The Queen shakes hands with IRA leader

**tankie** · 27 Jun 12,, 18:39

I have very mixed feelings about this , I know the past is past and we must go forward but this rankles my mind , I lost friends there and her Maj lost Mountbatten to a bombing , P Phillip im glad turned his back on mcguinnes when he tried to speak to him , this action to shake the bastards hand must be gut wrenching for her , he will now be hated by republicans who will feel cheated and on other sites the Queen is not being the best of reviews by ex servicemen/women

Queen Meets Ex IRA Chief Martin McGuinness - Yahoo! News UK

**Officer of Engineers** · 27 Jun 12,, 18:47

That's why She is the Queen and we're not. We can afford to continue to hate forever. She does not have the luxury of putting her feelings before the good of Her People.

**Double Edge** · 27 Jun 12,, 18:59

Originally Posted by tankie

I have very mixed feelings about this

So will the other side.

Does this balance things out in favour of both ? ie win-win

**tankie** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:01

True Col , but she could have refused and left it to politico's to sort , thats why i said it must be gut wrenching for her to shake the hand of a bastard in charge of Murder .especially Louise M. Lets hope good comes from it , im doubtful as the bombs are starting now in Belfast from the republicans

**dave lukins** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:12

Originally Posted by Double Edge

So will the other side.

Does this balance things out in favour of both ? ie win-win

No. The other side are terrorist and the balance will never be in favour for both sides. IRA hardliners have already called him a traitor and condemmed the handshake. He, personally organised the murders of Soldiers and civilians and there is not one squaddie who served there who will forgive him for that. As Tankie has said there are ex Forces sites that are furious at the handshake and most of the comments are not for re-print. Can you ever imagine the President of India shaking hands with the person who organised the Mumbai Massacre if Pakistan and India ever became friends?

**tantalus** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:13

Originally Posted by tankie

Lets hope good comes from it , im doubtful as the bombs are starting now in Belfast from the republicans

There is no justice as it has been traded for peace. There is no doubt that alot of good has already come from the peace process, including gestures such as these. Even though a tiny minority continue to try to disrupt with violence, there can be no doubt that the peace process has already saved many lives and will continue to do so.

**Double Edge** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:23

Originally Posted by dave lukins

No. The other side are terrorist and the balance will never be in favour for both sides. IRA hardliners have already called him a traitor and condemmed the handshake.

Good IRA vs bad IRA

Your queen has split them further. Can we say the bad are fewer now than before.

Originally Posted by dave lukins

He, personally organised the murders of Soldiers and civilians and there is not one squaddie who served there who will forgive him for that. As Tankie has said there are ex Forces sites that are furious at the handshake and most of the comments are not for re-print.

Do veterans hold grudges against their counter parts from former wars or do they somehow make their peace.

Originally Posted by dave lukins

Can you ever imagine the President of India shaking hands with the person who organised the Mumbai Massacre if Pakistan and India ever became friends?

No i can't but look at the time frames.

There's been a lot progress since the good friday accords in '98. We are 14 years past that now.

**gunnut** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:24

Only Nixon can go to China.

Only the queen can shake hands.

Someone has to be the first to bear that burden.

**Officer of Engineers** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:25

Originally Posted by tankie

True Col , but she could have refused and left it to politico's to sort , thats why i said it must be gut wrenching for her to shake the hand of a bastard in charge of Murder .especially Louise M. Lets hope good comes from it , im doubtful as the bombs are starting now in Belfast from the republicans

No, she could not refuse. Not this late in the game. And it was the politicians who decided for her. Once Her Government decided on this peace process, she had no choice in the matter. She cannot go against her own government. She is much duty bound as any of Her Forces' Members. It was her duty to support the peace process and this gesture is part of it, as gut wrenching as it may be.

I will tell you another one of her duties - to take the insults from the uniformed membership. That too is the price of this peace that she must pay.

I do not envy her role one single bit.

**Officer of Engineers** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:27

Originally Posted by Double Edge

Do veterans hold grudges against their counter parts from former wars or do they somehow make their peace.

There is mostly tolerance. The best that is expected is that veterans don't pick up guns and start blasting each other off the streets. Anything above that is too much to ask for.

**Double Edge** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:32

Originally Posted by tantalus

There is no justice as it has been traded for peace.

This is the problem.

How do those involved & affected reconcile themselves with it.

Time.

**tankie** · 27 Jun 12,, 19:44

Originally Posted by Double Edge

Do veterans hold grudges against their counter parts from former wars or do they somehow make their peace.

This was not a war , it was/is civil disturbance , we were there to bolster the police force . I will not forget them hiding behind civvies , in their masks , no uniform , no ARMY .

Col , she played her part but she could still have refused , who is going to force/tell her to do something she didnt want to do ,whats the govt gonna do , chop off her head ?? she seemed happy enough to shake the twat's hand as her smile port-raid . His return smile was more of a smirk ,,,fkin gotchya

**Officer of Engineers** · 27 Jun 12,, 20:06

She is the Colonel-In-Chief of all of us. As such, she has a duty to obey her government as any in the Queen's Service. And she can be punished. Edward was relieved of his crown and Charles was relieved of his head

**tankie** · 27 Jun 12,, 20:22

Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers

She is the Colonel-In-Chief of all of us. As such, she has a duty to obey her government as any in the Queen's Service. And she can be punished. Edward was relieved of his crown and Charles was relieved of his head

Edward married a divorcee . and was hand in hand with Adolph , he had to abdicate for his marriage and being a nazi sympathiser , Charly got on the wrong side of olly cromwell a few years ago ,, hardly the same thing Sir as this scenario , but i do understand you

No'one would dare lift a finger to punish her , we can criticise and be pissed off with what has happened today , and i think i can safely say a shitload of people are pissed off , but harm ? no way , not the govt , they are gutless schoolboys when it comes down to it , and the Military would soon put a stop to that , even tho some are pissed at today , but one thing is ,,,,we are still LOYAL .

**dave lukins** · 27 Jun 12,, 22:21

Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers

I will tell you another one of her duties - to take the insults from the uniformed membership. That too is the price of this peace that she must pay.

I do not envy her role one single bit.

We swore an allegence to Her Majesty and may long she may reign, but to watch her shake hands with the killer of her subjects and expect them to remain stoic may be too much for some members of the Armed Forces who served and saw their comrades die and terribly injured. I sincerely hope that no uniformed members insult their Queen but expel their anger at the politics that made it possible.