000 LTTE, 250 API, 550 ISYF, 200 BKI)
- various other organizations: 1,800 people

Note: Some of the organizations in this list, including larger ones like PKK, are officially outlawed in Germany. ADÜTDF and some others are only under "preliminary observation", i.e only suspected of anti-constitutional behaviour so far. Die Linke, the only leftwing party in parliament, is under full observation in some German states, whereas the federal domestic intelligence service only tracks radical groups within the 74,000-member party.

**Doktor** · 07 Jan 12,, 13:10

Looking at sheer numbers, seems like the lefties are more violent.

**kato** · 07 Jan 12,, 13:20

Nah, it goes back and forth every year. Equal over the long run. It's also a bit unbalanced by what types of crimes are part of that category. Rightwingers traditionally go more for the personal attacks on people, leftwingers for mini-terrorism with arson etc. What really throws it out of balance is the third category below.

Crimes against people (654 rightwing, 564 leftwing):
- attempted murder: 6 rightwing, 4 leftwing
- battery: 638 rightwing, 541 leftwing
- robbery: 7 rightwing, 15 leftwing
- extortion/blackmail: 3 rightwing, 4 leftwing

Terrorism (35 rightwing, 120 leftwing):
- arson: 29 rightwing, 81 leftwing
- explosives: 2 rightwing, 5 leftwing
- attacks on transportation: 4 rightwing, 34 leftwing

Crimes against the state (73 rightwing, 260 leftwing):
- breach of public peace: 25 rightwing, 148 rightwing
- resisting arrest: 48 rightwing, 112 leftwing

**mustavaris** · 07 Jan 12,, 13:57

Much, possiblt even most of the right wing crime in Germany would not be counted as criminal in the civilized world.

**kato** · 07 Jan 12,, 14:18

Hence why "propaganda delicts" are counted separately...

**kato** · 12 Feb 12,, 02:03

There's currently a more or less important affair going on involving possible attempts to suppress evidence. The Federal Police (BP) deleted some data recovered from the cell phone of one of the arrested supporters after a request from the Federal Criminal Agency (BKA) in December. The BP decrypted the data at the BKA's request; the deletion is highly unusual - the usual thing is to retain such data until criminal proceedings conclude, since the entire evidence-gathering process may be important for them. The BKA has confirmed the request and subsequent deletion.

Security experts consider this to be an act aimed at probably protecting BKA informants and agents within or in the environment of the terror cell. Federal Minister of the Interior Friedrich has thus ordered the BKA agency heads to give an "exhaustive report" on the matter. The chairman of the Federal Parliamentary Committee for Interior Matters, Wolfgang Bosbach, has declared the whole matter to be something to be fully disclosed asap.

In other news, Swiss police has arrested one of the group's weapon suppliers, a Swiss national who smuggled the Ceska CZ75 and the silencer used in the murder series from the Czech Republic to Germany.

**kato** · 26 Feb 12,, 01:18

Some 20-30 masked neonazis attacked some plainclothes police officers on saturday, injuring one of them. The officers were intercepting the armed group (several hundred meters away) as they were moving in to possibly attack a commemoration event for a local victim of the NSU terror group killed five years ago, organized by the local chapter of the post-communist Linke party. The group fled after injuring the officer, nine of them were arrested subsequently.

**Egerland** · 05 Mar 12,, 19:11

Funny how concerned the government is about "right wing terror". Yet when young immigrants rape, attack, kill, or injure a German, it is always an "Einzelfall", nothing to be concerned about. Well no one said demographic replacement would be painless.

**Doktor** · 05 Mar 12,, 20:24

Originally Posted by Egerland

Funny how concerned the government is about "right wing terror". Yet when young immigrants rape, attack, kill, or injure a German, it is always an "Einzelfall", nothing to be concerned about. Well no one said demographic replacement would be painless.

From what I remember there was a loud outcry in Germany for left wing extremism in the past.

Care to explain demographic replacement part?

**kato** · 05 Mar 12,, 21:05

Whoever in a way suitable to disturb the public peace incites hate against or calls for violent or arbitrary measures against a national, racial, religious or ethnic group, portions of the population or single people based upon their belonging to such a group or in general or attacks the human dignity of others by insulting, maliciously derising or defaming such a group, portions of the population or a single person due to their belonging to such a group or in general shall be punished by imprisonment between three months and five years.