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Thread: US State Department: Turkey's flotilla report is "independent and credible."

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    US State Department: Turkey's flotilla report is "independent and credible."

    It looks like the USA has shifted its approach to the Mavi Marmara incident in a bid to appease Turkey.

    (1) It has now stated that the UN Panel findings is "better". The US previously rejected an International inquiry into the incident. It has now changed its position with respect to this.

    (2) It has stated that Turkey's Report submitted to the UN pannel is "independent and credible". The Turkish report had proved through leaked camera footage that the IDF had shot 3 passengers holding camera's before even boarding the Mavi Marmara from aboard Israeli Helicopters.

    U.S.-Turkey: Flotilla Raid Report -U.S. State Spokesman Says Turkey's Report Independent, Credible
    U.S.-Turkey: Flotilla Raid Report -U.S. State Spokesman Says Turkey's Report Independent, Credible

    Thursday, 27 January 2011

    WASHINGTON, D.C. (A.A) - Philip Crowley, a spokesman for the U.S. State Department, on Wednesday described a report released by Turkey on Israel's deadly raid on a Gaza-bound flotilla as "independent and credible."

    "Both [Turkey and Israel] are doing what they can to help contribute to a fuller understanding of what happened during this incident last year [...] I'm saying that Turkey ? it is an independent, credible report. I'm not challenging either one," Crowley told reporters at a daily press briefing.

    The spokesman last Monday said an Israeli report on the flotilla incident was "transparent and independent."

    Crowley said the Turkish National Commission of Inquiry last September submitted its interim report to the UN Secretary General's panel of inquiry, adding that both Turkey and Israel had worked "seriously and responsibly to get at the facts, and both have made important contributions to the work of the Secretary General's panel."

    "We look forward to the process continuing at the United Nations within the Secretary General's Panel of Inquiry, which will give the international community the opportunity to fully review the circumstances surrounding this incident. And we look forward to a full examination of facts and perspectives from all sides," he said.

    Crowley said relations with both Turkey and Israel were of "equal importance" to the U.S., adding, "they are both close friends of the United States. They have a relationship that has been important bilaterally and to the region, and we hope that both countries will continue to seek opportunities to move beyond the recent strains in their own bilateral relations."

    Crowley said the U.S. recognized the importance the relationship between Turkey and Israel, adding that both countries exerted efforts to find ways to resolve the dispute.

    "We hope that can be done, because this relationship has very significant meaning, both in terms of our respective relations with these two countries, but more importantly, Turkey has been a significant player in helping to resolve issues in the region related to the pursuit of Middle East peace. And we would hope that in the future that effort can continue," he said.

    "Given the incident and the circumstances, I don't think that we're surprised that there are differing views of what transpired. That is expressly why we support the UN panel so that we can take the Turkish perspective, and it has a valid perspective; we can take the Israeli perspective, it has a valid perspective; and together, try to fully understand what happened. So ? but just to reinforce that through the UN panel there's still work to be done and there's still, obviously, an effort that will be important to understand fully what happened last year," Crowley said.

    Thursday, 27 January 2011

    A.A
    Turkish inquiry: IDF fired before reaching Marmara’s deck
    By DAN IZENBERG
    01/24/2011 15:28
    http://www.jpost.com/International/A...aspx?id=205004

    Commission says Israel Navy commando raiders tortured activists after premeditated attack last May.
    Two of the nine Turks killed aboard the Mavi Marmara were shot by commandos repelling toward the ship’s deck – before there was any resistance – alleges the Turkish commission that investigated the conflict, Reuters reported on Monday.

    The Turkish report was submitted to the UN on September 1.

    However, its contents were made public on Monday – one day after the Israeli commission of inquiry, headed by retired Supreme Court justice Jacob Turkel, published its report.

    Turkel’s commission found that Israel acted legally in establishing and enforcing the naval blockade on the Gaza Strip; and in the way it secured the ships that were trying to reach Gaza.

    The Turkish report charged that Israel carried out a premeditated attack on the flotilla, which was carrying humanitarian supplies to the Gaza Strip.

    It says Israeli forces besieged the vessel with rubber dinghies, helicopters armed with machine guns, laser guns, pistols and paint rifles.

    The report also charged that Israel Navy commandos tortured some of the passengers, who hailed from 37 countries.

    “They tortured them physically and psychologically, beat and kicked and punched them, withheld food and drink, handcuffed them and exposed them to the sun for hours at a time,” the report said. “They also prevented them from relieving themselves and cursed them.”

    In response to the Turkel Commission report, NGO Monitor issued a statement saying the commission rejected the material presented to it by human rights organizations, including Gisha, B’Tselem and Physicians for Human Rights.

    “The Commission showed a sophisticated understanding of the lack of credibility in NGO claims, and recognition that these are political advocacy organizations,” it said.

    The president of NGO Monitor, Prof. Gerald Steinberg, added that the Turkel report “affirms that NGOs provided biased and unverifiable allegations regarding the flotilla incident and the humanitarian situation in Gaza.”

    MK Haneen Zoabi (Balad) issued a statement stating, “It is no surprise that anyone who justified the siege and slow killing of one-and-a-half million Palestinians would justify the brutal attack on the Freedom flotilla and the killing of nine political activists.”

    Zoabi said the Turkel Commission “cannot persuade the world that Israel is not a serial international- law violator, and that the commission did not invite the only witness who saw what happened on board because it was afraid to upset the ‘harmony’ of the report.”

    Zoabi was referring to herself, one of the hundreds of passengers on the Mavi Marmara.

    The committee questioned two other passengers, Sheikh Hamad Abu Dabus, head of the southern wing of the Islamic Movement, and Muhammad Zidan, chairman of the High Monitoring Committee of the Arab Citizens of Israel. Subscribe to our Newsletter to receive news


    US: Turkel report fine, but UN flotilla panel better
    By HILARY LEILA KRIEGER AND DAN IZENBERG
    01/25/2011 07:04
    US: Turkel report fine, but UN flotilla panel better

    State Department official says Israel capable of carrying out “impartial and transparent” investigation despite Turkey's criticism of findings.
    WASHINGTON – The US on Monday welcomed the release of the Turkel Commission report on the Turkish flotilla incident, but said the “primary forum” for examining the event was the international committee operating under the auspices of UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon.

    US State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley said that Israel was capable of carrying out an “impartial and transparent” investigation despite Turkey’s criticism of the findings.

    Turkel’s commission found that Israel acted legally in establishing and enforcing the naval blockade on the Gaza Strip; and in the way it secured the ships that were trying to reach Gaza.

    Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Sunday dismissed the Turkel Committee's findings, telling reporters in Ankara that the report had "no value or credibility."

    The Turks carried out their own investigation into the incident which found that Israel carried out a premeditated attack on the flotilla, which was carrying humanitarian supplies to the Gaza Strip.

    Nine pro-Palestinian activists — eight Turkish citizens, and a Turkish American — were killed when Israeli commandos boarded a ship in the flotilla, the Mavi Marmara, on May 31.

    In New York, UN spokesman Martin Nesirky said investigators there had received a copy of the Israeli report.

    "As you know, to help complete their important mandate it is essential for the (UN) panel to review material provided by both sides, Israel and Turkey," he said.

    The UN panel of experts investigating the flotilla incident is led by former New Zealand prime minister Geoffrey Palmer and includes both a Turkish and an Israeli representative. Israel's representative on the UN investigative panel is Joseph Ciechanover, who formerly served as bureau chief of the Foreign Ministry and as legal counsel for the Defense Ministry.

    The Associated Press and JPost.com staff contributed to this report.

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    It looks like the USA has shifted its approach to the Mavi Marmara incident in a bid to appease Turkey.
    Nothing important. Playing word games to knowing the emptiest of words will stop a couple of cry babies without rejecting Israel's version of invents is meaningless. It is like complimenting a slow kid.

    Seems to have worked.
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    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Nothing important. Playing word games to knowing the emptiest of words will stop a couple of cry babies without rejecting Israel's version of invents is meaningless. It is like complimenting a slow kid.

    Seems to have worked.
    The motives are meaningless. The implications are most important.

    The US on Monday welcomed the release of the Turkel Commission report on the Turkish flotilla incident, but said the “primary forum” for examining the event was the international committee operating under the auspices of UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon.
    The US was against an international inquiry into the incident. It has now stated that the UN investigation is what counts.

    For it to work Turkey needs to resume relations with Israel which is not happening.

    Obviously the US values it's relationship with Ankara.
    Last edited by denizkuvetleri; 27 Jan 11, at 14:25.

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    The motives are meaningless. The implications are most important.
    Only to kids amazed by their own hands.
    To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

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    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Only to kids amazed by their own hands.
    I respect your opinion. However, Statements such as the above are closely scrutinized by other governments.

    At the very lease the US has now accepted that the IDF shot 3 passengers even before boarding the Ship from their helicopter in a bid to prevent them from filming the raid. This is sufficient for Turkey.

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    denizkuvetleri Reply

    "...At the very lease the US has now accepted that the IDF shot 3 passengers even before boarding the Ship from their helicopter in a bid to prevent them from filming the raid."

    Have you read the transcript from the press briefing for Jan. 26?

    U.S. Dept. Of State Daily Briefing Jan. 26, 2011

    QUESTION: Staying in the region. Again, Israel – one day after Israel commission released its report on flotilla crisis, Turkey also released its own report. How do you view Turkish report on the flotilla crisis, which basically contrary to Israeli report right now?

    MR. CROWLEY: Well, let’s recapture a little bit here. Last September, the Turkish National Commission of Inquiry submitted its interim report to the UN Secretary General’s panel of inquiry. Each country – Turkey and Israel – has worked seriously and responsibly to get at the facts, and both have made important contributions to the work of the Secretary General’s panel.

    We look forward to the process continuing at the United Nations within the Secretary General’s Panel of Inquiry – it’s also called the Palmer Commission – which will give the international community the opportunity to fully review the circumstances surrounding this incident. And we look forward to a full examination of facts and perspectives from all sides.

    So we would say that the fact – that the contribution made by Turkey and its analysis and Israel and its ongoing analysis will help us in this ongoing effort to understand what happened fully. And this is an area that still has work to be done.

    What is of equal importance to us is the longstanding ties that we have to both Israel and Turkey. They are both close friends of the United States. They have a relationship that has been important bilaterally and to the region, and we hope that both countries will continue to seek opportunities to move beyond the recent strains in their own bilateral relations.


    QUESTION: So these reports – this relationship is getting even worse, with the reports, Turkish and Israeli, and we don’t know exactly what the Palmer is going to be. But it seems like the relationship between these two allies of the U.S. in the region, two of the most important allies in the region, are getting worse, not for better.

    MR. CROWLEY: I mean, it’s – I think that we simply recognize the importance of this relationship, and we do know that there are efforts being made on both sides to find ways to resolve the strains that do exist. We hope that can be done, because this relationship has very significant meaning, both in terms of our respective relations with these two countries, but more importantly, Turkey has been a significant player in helping to resolve issues in the region related to the pursuit of Middle East peace. And we would hope that in the future that effort can continue.

    QUESTION: P.J. --

    MR. CROWLEY: Hold on.

    QUESTION: (Inaudible). What is the U.S. response to the fact Interpol has just released a statement saying that they put out an international alert for the location and arrest of the Tunisian President Ben Ali?

    QUESTION: Can we go back and stay with Turkey for a second?

    MR. CROWLEY: Hold on.

    QUESTION: I just – on Monday you had some fairly kind words for the Israeli investigation into this. I believe you described it as transparent, open, and balanced. If it weren’t – wasn’t those exact words, it was close to it.

    MR. CROWLEY: Transparent and independent.

    QUESTION: Independent. Would you use the same adjectives to describe the Turkish report?

    MR. CROWLEY: I think that Turkey has put forward its own good-faith effort. I have no reason to question that it also has --

    QUESTION: But it’s directly at odds with the Israeli report.

    MR. CROWLEY: Well, and given the incident and the circumstances, I don’t think that we’re surprised that there are differing views of what transpired. That is expressly why we support the UN panel so that we can take the Turkish perspective, and it has a valid perspective; we can take the Israeli perspective, it has a valid perspective; and together, try to fully understand what happened. So – but just to reinforce that through the UN panel there’s still work to be done and there’s still, obviously, an effort that will be important to understand fully what happened last year.

    QUESTION: So you would not use the same words to describe the Turkish report as the Israelis'?

    MR. CROWLEY: I’m saying that Turkey – it is an independent, credible report. I’m not challenging either one.

    QUESTION: Well, how can they both be --

    MR. CROWLEY: I think both countries are --

    QUESTION: How can they both be credible --

    MR. CROWLEY: Both countries are doing what they can to help contribute to a fuller understanding of what happened during this incident last year.

    QUESTION: Are they? Or are they helping to contribute to their version of what happened?

    MR. CROWLEY: Well, they – each has provided the UN Secretary General with a report. These are important steps. They contribute to a fuller understanding of what happened. And through Palmer Commission we will try to obviously resolve contradictory points of view. We understand that."

    Nothing uttered at that press briefing suggests we accept any findings as conclusive. That's clear.
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    Quote Originally Posted by denizkuvetleri View Post
    I respect your opinion. However, Statements such as the above are closely scrutinized by other governments.

    At the very lease the US has now accepted that the IDF shot 3 passengers even before boarding the Ship from their helicopter in a bid to prevent them from filming the raid. This is sufficient for Turkey.
    That's quite the conspiracy theory. Israeli soldiers shot 3 people from a moving, vibrating helicopter at night in order to prevent them from videotaping the raid and were completely unaware of the mob of angry, unruly people with knives and clubs waiting on the deck.

    Either that, or they shot 3 people from a moving, vibrating helicopter at night in order to prevent them from videotaping the raid and noticed the mob and decided to do nothing about it, because everybody loves being on the receiving end of a good ass-whuppin' now and again.

    denizkuvetleri, let's look at this objectively. Does either of the above stories sound even remotely plausible? Do you have a better explanation?
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigross86 View Post
    That's quite the conspiracy theory. Israeli soldiers shot 3 people from a moving, vibrating helicopter at night in order to prevent them from videotaping the raid and were completely unaware of the mob of angry, unruly people with knives and clubs waiting on the deck.

    Either that, or they shot 3 people from a moving, vibrating helicopter at night in order to prevent them from videotaping the raid and noticed the mob and decided to do nothing about it, because everybody loves being on the receiving end of a good ass-whuppin' now and again.

    denizkuvetleri, let's look at this objectively. Does either of the above stories sound even remotely plausible? Do you have a better explanation?
    Turkey would not include crap in its report if it did not have any evidence to support such allegation. I don't think the Turkish judiciary is that cheap...especially when the whole world is watching. They have also forwarded smuggled video footage supporting such allegation to the UN commission.

    I have not read the Turkish report yet, however, the US says it is "independent and credible". So I am not going to comment on this as yet.

    We have to wait until the UN Commission announces its findings.

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    denizkuvetleri & bigross86 Reply

    "...I have not read the Turkish report yet, however, the US says it is 'independent and credible'. So I am not going to comment on this as yet."

    denizkuvetleri, you already have commented without reading it. My read from Mr. Crowley's press briefing comments is that America has taken no position on the respective nat'l investigations but has no reason to question the composition nor processes invoked, specifically in reply to questions asked, regarding Turkey.

    Nothing, though, about the findings. Nada. Do not persist, therefore, in attempting to summarize for the American government what it hasn't done for itself yet.

    "We have to wait until the UN Commission announces its findings."

    And then see how the various parties view and respond to their findings.
    Last edited by S2; 28 Jan 11, at 18:41.
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