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Thread: Slobodan Milosevic’s Last Waltz

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    Ray
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    Slobodan Milosevic’s Last Waltz

    Slobodan Milosevic’s Last Waltz

    By RUTH WEDGWOOD
    Published: March 12, 2007

    Washington


    EVEN from the grave, Slobodan Milosevic roils the international system. When he was alive, his violence in the Balkans required NATO to intervene twice. He swaggered on the stage of the Dayton peace negotiations. And even after he was bundled off to a United Nations court to stand trial on charges of genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity, Mr. Milosevic tried to convert his criminal defense into a political rant to be shown nightly on Serbian television. The trial meandered for four years, and both the presiding judge and Mr. Milosevic died before a final verdict could be returned.

    Now the skeleton’s waltz has turned one more time around the dance floor. This round brings us the ruling of the International Court of Justice, in a civil suit that should never have been brought if its result was to be so meager.


    In 1993, Bosnia sued Serbia in the International Court of Justice, sometimes known as the World Court, for planning, abetting and committing genocide in the Bosnian conflict. Bosnia argued that the Serbian militias’ sniping and bombardment of civilian enclaves, torture and assassination of detainees, and ultimately, slaughter of more than 7,000 Muslim men and boys at Srebrenica, amounted to genocide.

    Last month, the court dismissed Bosnia’s case on almost all counts. The judges sitting in Andrew Carnegie’s peace palace in The Hague held that the Serbian campaign of violence and ethnic cleansing against Bosnian Muslims could not constitute genocide. The only actionable instance of genocide, said the court, was the wholesale execution of prisoners at Srebrenica in 1995, and even there, Serbia was not adequately implicated in the crime’s commission.


    This is a remarkable result. It’s true that Srebrenica woke the West from its stupor and brought NATO military action. But the ethnic conflagration had already raged for three years, with countless acts of nationalist violence aimed at expelling Muslims from the north, south and east of Bosnia. Yet the International Court of Justice shrinks from recognition, failing to explain why the deliberate slaughter of civilians in the riverside town of Brcko in 1992, or the torture and execution of Muslim civilians in Foca, were legally different in kind from the Srebrenica murders.

    The court does lay one misdemeanor at Serbia’s doorstep: Belgrade failed to take steps to “prevent” the genocide at Srebrenica. For this, the court says, no damages are due. But that passive fault fails to account for Belgrade’s robust program of financing, equipping and supporting criminal militias like Arkan’s Tigers and the Gray Wolves, as well as the forces that specialized in leveling Muslim villages.

    The court’s judgment has broad implications. It amounts to a posthumous acquittal of Mr. Milosevic for genocide in Bosnia. Though he planned to divide the country in two, in a scheme devised with Croatia’s president, Franjo Tudjman, and engineered the strategy of violent ethnic cleansing, the court concluded that this did not amount to a campaign to destroy the ethnic group of Bosnian Muslims in whole or in part, for he was just pushing their reduced numbers somewhere else. As a law student might suppose, it will take years of study to understand how that could be true.

    Worse yet, by saying that only the Srebrenica massacre amounted to genocide, the International Court of Justice limits the charges that can be effectively brought against the Bosnian Serb leaders Radovan Karadzic and Ratko Mladic, if Belgrade at last allows them to be arrested.

    It is hard to say why the court did not step back from these dire consequences. But there were both technical missteps and political snares in its judgment.

    First, the World Court rejected the standard of vicarious liability used in the United Nations criminal tribunal for the former Yugoslavia. In applying the Geneva Conventions to the Bosnian fighting, the criminal court early concluded that Belgrade’s support was enough to make major portions of the conflict into an international war.

    But the International Court of Justice chides the United Nations criminal court for offering an opinion on an issue of “general” international law like state responsibility and, despite more than 10 years of settled criminal case law, rejects the criminal court’s conclusion. This sibling rivalry between international courts has been gently called “fragmentation.” It does not bode well for any coherent jurisprudence.

    The World Court also insists that unless Belgrade gave “direct orders” for particular operations or the Bosnian Serbs were “completely dependent” on Belgrade, there is no liability at all. This will be a surprise to scholars of ordinary tort law, who are accustomed to supposing that responsibility for wrongdoing can be shared.

    Though the court claims to be acting on the basis of a 1986 decision in a case pitting the United States against Nicaragua, the law has moved on since then. Indeed, the court’s lackadaisical standard is at odds with United Nations Security Council Resolution 1373, passed in the wake of Sept. 11, which says that no state has a right to provide any intelligence, logistics or financing to terrorist activities.

    Second, the International Court of Justice applies the demands of criminal proof to a civil case. The judges insist that even for civil liability, proof against Belgrade has to be “fully conclusive” and “incontrovertible,” with a level of certainty “beyond any doubt.” This standard is well known when the jail door will shut, but it exceeds the demands of civil liability. And in trying to meet this standard, the court declines to draw any adverse inference against Belgrade, even though the documents it turned over to the court were heavily redacted.

    Third, the International Court of Justice has a small jurisdictional embarrassment. After the NATO military intervention in Kosovo, Serbia went to the United Nations war crimes prosecutor to complain about NATO’s war fighting methods. The prosecutor concluded that there was no basis for a criminal investigation of NATO. Serbia then sued various NATO states in the International Court of Justice. These suits were dismissed on the ground that Yugoslavia was no longer a member of the United Nations and hence had no plaintiff’s right of access to the court.

    But reasons cut both ways, argued Belgrade, and disqualification as a plaintiff could also protect Serbia as a defendant in Bosnia’s civil action. Lingering doubts about jurisdiction may have diminished the court’s willingness to make more rigorous findings of liability in the Bosnian genocide case.

    To be sure, the International Court of Justice has held that the Genocide Convention requires Serbia to surrender criminal suspects like Mr. Karadzic and General Mladic, who are wanted by the United Nations war crimes tribunal. But this is a redundant finding, for the legal authority of the Security Council already requires that surrender. It is not a substitute for clarity about Serbia’s role.

    It is all to the good that Serbia may soon rejoin Europe. But it does not facilitate that reunion to disguise what happened in the past.


    Ruth Wedgwood is a professor of international law at the School of Advanced International Studies at Johns Hopkins University.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/12/op...ewanted=2&_r=2
    So Serbia and Slobodan Milosevic have the last laugh!

    And what a song and dance was made!


    "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

    I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

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    No Serbia didn't have the last laugh and neither did Milosevic. Serbia's economy is in shambles and its capita per person is one of the lowest in Europe. Before the war, Serbia's economy was on a strong footing, ready to take off. Now the economy along with the infrastructure is in ruins. Serbia lost Kosovo, their spiritual land.

    Milosevic would be forever remembered as a man who wrecked Serbia and viled for ages.

    No, Ray, you are mistaken. They certainly did not have the last laugh. I think the one who had the last laugh are the Croats.

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    I completly agree with Blademaster. Please do not comment on the situation if you are not aware of the facts.

    Another thing I would like to say is, why do people always go on about Srebrenica and always forget Tuzla for example ?

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    Ray
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    Vlad,

    Bosnia claimed genocide was done.

    The Court has declared that NO, there was no genocide.

    So, does Serbia and Milosovic not win?


    "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

    I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

    HAKUNA MATATA

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray View Post
    Vlad,

    Bosnia claimed genocide was done.

    The Court has declared that NO, there was no genocide.

    So, does Serbia and Milosovic not win?
    Yes and No.

    Yes, you can call it a win that the court declared no. But you do relise Serbia was not involved DIRECTLY in the war ? They sure as hell have been helping out A LOT in terms of food/ammo/monetary aid, but unlike Croatia, there were no Serbian (or back then Yugoslavian) Army units operating in Bosnia. Yes, there were volunteers, but not actual units sent from Serbia. So why are they acusing Serbia ? Does that mean Serbia can acuse Afghanistan for killing its soldiers in Bosnia because there was a lot of middle eastern volunteers in Bosnia too ? No, Serbian can not.

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    "You do realize Serbia was not involved directly in the war. There were no actual units sent from Serbia." No, I dont realize that! For example, Mladic and all his staff, command structure intact,transferred to Bosnia for round 2 after raping and pillaging Slavonia then the Krajina. So if they took off their insignia, it means nothing. It was the JNA, enough propaganda.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Visigoth View Post
    "You do realize Serbia was not involved directly in the war. There were no actual units sent from Serbia." No, I dont realize that! For example, Mladic and all his staff, command structure intact,transferred to Bosnia for round 2 after raping and pillaging Slavonia then the Krajina. So if they took off their insignia, it means nothing. It was the JNA, enough propaganda.
    Thats pretty funny. Maybe try find ONE decent argument and not this "serbs are bad because CNN said so."
    What happened in Slovenia ? There was no war. Only Slovenians shooting UNARMED JNA RECRUITS as they were pulling out. That was it.

    And also, what propaganda ?

    And my friend, if Serbia was ACTUALLY involved in the war without the interference of NATO/UN what do you think the outcome of the war would be?
    I have my own unbiased opinion that i will keep to my self, because i have been there during the war and seen the status of all 3 sides.

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    Thats SLAVONIA! not Slovenia, as in eastern Hrvatska, ie; Vukovar. Of course as someone from the area you should know this?

    In April 1992, the Government of BiH ordered the official withdrawal of all Federal forces, which were not ethnically from BiH. In April 1992, when the conflict in BiH broke out, the JNA had approximately 80,000 troops deployed there. In early May, General Ratko Mladic a former JNA Brigadier General and commander of the JNA's 9th Corps headquartered at Knin was appointed JNA commander. Under pressure from the international community, on 19 May 1992, the FRY announced that it was withdrawing its forces. However, Yugoslav officials said that JNA personnel from BiH could remain there and fight on behalf of the Bosnian Serbs. Thus, General Mladic and 55,000 JNA troops, as well as JNA military weaponry and equipment, were transferred to the Territorial Defence Forces of the SRBiH. General Ratko Mladic maintained daily contact with both the Bosnian Serb and the federal Yugoslav Defence Ministries in Belgrade; and officers in the field claimed that they could not hold their fire until they received orders from Belgrade

    The Ministries of Defence in the Serbian autonomous regions of Croatia and BiH were initially subordinated to the new Yugoslav Ministry of Defence. While the «autonomous regions» would remain responsible for recruiting and organizing their own field forces, they could do so only with Belgrade's approval. The General Staff in Belgrade would retain operational control over all of these forces.

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    SRB
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visigoth View Post
    Thats SLAVONIA! not Slovenia, as in eastern Hrvatska, ie; Vukovar. Of course as someone from the area you should know this?

    In April 1992, the Government of BiH ordered the official withdrawal of all Federal forces, which were not ethnically from BiH. In April 1992, when the conflict in BiH broke out, the JNA had approximately 80,000 troops deployed there. In early May, General Ratko Mladic a former JNA Brigadier General and commander of the JNA's 9th Corps headquartered at Knin was appointed JNA commander. Under pressure from the international community, on 19 May 1992, the FRY announced that it was withdrawing its forces. However, Yugoslav officials said that JNA personnel from BiH could remain there and fight on behalf of the Bosnian Serbs. Thus, General Mladic and 55,000 JNA troops, as well as JNA military weaponry and equipment, were transferred to the Territorial Defence Forces of the SRBiH. General Ratko Mladic maintained daily contact with both the Bosnian Serb and the federal Yugoslav Defence Ministries in Belgrade; and officers in the field claimed that they could not hold their fire until they received orders from Belgrade

    The Ministries of Defence in the Serbian autonomous regions of Croatia and BiH were initially subordinated to the new Yugoslav Ministry of Defence. While the «autonomous regions» would remain responsible for recruiting and organizing their own field forces, they could do so only with Belgrade's approval. The General Staff in Belgrade would retain operational control over all of these forces.
    You are wrong my comrade. It Slovenia war started. JNA under real power from Stipe Mesic which is today president of Croatia and supported from Croatian generals make quick plan for Slovenia. In fact they didnt want to stop Slovenia in breaking SFRJ constitution but to set stage for total destruction of SFRJ make stupid plan which was doomed.
    Example strongest tank formation armed with only M-84 (one of the best tank of that time) PRVA GARDIJSKA OKLOPNA BRIGADA (first guardian armored brigade) first get order to go from Belgrade and 30 km form Belgrade it was ordered to stop.

    Couple of months later Croatia vote for independent. BiH was last to vote. Mesic in interview for Croatian newspaper said "My job is finished Yugoslavia is dead" and if you listen to CNN you will think that Milosevic want Yugo dead?

    About JNA in Bosnia well you give half truth. Yes we said JNA could stay but only soliders which were born in Bosnia get it?
    Why?
    Because large number of Bosnian muslim officers and generals allready deserted to to muslim army and before that same happend in Croatia.

    P.S. We Serbs didnt have any interest to act in Slovenia because it was never our land and Slovenians are still our good folks also we have small population in Slovenia. Last New Year we had around 50.000 Slovenians which came to Belgrade party. It is huge number because Slovenia have 2.500.000 citizens. For them we werent agressors why they would love to come in Belgrade. But Slovenia had problems with Croatia even today about territory.

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    SRB
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    In 1993, Bosnia sued Serbia in the International Court of Justice, sometimes known as the World Court, for planning, abetting and committing genocide in the Bosnian conflict.

    Srebrenica was in 1995?
    And Srebrenica was only case of genocide by Hague tribunal. So before 1995 no genocide.

    And who you Visigoth call operation "Oluja"(storm)? Maybe final liberation of Croatia from četnika(serbian king para-army use in slang as contumely for Serbs?

    If you ask me in 1918 we were fools why we fight f****** four years to liberate Slovenia, Croatia and Bosnia and during this time we lost 1/3 of population majority of young man. We were fools why we didnt took after WW1 only parts in which Serbs live from Austrians and for rest of liberate territories took money instead. Only 16 years later Ustaše( Croatian nazi-terroristic organisation) killed our king. In 1941 Croatians thanks us for liberation from Austria by concentration camp JASENOVAC which took no less that 100.000 Serbs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Visigoth View Post
    Thats SLAVONIA! not Slovenia, as in eastern Hrvatska, ie; Vukovar. Of course as someone from the area you should know this?
    You have ABSOLUTELY no idea what you talking about do you ? Please keep this an open DISCUSSION not a argument that you provoke with fictional facts that you come up with.

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    Croatia and Slovenia wanted a peacefull secession from Yugoslavia, look who the aggressors were.

    Europe and the world were not delighted with croatia and slovenias independance, i dont know why though. Thank god for germany, at least they acknowledged croatia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Danielk View Post
    Croatia and Slovenia wanted a peacefull secession from Yugoslavia, look who the aggressors were.

    Europe and the world were not delighted with croatia and slovenias independance, i dont know why though. Thank god for germany, at least they acknowledged croatia.
    Slovenia wasnt problem for Serbia. It was independent action of JNA in Slovenia.

    "In the meantime, the JNA's leadership sought permission to change the tempo of its operations. Defence Minister Veljko Kadijević informed the Yugoslav cabinet that the JNA's first plan - a limited operation to secure Slovenia's border crossings had failed, and that it was time to put into operation the backup plan of a full-scale invasion and imposition of military rule in Slovenia. However, the cabinet — headed at the time by Serbia's Borisav Jović — refused to authorise such an operation. The JNA Chief of Staff, General Blagoje Adzić, was furious and publicly denounced "the federal organs [which] continually hampered us, demanding negotiations while they [the Slovenians] were attacking us with all means."

    Croatia is something else. Wounds of WW2 was still fresh. Ghosts of children from Jasenovac, holes with Serb skeletons in Dalmacija etc, there were many people remember it. And what zou expected from Serbs in Croatia when thez hear from tribune in Sabor(croatian parliament) that moment is come to finish what Pavelic(Croatian nazi president in WW2) LAW OF THREE. One third of Serbs convert in Catholic, One third kill and one third exiled. Than in many part of Croatia croatian nazi simbol (U) was common graphite and posters with Pavelic picture also common. Of course in many parts of Croatia this things didnt happen but in other it did happen. And then Tudjman (president of Croatia) said for newspaper: "J am glad that my wife isnt Serb or Jew".
    I dont say it was smart what we did but emotions were stronger than mind and memories on WW2 play important role in feel of endanger in Serbs and to be worse Croatian nationalists only fuel this felling.

    P.S. Serbia support Serbs in Croatia and BiH but in smaller way than Croatia support Croatians in BiH. If I remember regular Croatian forces were in Bosnia, at begin of war they act as help to muslim forces but later they start war against muslims around Mostar and other places with Croatian population.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SRB View Post
    Croatia is something else. Wounds of WW2 was still fresh. Ghosts of children from Jasenovac, holes with Serb skeletons in Dalmacija etc, there were many people remember it.
    True but dont forget Serbia razed the beautiful Danube town of Vukovar to the ground, and Yugoslav military personnel shelled Dubrovnik - the Pearl of the Adriatic.

    Quote Originally Posted by SRB View Post
    And what zou expected from Serbs in Croatia when thez hear from tribune in Sabor(croatian parliament) that moment is come to finish what Pavelic(Croatian nazi president in WW2) LAW OF THREE. One third of Serbs convert in Catholic, One third kill and one third exiled. Than in many part of Croatia croatian nazi simbol (U) was common graphite and posters with Pavelic picture also common. Of course in many parts of Croatia this things didnt happen but in other it did happen. And then Tudjman (president of Croatia) said for newspaper: "J am glad that my wife isnt Serb or Jew".
    I dont say it was smart what we did but emotions were stronger than mind and memories on WW2 play important role in feel of endanger in Serbs and to
    be worse Croatian nationalists only fuel this felling.


    The Croatian War of Independence, while definitely a conflict fuelled by Croatian nationalism, was an outright clash with Serbian nationalism, most notably the Greater Serbian one.

    I forgot who but a senior Croat representative admitted that it was not only Slobodan Milosevic who provoked the Serb minority in Croatia to rebel, but that the Croatian leadership had goaded this minority too.

    I see this as a important step for croatia, after 10 years of silence.
    And believe me, i dont like Nationalists and Ultra-Nationalists.

    Quote Originally Posted by SRB View Post
    P.S. Serbia support Serbs in Croatia and BiH but in smaller way than Croatia support Croatians in BiH. If I remember regular Croatian forces were in Bosnia, at begin of war they act as help to muslim forces but later they start war against muslims around Mostar and other places with Croatian population.
    Croatia was the 1st country to recognise Bosnia and Herzegovina as a sovereign state, true we all !@#$%$ up bosnia.
    Serbia gave military and financial support to Serb forces in BiH, Croatia gave military support to Croat forces in BiH.
    Most Bosniaks and many Croats claim that the war was a war of aggression from Serbia.

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    Danielk:

    "True but dont forget Serbia razed the beautiful Danube town of Vukovar to the ground, and Yugoslav military personnel shelled Dubrovnik - the Pearl of the Adriatic."

    So you are comparing 1 MILLION Serbs slayed to one destroyed river...

    Who took down the icon of Mostar ? The famous old bridge which the town was named after ?
    Croatians.
    Want to keep playing this game ?

    You mention the "Greater Serbia" plan...What about Greater Croatia plan from the WW2 times drawn up by Hitler ? The same map was the goal to achieve during the Bosnian war. You even said yourself that Germany was the only one who supported the independent Croatia. So it wasnt "just a peacfull break off" from Yugo. Everyone wanted Bosnia and fought for it. There was no "defending from Serb aggression".

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