Originally Posted by gunnut

Ah, excellent. I see your point.

Do you also support and justify plans to erase muslim cities from the map should a war break out between the west and the islamic world? Come on, both sides used to butcher people. Both sides used to burn enemy cities to the ground and then salt the earth just for the fun of it. We did that to Japan as recently as 1945 when we systematically torched Japanese cities to the ground one at a time. Death tolls of 100k in one night is not uncommon.

I always wondered why we took napalm out of service. It seems like a very nice weapon. Worthy of our human ancestors.

At least you hate commies as much as I do. That's always a plus in a man.

Originally Posted by astralis

zhang fei,



again, comparing the past with the present. one can fully acknowledge that china was an imperial power, but the point is- of all the victims of chinese aggression, whether it be the koreans, the vietnamese, the mongolians- why is current day anger in all of east asia directed at the japanese? chinese apologist? the people whom i used to argue with on CMF- perhaps the true apologists- would laugh their heads off, hearing that one.



and did he do it out of spite? out of revenge? out of a desire to so terrorize the chinese populace that he could loot and send the pickings of the loot back to another country? would you care to explain to me why huge portions of the KMT army ended up as the same army that fought the americans in the korean war?

"the japanese slaughtered soldiers and civilians in the aftermath of a major battle", huh? yes, quite true; they also slaughtered soldiers and civilians, too, in the absence of major battles. they massacred tens of thousands on taiwan; tens of millions of east asians forced into slave labor, either in their home country or shipped off to japan, and shot afterwards. even the worst mirror to this in chinese history, the stinking re-education camps of mao, most of the prisoners survived (one notable being deng xiaoping).

are you going to play the game of whom committed the worse atrocities?



most of the deaths attributed to mao were a combination of the retarded collectivization attempt (human-made crop failure) and natural crop failure. given that the death rate was made up of this, and considering that the area that mao ruled was- to put it mildly- considerably larger and more populated than what the japanese held, and considering the span of time- i would say that yes, the japanese did quite a good job of killing the chinese. germ warfare on unsuspecting chinese towns, yes? continued slaughter of chinese civilians and setting up of concentration camps, even inside wang chingwei puppet regime?

one of the japanese goals in china was to set up friendly puppet regimes that would be under the japanese political and economic orbit. however, among the kwangtung army, one of the goals was to quite literally "reduce the number of chinese on the ground", as a way to cut down the pool of chinese manpower, to terrorize the rest of the populace, and to more easily establish japanese economic control over the area.





ah, i see; so that explains why at the beginning of the civil war CKS had vastly more, better equipped, and better-trained men than the CCP; and why CKS lost despite receiving more military aid from the US in 1946-1947 than he received during the entirety of WWII.



also dramatically expanding literacy rates and improving health care, which CKS and the japanese singularly failed to do.



show evidence.



like i said, you seemed to miss out on 6/4 and most of the 80s.



uh...in china i almost AM a foreigner. my taiwanese-english accent on my mandarin easily differentiates me from your average chinese.

and in any case, in what country do you find people trusting foreigners more than their own countrymen, pray tell?



right, worship, when one leader of the CCP proclaims the big revolutionary daddy of them all to be 30% bad. but i see what you're getting at, and let me say- the reason why the CCP, despite all of its numerous faults, still has some semblance of legitimacy in china, is because the people view the CCP through a combination of indifference, and to the belief (especially in the countryside) that the CCP is better than the corrupt local bureaucrat whom drains them on an almost daily basis. THAT is why, and not because the chinese have some fetish for centralized oppression.

when you remove these two pegs of support- something that came very close to happening in the late 80s- then things are quite far from "worship" of the CCP.

Originally Posted by astralis

statisticians often use a problematic method by which they calculate what the population "should have" been given prior birth rates, and comparing it to the actual population (back then, and especially in china, not an exact science).

Originally Posted by astralis

again, please find some credible sources. most of the chinese deaths in mao's rule was through hunger, and not through violent means (IJA style).

Originally Posted by Zhang Fei

We burned Japan's cities down *before* they surrendered. The Japanese went after Chinese civilians before they surrendered. The Chinese Communists went after their own civilians *after* they had surrendered.

Originally Posted by Zhang Fei

I'm not interesting in fighting the Muslim world, and I doubt the Muslim world is interested in fighting us.

Originally Posted by Zhang Fei

Portions, perhaps a majority, of the Muslim world would like to see us erased from this earth. But we don't go after people for politically-incorrect thoughts - just for either financing or actively participating in terrorist attacks against us.

Originally Posted by Zhang Fei

If any government launched a war that killed tens of thousands of Americans, I would have no problem doing whatever it took to take that government down. Up to and including the use of nukes. Note that we firebombed Japan at a time when we had lost a mere tens of thousands of troops. By the time we nuked Japan, we had lost around 52,000 men in the Pacific theater, less than during the Vietnam War.

Originally Posted by Enzo Ferrari

Mao butched more Chinese than the IJA, enough said.

Originally Posted by gunnut

Bin Laden must had you in mind when he started his network.

Originally Posted by gunnut

He had much longer to do that than the Japanese did.

He was also not as methodical as the Japanese.

Originally Posted by gunnut

Bin Laden must had you in mind when he started his network.

Originally Posted by Zhang Fei

. The average Muslim doesn't have an issue with looting, rape or massacres.

Originally Posted by YellowFever

Being a Korean, I can't help but feel loathing and downright hate for the Japanese sometimes.

Having said that, I can't help but feel China is fueling more and more hate towards the Japanese just to keep the "bogeyman" alive just to serve their own purpose.