Thread: 1421 & 1434 Columbus discovered America?

If this is about the China discovering America thing, I read up on this a while ago and remember that the theory was a real stretch and a half which was debunked. Unfortunately can't remember the exact site, but here is another quick google site.

Debunking Gavin Menzies

edit: don't know why I missed this one http://www.1421exposed.com/

Pretty sad reply.

Read the book, don't just jump on the defensive band-wagon. What's your opinion on the maps?

Open your eyes. Scared?

Ok - Here's the site; http://www.1421.tv/


Like I said - Read the book before you attempt to condem. What's your opinion on the maps?

Originally Posted by diablo49

If this is about the China discovering America thing, I read up on this a while ago and remember that the theory was a real stretch and a half which was debunked. Unfortunately can't remember the exact site, but here is another quick google site.

Debunking Gavin Menzies

edit: don't know why I missed this one The myth of Menzies' "1421 " exposed

You 'read up on this' Where? the two bollocks URL's you just pasted?

LMAO!

you mean maps like this one?

Gavin Menzies Maps | Chinese Treasure Fleets | Ancient Chinese maps | Chinese shipwreck junk | Chinese exploration maps | Caribbean shipwreck | Zheng He maps

Which is not, like the side seems to claim from 1418 but from 1763. Menzies claims that it is based upon a map from 1418, without offering proof. (And how could a map from 1418 show the new world in such detail if it was suppossed to be discovered 1421??).

Then there is the Pizzigano map..a map from Italy that he claims proves that China discovered America. I don't even know how to refute that, since I can't find any logic, nevermind how twisted in this statement. Further the map does not shot the Americas, but only several Islands. Menzies claims these are Caribbean islands, despite them not being in the right location for this. Also you can find one Pizzigano map the Island of Antillia. In case you have never heard of this Island..that is because it does not exist except in legends.

In Summary, this guy uses a map from Italy, that shows fictional Islands, to proof that China discovered America...

Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen

you mean maps like this one?

Gavin Menzies Maps | Chinese Treasure Fleets | Ancient Chinese maps | Chinese shipwreck junk | Chinese exploration maps | Caribbean shipwreck | Zheng He maps

Which is not, like the side seems to claim from 1418 but from 1763. Menzies claims that it is based upon a map from 1418, without offering proof. (And how could a map from 1418 show the new world in such detail if it was suppossed to be discovered 1421??).

Then there is the Pizzigano map..a map from Italy that he claims proves that China discovered America. I don't even know how to refute that, since I can't find any logic, nevermind how twisted in this statement. Further the map does not shot the Americas, but only several Islands. Menzies claims these are Caribbean islands, despite them not being in the right location for this. Also you can find one Pizzigano map the Island of Antillia. In case you have never heard of this Island..that is because it does not exist except in legends.

In Summary, this guy uses a map from Italy, that shows fictional Islands, to proof that China discovered America...

Clearly you are quoting from the web. - Tarek, go away and buy/read the book then come back.

Antillia is Guadalupe. As I said before you are not in a position to make derogatory comments until you. You have read the material in question.

Is that not sound logic to base an opinion on?

You asked for opinions and told me to look at the map. I did both and gave ARGUMENTS why I believe the claim is bogus. You did nothing of the sort and have failed to address any point raised.

If you don't to hear the opinion of others don't ask for them

ah and Guadalupe Island? The Island on the map is not even near that place..

Originally Posted by Tarek Morgen

ah and Guadalupe Island? The Island on the map is not even near that place..

What? do you think they had GPS?....... use your head. (Menzies himself was a Navigation officer on one of H.M. Submarines for 4 years before he got his own Command - He explains the Navigational anomalies on the maps)


You are still gibbering here, with out having read the material in question.

This is not about a single map, - Go to the web site - Take what material is actually being spoken about in the book - Then do your own research if needs be.

Sorry -But I hold the work research objective opinion of an Ex submarine Commander who knows the real world, in far higher regard than anybody who gleans info from the net, and takes it as Gospel.


Your signature phrase is very apt BTW

A couple of things for sure.

Zheng He never saw Aztec or Mayan gold and the 1st Nations never smelled a Chinese germ.

Originally Posted by Oscar

Thats an hoax, debunked a long time ago.

Simon Jenkins: Of course the Chinese didn't discover America. | World news | The Guardian

Who wrote your signature?

None of you have actually read the books in question, or the references contained therein.


Jesus, even OoE.


This is the last post from me on this, - READ THE BOOKS!

Stop posting internet crap as a response.

Oh' aye - That's passed ma 100th post BTW.

Originally Posted by DragoonGuard

Jesus, even OoE.

What I am trying to tell you is that Zheng Hi's contact with the new world was absolutely minimal and certainly would not have explored the interior of the Americas which is the only way the map could have been made, ie having explored it in person.

He never brought home Aztec or Mayan gold but he did bring home African gold. And if he did visit the interior, he would have spread plague much like the Spaniards did centuries later.

Most certainly, his ships were full of rats, themselves were germ carriers. So, even if Zheng He did not visit the interior, his rats would have done the deed all the same.

Contact between the Old World and the New World was a disaster for the people of the New World. The best example that Zheng He did not visit the new world is that no one blames him for the die off when the Spaniards came.