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Reply With QuoteWell you are my man. What do you call the house of Saud or Hosni Mubarak?Originally Posted by Confed999
Besides, they'd have to be a bit less tyrannical if they wanted in.
Where do you think the troops, money, and votes to go come from? The Sec. General?
No man is free until all men are free - John Hossack
I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry
Well you are my man. What do you call the house of Saud or Hosni Mubarak?
Besides, they'd have to be a bit less tyrannical if they wanted in.
Ok, no one with the power to stop it wanted to hear about Rwanda. You guys tried and I respect that but you didn't have the resources to stop the fighting or even slow it down. With a standing MNF there'd be a large pool of professional solders who could react a lot faster to a crisis and save a lot more lives, and it wouldn't just be Canadians.
And confed, that's where the troops would come from. 5% of each member's Military is quite a lot compared to the peacemeal peacekeeping forces around now.
An example everyone knows, in almost all of Europe, say the holocaust never happened. Say something bad about the recently dead. Teach your dog to give a Nazi salute. All could end you up in jail depending on your location. Then we get into conscription, how free is that?
No man is free until all men are free - John Hossack
I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry
Duh... Doesn't change a word of what I've said.
No man is free until all men are free - John Hossack
I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry
Free enough. The MNF could be strictly based on professional troops though. This is not about creating a libertarian federation of some sort, this is about creating a UN that would have less hypocracy and more power to act. That can't be a bad thing.
You've missed the friggin point. We DID NOT try. You actually think the entire Rwandan military can stand up to even 1 Canadian Battle Group. The point is that Canada is responsible. And we didn't care enough to try and stop them.
Chimo
ROTFL! Apparently China is free enough, heck, most of the world is. I don't see how this would be any different from the tyrant lovin' crap we already get from the UN. Waste of money and time.
No man is free until all men are free - John Hossack
I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry
This way it wouldn't be all up to you. The MNF would provide the pool of units that could be put together into a Task Force from multiple countries on short notice (because they are permanently committied except in a national emergency). The member states would already be paying for them to be active before the emergency came along, anyone who had a political conflict could have out but they'd have to make room for others to take their place. I figure this would be a lot more effective than having to raise the force from the ground up from 20 different contries who have nothing to gain from co-operating. It would no longer be up to individual nations to have to arrange the whole thing from scratch, they'd have the resources there and ready to deploy to the conflict zone and set up the safe areas and all that. Actual peacemaking would need all the diplomatic wrangling, although the inability of any single nation to veto it would make that a lot easier too. It wouldn't be Australia saving East Timor with some help from the UN, it would be the UN saving East Timor a lot faster with some help from Australia.
No they're not but I dont particularly feel like dealing with the consequences of isolating the PRC and I dont think you do either. They get off the hook because they'd be needed in. If anyone had any complaints they could direct it squarely to the Chinese government.
I want the bad guys isolated.
Well you just conveniently tossed all this out the window, "Member states must conform to mimum standards of human rights, democracy, international co-operation, responsible government and accountability to this 'New United Nations'. It's kinda like the EU with their membership requirements. In return the new member gets financial aid, military protection from wars of agression, trade benefits (this would also help loosen up trade and make it more fair) and co-operation with natural distaters, terrorist incidents and the like from the other member states." Plus you're now protecting China's tyranny with 5% of the rest of the world's troops. This idea is something to be fought, not embraced...
No man is free until all men are free - John Hossack
I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry
Then you can petition your government to place a motion to have the PRC suspended, isolated, blockaded and invaded to topple their nuclear weapon toting government if you think they've got the cojones. I suspect they don't.
This is about trying to make a UN that is more effective in today's world, not in the perfect world. This body would not be perfect, but it'd be better, and thats a freaking start.
Besides China would lose their single veto. They'd have to build up allies and get votes from other countries to block a US motion and vise-versa. If they wanted to stop something they'd need to get the numbers, forcing them to compromise with other countries and be a little less tyrannical, and thats a start.
Need more than one nation to do it, you would need a league of free nations, and all they would have to do to isolate China, and the rest of the bad guys, is to stop talking to them, or anyone who talked to them...
But what you've described is no better, it's actually worse, than the UN now. It would have actually put the world's troops in to defend Saddam.
It either stands for something, or it doesn't, and this doesn't even pretend to stand...
No man is free until all men are free - John Hossack
I agree completely with this Administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq-John Kerry
even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act-John Kerry
He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat-John Kerry
The first thing a detractor would say is you're making some kind of elitist club rather than a club for the common man. Accusations of racism would fly all over the place. Muslims would riot screaming you're declaring war on their culture. Poor nations would ask you to help them so they can actually join your club because otherwise, they'll be poor forever.
"Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.
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