some of my thoughts after this recent riot in China after death of a young girl

**~~hamurana~~** · 02 Jul 08,, 00:59

1. In many year to come, this kind riot will continue to happen, that will be more of the case on Internet.

2. The government has always been very clear in dealing with this kind social unrest, two handed approach, conduct investigation and control public opinion.

3. When dealing issues like these, it has to follow a series of law and constitutional process, for those who wish the central government to react as soon as the news were heard, and the alleged punished, that, i am afraid remains a wish.

4. Any government won't make this kind thing a focus point in any country, so the news control may decrease, but won't disappear, nor the control on public opinion.

5. The government just want to put an end to the riot, and make everyone go home. So regardless whatever the final outcome is, the official media won't make big news out of it.

6. It's inevitable to see some people with hot head to do something that's crossed the bottom line of the law, committing violence, they will definitely pay the price for what they did later on. Government never tolerate this kind behavior.

7. When see the news like this where the injustice is so obvious, you can pass the news around, let more people know, but don't be a sh-it stirrer, making lies and rumor out of the thin air is just as bad as those started violence. You could support the victims, but don't turn into violence, or you will be the one facing justice.

8. When you feel angry, you should understand there are many feeling the same as you, but there are also people who disagree with you. Don't be cynical, gloating is worse, you will only make yourself a hypocrite if you do.

9. Last, not least, don't expect any social change or revolution can change what happened in a day, that takes time.

**ying** · 02 Jul 08,, 02:22

My advice to you:

1. you’d better post your thread in Chinese boards rather than here. Majority Chinese do go to English board and the foreigners here do not care Chinese peasants. It’s really strange that you post your advice to Chinese in WAB.

2. No body like violence. But in Guizhou case, I cannot image what kind of action else those peasants may take since their daughter was raped and killed and her family members, including mother, grandfather, grandmother and uncle was beaten by the local police just because they went to the police office to ask for justice investigation. (reported by Hongkong media) Moreover, more people, mainly students, who went to street to show their support on the victim, were beaten by police. Moreover, the communication, including internet and telephone of this county was cut down by local government later. The government and police were supposed to protect citizen’s legal rights and security. But if it is government and police that infringe the rights of citizens, what should citizens do?

3. I remember you and other guys who study or live overseas had gone to street to crazily protect and shouted for the stupid Olympics Torch. But now, you guys who claimed yourself Chinese nationalists even lazy to give a **** to the tragedy of the girl. Even more, you become a gentleman and peace lover in a second and advice other Chinese should keep calm. The life of a girl and the basic civil rights of a Chinese citizen is just rubbish in your eyes. You may fight for Olympics Torch but you accuse us for our fighting for the constitutional rights.

Last word to you, freedom is never free. No body like violence. But if the violence becomes the only method a citizen may take to protect his constitutional rights in a society, it is the fault of the society not the person who resorts to violence.

**Zeng** · 02 Jul 08,, 03:49

I have read different versions of stories about this incident.

No matter which version of the story is true; the riot indicated that the local people are very angry with the local police and government; the riot indicates that the local people have lost their faith in the judiciary system.

I think that their angry and low faith to the judiciary system can be justified because our system does not give enough transparency the people deserved. I think that people should come out to protest if they don’t believe the case is properly investigated. But I don’t like the violence. Any violence should be punished.

Burning cars or damaging properties is definitely not good actions and deserves some punishment although violence may be hard to avoid in a protest of 10s of thousand people in today's China. Hurting people in the name of the protest should not be tolerated.

Censoring the information flow will only make the things worse. It seems that CCP did not learn its lesson from Tibetan riot. As long as CCP does not learn their lesson from their past mistakes, these kinds of protests will continue.

I personally witnessed a protest in China years ago. As Ying has pointed that the protest could not get permission. Therefore, the protest was an illegal protest, but the police did not intervene forcefully for that peaceful protest. The government finally made some correction.

**~~hamurana~~** · 02 Jul 08,, 03:58

Originally Posted by ying

My advice to you:

1. you’d better post your thread in Chinese boards rather than here. Majority Chinese do go to English board and the foreigners here do not care Chinese peasants. It’s really strange that you post your advice to Chinese in WAB.

2. No body like violence. But in Guizhou case, I cannot image what kind of action else those peasants may take since their daughter was raped and killed and her family members, including mother, grandfather, grandmother and uncle was beaten by the local police just because they went to the police office to ask for justice investigation. (reported by Hongkong media) Moreover, more people, mainly students, who went to street to show their support on the victim, were beaten by police. Moreover, the communication, including internet and telephone of this county was cut down by local government later. The government and police were supposed to protect citizen’s legal rights and security. But if it is government and police that infringe the rights of citizens, what should citizens do?

3. I remember you and other guys who study or live overseas had gone to street to crazily protect and shouted for the stupid Olympics Torch. But now, you guys who claimed yourself Chinese nationalists even lazy to give a **** to the tragedy of the girl. Even more, you become a gentleman and peace lover in a second and advice other Chinese should keep calm. The life of a girl and the basic civil rights of a Chinese citizen is just rubbish in your eyes. You may fight for Olympics Torch but you accuse us for our fighting for the constitutional rights.

Last word to you, freedom is never free. No body like violence. But if the violence becomes the only method a citizen may take to protect his constitutional rights in a society, it is the fault of the society not the person who resorts to violence.

1. How do you know I was giving advice to Chinese only? Violent riot can happen in any country, I was just giving my thoughts on this specific issue. Whether the foreigners care or not, the other related thread has shown, and I am afraid you have no say.

2. The post mortem result has confirmed the dead girl didn't engage any sexual activity before she died. That just raise doubts on how many other accusations could actually be fake. As I said, you can protest, but turn into violence, the fault is on you.

3. Sad to see this discussion turning into a rather nasty personal attack. How do you know I am not feeling sad for the dead? Come on, not that Olympic torch again. No, I didn't advice you to keep calm Ying, make sure you go home today and burn down the local police building so that you will have your justice.

4. For your last sentence, I can only laugh.

**ying** · 02 Jul 08,, 04:59

“the dead girl didn't engage any sexual activity before she died”
Who told you this “conclusion”? So far by now, we can only hear the voice and explanation of local government. No any voice from the family of the victim. This is a trial without transparency and due advocate. Who did beat the victim’s uncle? Why the local government agreed to pay 3k to the family if this is really a simple “suicide” case? (all of these information from the official press held by the local government yesterday. Since you trust official news, you must have known all these.)

Protest legally and peacefully in China? I guess you are not Chinese. Any protest without the prior permission of local police and government is “illegal” in China. This dispute is between peasants and local police and government, are you insane to accuse our peasants of failing get the permission??

Yes, you may laugh. And I think I know why. CCP will be over thrown and all corrupted officials who sent their children to study or live abroad will loss their heaven in China sooner or later.

**Ray** · 02 Jul 08,, 07:06

The newspapers here indicated that the rapists were sons of high officials. IIRC, one is the son of the Deputy Mayor.

No wonder the police did nothing and it is obvious that the post mortem would not mention any rape because that would mean a severe punishment for the sons as also huge disgrace to the parents who are high officials.

**Zeng** · 02 Jul 08,, 07:13

Originally Posted by Ray

The newspapers here indicated that the rapists were sons of high officials. IIRC, one is the son of the Deputy Mayor.

No wonder the police did nothing and it is obvious that the post mortem would not mention any rape because that would mean a severe punishment for the sons as also huge disgrace to the parents who are high officials.

That is one version of the story I read from Chinese websites. There are different versions of the story. I hope that your newpaper can show them all. I am not going to claim which verion is true yet.

**Nauticus** · 02 Jul 08,, 07:16

the girl's uncle is still alive

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**Ray** · 02 Jul 08,, 07:29

Originally Posted by Zeng

That is one version of the story I read from Chinese websites. There are different versions of the story. I hope that your newpaper can show them all. I am not going to claim which verion is true yet.

The newspaper I read had the news all tucked inside. Hardly made a ripple. More of a could know type of reporting and they have taken it so lightly that it did not even make the Online edition!!

But obviously, those children who have done it had to be bigwigs' children or else why attempt a cover up and also offer to pay a huge sum? I am sure this is not the only suicide in China and so the offer of such huge sum is indeed very suspicious in intent.

**~~hamurana~~** · 02 Jul 08,, 09:47

Originally Posted by ying

“the dead girl didn't engage any sexual activity before she died”
Who told you this “conclusion”? So far by now, we can only hear the voice and explanation of local government. No any voice from the family of the victim. This is a trial without transparency and due advocate. Who did beat the victim’s uncle? Why the local government agreed to pay 3k to the family if this is really a simple “suicide” case? (all of these information from the official press held by the local government yesterday. Since you trust official news, you must have known all these.)

Protest legally and peacefully in China? I guess you are not Chinese. Any protest without the prior permission of local police and government is “illegal” in China. This dispute is between peasants and local police and government, are you insane to accuse our peasants of failing get the permission??

Yes, you may laugh. And I think I know why. CCP will be over thrown and all corrupted officials who sent their children to study or live abroad will loss their heaven in China sooner or later.

1. well, I only draw my conclusion from the post mortem's result which confirmed the girl didn't engage any sexual activity, simple as that.

2. yeah, it's still unclear why the uncle was beaten, and why the compensation was offered, but the investigation is still in progress, isn't it? You just like to speculate don't you?

3. you guessed i am not a Chinese, I am afraid you are wrong again.

4. when you want to protest, or have large assembly of say 1000 people, of course you will need to get permission from local police. That's the law, and as far as I know, that's universal across the world.

5. for your last sentence, just make me laugh even more, ROFLMHO.

**~~hamurana~~** · 02 Jul 08,, 09:57

Originally Posted by Ray

The newspaper I read had the news all tucked inside. Hardly made a ripple. More of a could know type of reporting and they have taken it so lightly that it did not even make the Online edition!!

But obviously, those children who have done it had to be bigwigs' children or else why attempt a cover up and also offer to pay a huge sum? I am sure this is not the only suicide in China and so the offer of such huge sum is indeed very suspicious in intent.

the actual details of this incident is still unclear, but like you said, those suspicious compensation did rise questions. somehow, i felt there is more to it.

**ying** · 02 Jul 08,, 10:28

Since many facts are still in investigation, how comes your conclusion “the girl is not raped”? Where are the family members of the victim? Are they free to leave, to talk to the public and journalist? How can the police declare that this case is just suicide when many facts are still not unclear? No due procedure, how comes the truth? You are insane or just choose to believe what you want to believe?

Not all people who are born in China and have yellow skin and black eyes are Chinese. Some of them just give a bad name to Chinese.

**dave lukins** · 02 Jul 08,, 11:13

Originally Posted by ying

Since many facts are still in investigation, how comes your conclusion “the girl is not raped”? Where are the family members of the victim? Are they free to leave, to talk to the public and journalist? How can the police declare that this case is just suicide when many facts are still not unclear? No due procedure, how comes the truth? You are insane or just choose to believe what you want to believe?

Not all people who are born in China and have yellow skin and black eyes are Chinese. Some of them just give a bad name to Chinese.

From the same conclusion that "the girl was raped" Everyone should wait until the investigation, which because of world interest, will be taken out of local hands and prosecuted by higher officials, before "shouting" at each other on the WAB.

**~~hamurana~~** · 02 Jul 08,, 12:25

Originally Posted by ying

Since many facts are still in investigation, how comes your conclusion “the girl is not raped”? Where are the family members of the victim? Are they free to leave, to talk to the public and journalist? How can the police declare that this case is just suicide when many facts are still not unclear? No due procedure, how comes the truth? You are insane or just choose to believe what you want to believe?

Not all people who are born in China and have yellow skin and black eyes are Chinese. Some of them just give a bad name to Chinese.

Now i suspect do you even read my reply? The post mortem confirmed she didn't engage any sexual activity. Simple as that. Trying to burn down the local police building just to get your justice, who owns the insanity here? Angry youth?