And I was expecting an indian posting on this board to be able to make himself understood. Guess we are both dissappointed. I based my comments on reading what you wrote, not a test score. If you don't want language to be an issue then write more clearly.Originally Posted by ambidex
Oh, and I have an honours degree from Monash and a Batchelor of Letters from Melbourne where I am undertaking a PhD. Oh, and I have had several articles published under peer review - how you doin'?
Still waiting for a point.I was making a point that it is not the problem with out spoken Indians but with the Australians. Last time when you were having problems with lebanese no one was there to listen. Last time when oz white restaurant were not allowing aborigines to enter, no one banned your cricket team to play with.This time the situation is different. Adding: welcome to information age.
I don't have the faintest idea what you are talking about. I assume you were clearer at UTS.For one fake Indian thug Australia is not going to be off the hook for 5 racial attacks.
I'm sorry that you were treated poorly. It is not something I consider acceptable. That is certainly not the case where I work - at last count the mix of ethnicities & nationalities runs into the dozens. Those differences play no role in how well we get along.I can not forget how i was treated at my job place when whole Australia was jumping on ass and shouting terrorist terrorist when Dr.Mohd Hanif was detained without charges.
Oh, and the Hanif matter was a disgrace.
Indeed not, most earn it, some just pay for it.Permanent residency we get is not awarded to us by charity.
If you want to know why I remarked on your English earlier read this to someone who speaks it well.You can not dictates who shall apply for the same and not.
Is that a question or a statement? If it is the latter I suggest you pony up the proof. (oh, and about the english...)You all make such stereotype remarks on every single online forums don't you?
Yes you are. Doesn't mean the rules have been well written or sensibly enforced. I just saw a wonderful Indian girl with good professional qualifications forced to leave Australia against her will while people who qualified for low skill jobs will get to stay. A poor trade. In some cases the 'colleges' were simply a front for gettig PRs, in others unfortunate studets were defrauded. Fortunately the rules are being tightened to limit the rorting.We are earning PR as per federal rules and regulation. We are qualifying for PR by claiming points.
You don't seem to like Australia very much. I assume that you left as soon as you finished your studies or plan to do so - without a PR.
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
A third-world nation like India, especially one with an active middle class, will always have people who look forward to a better life in the First World. There are a lot of folks in poor countries who don't pursue education to put their career in a higher trajectory in their home countries but to "settle" in the First-World. Failure to recognize this phenomenon is just plain naivety. It's the Australian govt's responsibility to make sure that the system is not abused.
Yes a very sad case indeed, regardless of the poor child race.
This hits very close to me as a father and the fact that I brought up in the Lalor and the little kid's body was found but 5km from where I live!
This Dhillon Gursewak is also being investigated for having a false passport.
P.S. I find it very un nerving that the Indian media, supported by the Indian Government in the interest of their resurgence in Indian 'nationalism ,fuels this debate and issue of Indian treatment in Australia back in India!
Regards
Pioneer
Here we go again:(
Your post has a lot of the brown stuff that runs out of a bull.
Australia as a nation has opened it's doors to people from any land. Australians are largely very tolerant of any person, no matter their creed, religion.
Certainly there have been problems, but nothing like the overblown reports in some media outlets.
So ambidex please tell us what the reality is, you seem to know a lot more than any ignorant Australian.
No argument here.
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
The whole thing is just terrible Pioneer. I just can't stop thinking about those poor parents - they will grieve until the day they die.
I too have had questions about the way the Indian media & government have handled this. When an Indian student is killed in a park late at night it is an international incident. When four other Indians (not including this poor lad) are killed by friends & family the silence is deafening.
Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C
bigfella this is simply a case of india putting itself out there as a growing, developing nation.
countries such as australia as easy targets and will continue to be so. that wont stop hundreds of thousands of indians wishing to immigrate here.
sort of have your cake and eat it too.
rather amusing comment from Outlook Magazine editor-in-chief Vinod Mehta, when told he The Australian newspaper he was saddened by news of the three-year-old's death but "enormously relieved" to hear there were no racial overtones to the crime. In January, Mr Mehta's magazine -- one of the country's top-selling English language news publications -- ran a controversial cover story, "Why the Aussies Hate Us", featuring young Indian victims of violence and racism as well as quotes from far-right politicians.
But Mr Mehta said yesterday; "I think this will be a wake-up call to the (Indian) community in Australia to say `Do not jump to conclusions -- all attacks may not be racist'.
"Mr Mehta acknowledged there had been a tendency by some Indian media and commentators to assume all attacks on Indians were crimes committed by racist white Australians, but added, "Given the background, can you blame them?"
thank you Mr Mehta. you have shown yourself to be not really helping the situation....
Last edited by ned kelly; 08 Mar 10, at 23:30.
Illegitimi non carborundum
ooo it hurts? Its difficult to drive on unmarked two way lane?I think your storey is not required here cause its totally out of topic and explains that you don't like Indian students to be here. I was talking about racism in Australia which has nothing to do with your prejudice about how Indians bluff(as per you and others) to come here and study.
Also I think your login ID is hard to personally attack but i can play cricket RHS and LHS both ways so my ambidextrous ID has hardly any thing to do with this discussion. However what i know about Ned Kelly that he was an outlaw.
'Going straight to lowest common denominator argument' is what you think and i disagree. I believe that saying something upfront makes it easier to understand and effective.
What ever you are writing is not reader friendly, sorry am i missing something?"we are paying hard earn money which normal Australian can not pay in whole life to these universities." is not grammatically correct,factually correct and has no basis in actual studying in Australia at universities.
a university ( i attended Sydney uni, honours in economics ) is slightly different from a "vocational" college where foreign students enroll to learn cooking, hairdressing ( remember that sikh i mentioned studying this ? ) etc etc........and pay to do so.
Most of the students are coming here to study courses/training for occupation high in demand. Vocational colleges are affiliated to Australian universities. These universities are endorsing their product in Indian market with a Tag of PR. Students are not Helli dropped in Australia.
Non of your mentioned courses lead to PR and every one knows it for last two year. You are just trying to defend what you don't know. Ask any migration agent he will let you know.
Out off topic... never mind.university = gain admission marks, study there, fees are paid upfront ( very reasonable or you receive a government loan at negligible interest to be paid back once you are in the workforce)
Negligible interest....??
Average high middle class annual income is 6k.
2 years minimum fee is 25-30K.
Maximum loan sanctioned in India is 15-20K.
No interest for first 2 years but you have to pay minimum principle amount EMI. Which is ~300$ per month.
You have to pledge 20% of loan amount in cash and property equal to the value of loan.
After two years the monthly repayment increases 2 folds. That is 600$ per month for next 5-7 years.
Average first 3 months without job in Australia.
Minimum 20 hrs per week or risk deportation with average 17 $/hour. 34k in 2 year.
Minus
600x24=14400 living cost.
Loan Repayment 300x24=7200. 19600-7200=12400.
So an average Indian student can earn 12400 Australian dollars after paying taxes in two years if all goes well. This 12400 will burn very fast after two years cause you have to pay back double the amount of loan now even if you are staying back in Australia with spending same cost of living.
Interestingly after getting PR if one has to bring his parents as PR one has to pay 80k per parent (non refundable). So don't worry no one is going to stay here without parents and your 99% figure is fictional. I am leaving Australia in April this year cause my wife's training is over and now we are starting our own Radiology practice in my home town.
Thanks, I am pleased to here from you. Indian community(back in India) is happy to see more regulations are now in place.I know first hand all about these dodgy vocational colleges. a very close female friend of mine is enrolled so she can stay in the country, as is 99% of the other students. who seriously comes to Australia to study beauty therapy, hairdressing or cooking? so they can go back to their own country and setup a business doing this?
no, sadly it is a cash cow for many unscrupulous business people, Australian and foreign, to get as many foreign "students" into Australia so they can hopefully migrate and get that magical permanent residence.
As i mentioned above the New immigration policy do not entertain course like hair dressing etc for PR. Friend of mine applied an on shore PR application in Nov. 2008 and its still in limbo. He is still in Australia without any status, people gradually learn to play with system. whats wrong in it? they are not doing anything illegal.
Around 3000 applications has been already reject since last 2 months(makes you happy) cause of occupation not in critical short list. Neither Indians nor OZ are complaining for that?
Working without pay is like living in hell try your self and tell me how it goes.so let's call it what it is.....pay some money, work 900 hours for free ( a condition of staying ) then maybe you will get a visa to live in a first world country. that is what many people are trying to do.
please enlighten me......I am soooo curious.....re: university admission in Australia. I received 96% out of a possible 100%, gained admittance, paid $5000 in fees for a 4 yr degree out of tax dollars i earnt once i joined the work force. pretty equitable to me i'd say......the government loans you the money ( not US sized loans or fees )....
what i do not appreciate is Indian morons pontificating about australia when they are ignorant, shallow minded and feel they are better than every other person or culture.
if india was so great, why are there 90000 students studying here other than to get permanent residency? is it to spread indian culture?
Are we comparing a 3rd word country with a developed one?
I can see your well camouflaged bigotry. I have already mentioned that Indians living in Australia are trying hard to adopt Australia values.
But some thing is wrong here and my theories is, it takes time for Australians to accept an outsider and it make more harder to adjust when they(outsiders) are at parity (I mean democratic values) then others who don't pontificate. If trend remains the same very soon Indians those who are trying to muck around uninvited to be friend of white Australians, will start living like other aliens in their own pockets as antagonists.
Furthermore you lack foreseeability and practicality of the fact that your usual rants/phobia/insecurity can not stop any immigrant to quench stability and fortune(PR).
And please tell me why the hell on earth one will compromise its cultural values being here in Australia when on one else ask the same any where on this earth. Its time to change your national slogans.
ambidex my older brother & sister, who are adopted, are of indian heritage. I have grown up, with them in a mixed family, both anglo & indian. I also have many close indian friends.
I think therefore I would have a better understanding of australia and it's immigration policies, settlement and general acceptance of people of all different races than you would.
you mentioned foreign students studying courses high in demand? cooking? hairdressing? really? those courses have been discarded.
anyone could see this is an attempt to gain PR. i don't begrudge anyone from trying to better their life but let's call a spade a spade and at least admit they/you wish to immigrate here, much like many hundreds of thousands of others. by studying the socially beneficial job of cook you gain that opportunity. don't get upset when the goal posts are moved because so many people rort the system. and we no longer admit someone who has "studied" a cookery course into PR.....
so, to stay on topic, have you been successful in gaining PR or immigrating? or not? is this why you are angry with australia?
and could you please explain this statement?
"we are paying hard earn money which normal Australian can not pay in whole life to these universities."
sorry, my comprehension fails me here......what ever do you mean?
indians can't pay the fees? australians can't afford to pay the fees to these universities?
clearly you make no sense here, so enlighten me or try again to explain this.....
Illegitimi non carborundum
Actually lets blame the British. Indian journalism heavily follows trash British journalism sensationalisation standards(not all Brit journalism just the seedy ones). Its again the British legacy(lets blame somebody else), and I am not even being facetious here. For some odd reason "Racism" gets abnormal attention in INdia, and hence the overuse of the word in Indian press. Normally anyone in the racist zone of countries laugh these allegation off or just get irritated by the idiocy of it. I would ignore such allegations.
And FYI there are whole regions in India that no longer qualify as third world and actually offer a better life than Sydney or Silicon Valley (barring crowds and weather). It has a billion people its more like 20 countries.
Don't wish to get too involved in this thread; but as an international student, I can say that I ended up paying atleast 5 times the rate which other students paid. I was studying in a college in Canada, and though double minded at the moment, but pondering on pursuing university back there too; I can say, that a $2000CDN course for locals cost me more than $11,000CDN, add on $7000 for 2 semesters for the room at residence, and than start adding up all the other living costs. The university fees I was checking out, is even much higher than college, and it is atleast $35,000 per 2 semesters. We have to milk our parents for all this, unlike the locals, we cannot rely on loans to pay for this. Not that I'm cribbing at all, I enjoyed my time in Canada and hopefully will get to enjoy a few more years if I decide on going to university there, but just trying to give you the other perspective.
Nabha Sparasham Deeptam
-Touch The Sky With Glory
Tronic I appreciate your insight and input. The cost clearly is and can be ridiculously expensive.
studying in a foreign country can be particularly difficult endeavour yet very rewarding for both the student and the wider community in which the student lives.
what I, and many australian people particularly dislike are biased, unfactual, ill informed indian media and personal posts by people who have no idea as to what they are talking about.
the recent tragedy with the 3 yr, the indian who set himself on fire to claim insurance and then blamed white australians set back india's image here in australia, just as recent bashing of indian students in australia by australians does the same for australia's image.
one country is no better than the other ( except australia did rule the cricketing world for many years, hats off to india no as No. 1 test nation ). we need to work together to ensure this does not happen again.
Illegitimi non carborundum
To tell you the truth, I have not been paying much attention to this. Its not something to take seriously. The media just can't find anything better to fill their airtime with, so, when they're not playing clips from some comedy show or reality tv, they fill in time raking up controversy with this. Don't worry, China almost invaded India for the past few months, when that story got too repetitive, we move on to Australia. Tomorrow it will be something else.
Nabha Sparasham Deeptam
-Touch The Sky With Glory
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